Why so much fuss over Stella Braverman?

[lastminutepanicking]

I’m just wondering who on earth cares? Can’t understand why this is such big news.

Can we be sure she is even devoting her and the departments time to Rwanda?

The impression I have had this week is that she and the department spend a lot of time trying to avoid the consequences of the Home Secretaries criminality.

I guess because she’s busy - is asking a question such a heinous crime?

Maybe start a thread about it?

Pretty irrelevant whataboutery on this one

Are you a Civil Servant?

There are strict rules on how Ministers and Civil Servants operate. The codes are not complicated and they are a big deal.

Without the Ministerial Code and Civil Service Code, there would be accusations of impartiality, secrecy, inappropriate use of taxpayers money, inappropriate use of Government resources etc.

There is no heirachy or different levels of what is trivial and what isn't.
It is a blanket rule that Minister cannot ask Civil Servants to use thier official duties for private matters.

Ministers asking Civil Servants questions for personal purposes, regardless of what is being asked, is not appropriate and is breaching Ministerial Code

Remind me which minister is responsible for the passport office?

Busy - and wealthy enough to engage a personal/home PA or a solicitor to answer her questions

Can't stand the woman but I think that has something to do with the fuss now being made. It's not entirely clear she did break the code this time though.

There's a whole host of difference between asking officials if it's possible to do driver education privately and being told no and trying to persuade or strong arm officials to get her special treatment. If it was clear cut I think the Ethics Adviser would have advised the PM that yesterday and she'd be out. Sunak must be dying to get rid of her given her promotion of non government and extreme policies to the right wing faithful.

'do you have a complete list of laws it is acceptable to break if one is busy?'

You misunderstand as usual, I said it's ok to ask juniors to see if a 1 to 1 was available if one is busy with Home Sec matters.

Roll up roll up! any more spads/civil servants going to give their 2 penneth worth?! <wonder why they aren't at work >

Jgw1 if a Minister was held responsible for the incompetence of a staff member we would have a new Health Secretary daily.

Yes, or she could have asked her constituency office staff.

"You misunderstand as usual, I said it's ok to ask juniors to see if a 1 to 1 was available if one is busy with Home Sec matters."

So why did the Government's own Ethics & Propriety Team advise staff that it was a personal matter and the request was a breach of Ministerial & Civil service Codes?

I am a retired civil servant. Thank fuck.😊

You misunderstand as usual, I said it's ok to ask juniors to see if a 1 to 1 was available if one is busy with Home Sec matters

Not if you’ve agreed to specific conditions stating that you won’t use CS for personal matters. It’s really very simple, certainly a minister should be expected to be able to grasp the concept.

Can't stand the woman but I think that has something to do with the fuss now being made. It's not entirely clear she did break the code this time though

The need to use the phrase ‘this time’ is precisely why it’s a fuss.

Andy Burnham
Justin Welby
Tom Tugenhat
Robert Jenrick
They all just got on with it and faced the consequences

Andy Burnham 'taking it on the chin' like a real man;
Mr Burnham spoke out about the incident during a BBC Radio Manchester phone-in hosted by Mike Sweeney after a caller, John from Denton, said he had been 'a bit disappointed' when he read about the speeding offence.
Mr Burnham said: "I have held my hands up. Let me just tell you how it happened. This is a route I have taken all my life by the way, driving in and out of Manchester going home. I was going down the M62 and it was nine-ish in a night in the middle of the summer last year and I was going towards the bit where you peel off to the M6. And I then go north to the bit of Wigan where I live.
"And what happened, I'm just going to give people the full explanation so everybody knows and make your own judgments. What happened was the M6 was closed, you know when they close the junction at short notice later at night. But it hadn't been advertised at any point down the rest of the M62."
When Mr Sweeney said he had 'caught in that myself', the mayor continued: "It does happen, doesn't it? So I was in that situation and I had to re-route straight away in my mind, like am I going M6 south here because you could have gone that way or am I going to go M62 carry on to Winwick? I know this area well and I was just making that judgment, and in a split second I was right we'll go to Winwick.
"And then I had to look at the right hand side of the motorway because I had to then join the traffic that was still on the M62 and not peeling off and I had to go back into that traffic. So I was looking right and obviously you have to drive a bit faster to get into that traffic."
The mayor laughed as he said: "You're getting the full excuse here, but this is the truth."
When Mr Sweeney suggested 'some might call it waffling', Mr Burnham went on: "I'm just giving you what happened. And in that moment a flash goes off and [I] didn't get anything for five months, five months and 29 days until a letter arrives and it said 78 in a 40.
"And I was like 40?! What? 40? I wasn't on a local road. I was on the M62 near the M6. And I can only say to you John, and either you believe this or you don't believe it, but I can only say to you that is what happened.
"Was I going too fast? Yes. So no complaints. Should I probably have had a more normal fixed penalty? Probably, but I still say I had to speed up a bit to join the traffic on the far side of the motorway. I won't argue about that... Do I feel a little aggrieved about the smart motorway and the way it's operating? Well, definitely. I think the smart motorway on the M62 is trapping a lot of people unfairly.
"And honestly Mike, I believe that."

“If I had been aware, I would not have been travelling at that speed. That said, I acknowledge that, at 78 mph, I was going too fast and accept the court’s decision.”

https://www.manchestereveningnews.co.uk/news/greater-manchester-news/andy-burnham-slapped-hefty-fine-26556762

I'd call that "taking it on the chin". He attended court to be given his fine and points.

Jenrick was also caught speeding in a temporary 40 mph zone on a motorway. His case was dealt with through procedure which allows a magistrate to rule on criminal cases seen as minor in a closed court, meaning the public and press cannot attend, and Jenrick himself did not have to attend to get his fine and driving ban.

Are you really sure that it is me misunderstanding?

The Health Secretary is responsible for passports?

Clavinova is the mistress of the false equivalence. Andy Burnham expressed unhappiness at the situation. That's fine; you can agree or not (I don't). He did not get a member of staff to lie for him. He did not try for a private speed awareness course. He paid up. What Braverman did was completely different - but clearly fine because she's a Tory.

No but the Health Secretary is responsible for the NHS and thank goodness nobody holds them responsible for the actions of each and every NHS staff member.

The Home Secretary is responsible for the Passport Office and it is not whataboutery to point out the recent grotesque incompetence of passport office staff in issuing fraudulent passports to large numbers of criminals and contrasting the treatment of these staff in the media with the treatment of the Home Secretary for asking a question.

And now we find out she's got undisclosed connections to people benefiting from the Rwandan scheme. Who'd a thunk it!

Bent as a nine bob note.

https://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/suella-braverman-rwanda-ministerial-code-b2343646.html

Since 2012 Health ministers have not been responsible for the general running of the NHS - that's down to NHS England. Health ministers only responsible for political decisions

Your second paragraph is the very definition of whataboutery

Look! A squirrel!

And if our resident Tory arselicker bothered to look at timestamps on posts, they'd might have worked out that my earlier comments were made pre-starting work, and I'm currently on my lunch break.

The evidence she holds the ministerial code contemptuously just keeps mounting.

Ms Braverman did not officially disclose her previous links to the country when appointed home secretary in 2022, despite the deal being a lynchpin of the government’s migration policy and ongoing legal challenges alleging politically-driven human rights violations including torture, murder and kidnappings.

And there you have it. 'Nuff said. The usual sleaze we've come to expect from this party