Schools responsibility to more able children

[Rainyrunway]

I have twin DC aged 8. Both are working above the expected level across the board academically according to their teachers. What can I reasonably expect the school to do to accommodate this?
1 isn't too bothered, but the other absolutely hates school because they find it boring. Says the work is constantly repeated and they spend ages going over the same stuff.
This is absolutely not meant as a stealth brag, but I just want them to get back to enjoying school, without a fight for them to go in every day.
I always explain to DC that just because they find maths (for example) easy that doesn't mean everyone else does. In the same way as some kids are amazing at gymnastics while my DC can barely to a forward roll. They do understand this and don't show off as far as I can tell.
But I want them to enjoy school. I want to have a chat with the teacher but I don't want to be unreasonable, as I know she has a lot to deal with and kids with much bigger problems. So how can I address it? I know the school have additional work that can be done at home but this doesn't solve the issue really. It's while they're in the classroom that they're not being challenged at all.
I'm worried that not only are they not fulfilling their potential (either child) at least one is likely to completely switch off if the problem isn't addressed as they no longer enjoy going in at all. We have had school refusals and tummy aches and the like, and I think it's all related.

I think even if they would just be allowed to quietly read a book (on topic or not - whatever the teacher seems appropriate) while the class goes over stuff again and again it would help I think. Would that be a reasonable ask?

I mean, we don't really know whether OP really has a firm grasp on her children's intelligence. I've been told a few times that little Timmy is actually a genius and he's bored which is why he's not producing his best work - whereas little Timmy is, in reality, totally average and struggles to keep up at times.

OP, I'm not trying to suggest that you are delusional but it might be a good idea to have a discussion about their attainment and quality of their work before you launch into questioning why they aren't being pushed harder.

There’s lots of reasons why the lesson could be boring other than just ability though. They do go over and over things adding a bit more each time, that’s just how the curriculum works. Not all teachers make learning interesting. You need to ask what extension tasks they are giving.

please would teachers stop using ‘SEND’ as a euphemism for Not very bright. Many ‘SEN’ have no effect on intelligence at all, in fact many of those kids are more intelligent than average. It’s pervasive and leads to low expectations, especially at primary school.

@Quinoawoman I am basing it on what the teachers have told me in parent teacher meetings and school reports and what my DC are telling me. NOT my own observations.

Yes I agree - it should come before the pointless paperwork but head teachers and SLT don't often see it like that, do they? And if you've been out of teaching a few years then you might not be fully aware of how things have changed quite markedly recently - see my previous comment for details.

I think it's really harmful to the profession to suggest that teachers should just work crazy hours and get over it, or leave - who do you think is going to be left in the profession after a few years?

School teachers usually do have extension work for the more able, dcs primary school and secondary school teachers have always provided this. Are you sure the teacher isn’t doing it already?

@BungleandGeorge where has anyone said that SEND = not very bright?

What a ridiculous statement!
A burnt-out teacher is an unproductive teacher. We are not in the job to pander to certain parents who think unless we work 100 hours a week we’re crap at our job.
And I’ve yet to come across a teacher who doesn’t include challenge in their lessons. I have, however, come across many children who say the work is boring and their parents think teachers don't challenge them - many of these children are average at best.

Unfortunately teachers just don't have the time or resources to teach to both ends of the ability levels. What time they have is rightly focused on those who are struggling.

They should be able to stretch the top end of the class but I have sympathy with teachers in the current climate.

When my 2 were in primary I used to volunteer once a week and the yr 6 teacher soon realised I liked Maths and set me up doing an intervention session for the higher ability kids but if I wasn't there it wouldn't happen as there were no other resources and this was before Covid so it will be much worse now.

As much as our education system is failing to properly cope with those who need extra help it is also massively failing the higher ability kids.

I am NOT suggesting teachers work those hours at all! It’s just what the job is these days and if you aren’t happily teaching then get out of the profession! Anybody going into teaching is warned of workload. I left teaching at Christmas. The job wasn’t like that when I started when I was 21 but the work load has spiralled out of control. No way would I go into teaching these days. It’s a choice. If you aren’t happy then leave. The government are at fault for the unrealistic expectations. If you want to be a teacher though, the actual planning and teaching for ALL children comes first. That’s a teachers duty and if they aren’t challenging pupils then that’s a massive concern. This is why OP should speak to the teacher.

@Soontobe60 if this quote was meant to be about me I don't think it's fair
"I have, however, come across many children who say the work is boring and their parents think teachers don't challenge them - many of these children are average at best"
I love my DCs teacher. She is kind and caring and great with the children day to day. It's not her or teachers generally that I'm asking about. More about whether there is something in particular I could ask the school for that would be a reasonable request. Schools spend a lot of time (understandably) catering to the needs of the kids who are struggling because they are falling behind, is there anything that they can do to help out the ones who are finding the work unchallenging and boring? ALL children should have the chance to find school enjoyable.
I did expect some comments along the lines of this one though. It is AIBU after all.

I feel like it is a special educational need in a way

It really isn't. I agree that all children deserve to be challenged, and I'm sorry that your DC isn’t enjoying school but this is just offensive.

Even before 2010, unfortunately the vast majority of schools (former primary supply teacher) ime were only able to pay lip-service to stretching and challenging more able pupils.

You can certainly see why it is even further down the list as a priority nowadays.

I don't know what the answer is really, as it's not fair to expect teachers to provide what the children really need without the resources, but I can certainly empathise with your concerns as a parent too.

Why is it offensive @neverbeenskiing? It isn't meant to be. Just that kids who are more able have a different need educationally? Maybe not at my kids level I guess but surely it is true for the kids who are way ahead at least?

Good luck. My ds is way ahead in maths and science. He was bored stupid for the last two years of primary because the teachers focused on getting all children through SATs and didn't have any time for the more capable dcs. By the end of yr 6 he was a very angry fed-up child.

He's at a small independent now and is a different boy. Happy, confident, settled.

Maybe a 'different need' rather than a special need but equally important, and damaging if not dealt with.

Turning a child off school in KS2 is going to lead to a lot of problems.

@Lostmum2407 'No way would I go into teaching these days. It’s a choice. If you aren’t happy then leave.'

Well, you basically are saying 'if you don't want to work 100 hours a week then leave'. I repeat: who is going to be left to do the job then?

Is moving them to a local grammar school (when they’re the right age) an option? I’d get a tutor at home once a week to do harder work with them for now.

@Rainyrunway I do sympathise with you and your kids. After all, I am totally bored as a teacher so I get that they would be bored. Any teacher would be gutted to find that the kids in their class felt that way, but they might not have the support or the time left in the day to do much about it. Ultimately, if it's a choice between planning a totally different alternative activity for the child with autism to avoid a day-ruining meltdown or thinking up an extension activity for your kids, the teacher would be daft not to go with the first option because that affects everyone's learning. If it's a choice between working with the kids that can't read yet or working with the kids that could be extended, I choose the first one because ultimately, their life choices are ruined unless they learn to read. Honestly, your kids are just not going to be the priority and that does suck, but I bet you wouldn't have them swap lives with those other kids in a million years.

I actually love your suggestion of letting them read when they're finished. Sounds like a win-win to me.

I sent my academically bright DC to an academic school that pushes him. He's no longer bored! But I appreciate that it's not always possible to do that. If you can though, that's what I'd do.

That’s the governments problem. They’ve created it so they need to fix it. There’s no way I was going to stay in a job working 100 hour weeks when I can earn three times that. My management experience came in handy for obtaining a job where I’m appreciated and not taken advantage of. The more experienced you get in teaching, the more responsibilities, hence workload. The pay increase that comes with experience is not worth the money. Maybe if there were teacher strikes about workload instead of pay then the government would listen. There’s no point moaning if you aren’t going to do something about it. Either leave or stand up to the government. By continuing to work in the job is telling the government that you are happy doing it. And by moaning about it it’s not doing your mental health any good.

It's around 25 years ago now 😱but when I was in primary school two of the schools I went to sent a couple of us into the year above's class for English and maths, and one school moved a few of us into the year above halfway through the year. The other primary school gave the more able kids the same topic but harder questions, then let us read when we were done. I don't know which approach was better. I probably enjoyed reading most and I think that was important for learning, critical thinking and enjoying school. I definitely recommend letting your kid loose in the local library (including the adult section) rather than the school library which is less likely to have more challenging books and books on topics they are particularly interested in.

If your child is more able, I think going to a secondary school with similarly able kids is important (either selective or with sets).

If you've bothered to read my previous posts, you'll see that I AM leaving. However, I'm not going to make ridiculous comments like 'that's why they work 100 hour weeks' about my former colleagues as if that's fine and they should.
As an ex teacher, you will also know that we are only allowed to strike about pay, although the NEU have included workload pressures in their communications to parents and governors.
And what have you done about it apart from leave everyone else to it? Have you written to your MP about teacher workload?

I think the thing to do is just make the teacher aware of what your DC say about repetition and boring and how it is beginning to be a struggle to get one of them to go to school. The teacher seems caring and supportive from what you have said and will hopefully take it on board. There are more challenging maths activities available (NRICH etc) and she may be able to give them additional "project" work without too much extra work on her part. The key thing is to make her aware.

My grandson is in the same predicament and has been for a long time. The school seem unable to address his/others similar issues and he now really hates school, despite being a fairly popular kid. It's a shame.