To think this is an awful way to treat teenagers - sports teams

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I have just had 16 year old ds in tears as he has spent the day, pretty much the whole day, with his cricket team and didn't bowl or bat the whole entire time. Apparently he fielded in a crap position too (can't remember the term he used because cricket is full of fucking stupid terms no one understands) and feels like he may as well not have been there. He's never been much of a crier and it has been heart-breaking to see him so upset and now I'm really fucking angry.

I completely understand that if others are better than him they're going to get more overs or whatever. I'm not suggesting he should have a turn at opening the batting. But would it really be such a fucking disaster for this fourth team if someone not quite as good as someone else who's probably not all that bowled a couple of overs?? Really? Would the earth stop turning if that happened? He says he played well last week and took a wicket so why nothing this week?

AIBU to think this is really shitty, especially with 16 year olds? DS has had exams all week and looked forward to this as a break and now it has left him feeling shit. Thank fuck his exams went well others god knows what state he would be in. If anyone/anyone's dh captains a team of this sort and can explain to me why this is any way ok I'd love to hear it. At least this match was only a 20 minute drive away. We've had it in the past where we've driven well over an hour for similar to happen. I wish ex had never got him in to cricket (just to take little to no interest in how he does for most of the time).

This sounds like people questioned whether 'this is the way Cricket is though' this principle is one of the ten commandments don't you know🙄

It isn't just Cricket though, it is that extra level of inaccessibility due to the elite nature of it but all popular team sports are inaccessible past 11 as the mindset is one that is reflected on here, you have to be the best to take part and tough shit if you are not, move on and go and play table tennis or netbal

That's a different conversation, I suppose. People who play in teams generally want to win and need to choose the best team to win.

I agree that playing sport for fun, exercise, team work is also a good thing. Winning or losing shouldn't matter. But that's a mindset.

I remember learning to row at a rowing club - as an adult - and the instructor was yelling at me for not going fast enough. Honestly, I just wanted to row on the river without wanting to win. Just to exercise. I don't think a team would have wanted me.

This very much depends though. Most adult cricketers playing at a reasonable level will be batsman or bowlers mostly, most teams will only have 1 or 2 true all rounders.

You would usually expect to be one or the other but on occasions being a batsman you may end up not batting at all so therefore probably not bowling either. I have seen some games where batsman 1 and 2 play the whole match so high order batsman don't get a chance.

That said, if someone is managing a 4th team and has included a 16 yo then they should still be developing them and should ensure they get a game. If they can't do this then they needed to ensure they discuss this with the child first so they are fully aware of the situation. A good club/manager would always do this. 16 is not an adult and in cricket terms 16 is a long way off fully developed.

My DH is not particularly specialist in either batting or bowling, he doesn't bowl ever and often bats low order if there are several colts needing more of a game but as a 50+ yo man he understands this. I would not expect a 16 yo to only field in a 40 over game unless they are specifically told this may happen beforehand.

My two have played cricket since they were 5. They have covered all variations of your post over the years. Don't get to bat, don't get to bowl, not in their preferred fielding spot, stomping off in disgust when they didn't agree with the umpire, tearful and embarrassed if they were out for a duck - yes even at 16! On the plus side they've also been amazing, top scorers, top wicket takers, fielding slip (best spot apparantly), happy and delighted when they've done well.

They are now in their 20s. Yesterday my youngest played for the first team, was out on the boundary for fielding, 7th in batting order so didn't get to bat, and isn't a bowler so didn't get to bowl. They won, he was happy, but he said it was, for him, a pretty boring 50 over match.

My oldest played yesterday for the second team. He bowled 5 overs, took 3 wickets, 6th in batting order but got to bat as the others were out fairly quickly, highest scorer of the match, fielded slip. They lost so he wasn't happy but, for him, it was a good game because he was fully involved.

Next week could be entirely different for them both. The week after will be different again. They've both played for the 3rd and 4th teams in the past. That's the game. It is is frustrating but they play because they love cricket. And, whilst the personal achievements are what they crave, it's a team game and everyone on the pitch needs to be there to make it happen even when it's long and boring. We have tons of trophies from best batsman, best bowler, best newcomer, and the 'consolation' ones of players choice or coaches choice.

Unless you are exceptional at batting and/or bowling that will always be the nature of the game. DS1 had a period from 14-17 where he was opening batsman and top bowler, he couldn't put a foot wrong. Now he's still good but less immersed in it.

Teams play to win. A 40/50 over match can be 6hrs + long. Your son needs to decide why he's playing and if it's the sport for him. Hours on the boundary with little to do except watch others being in on the action isn't for everyone.

It's not the case that team sport for teenagers is just about winning in Scandinavian countries though, why does it have to be about just the best teenagers playing on this country. It is not really a different conversation as if you want things to change where do you start, when do you start challenging the status quo. The OP has questioned this and has been accused of being the worst thing of all 'a SAHM to teenagers' and no I am not one so no offense taken on my part, not being a 'Cricket Mum' (whatever the fuck that is) obviously some false pride going on there and that she has a chip on her shoulder, what? for questioning the absurdity of it all and for challenging the status quo.

This is 100% normal, same for my two. We have had many upset conversations over the years and I have told them that's how it goes and there's always next week. My eldest has played adult cricket since he was 13, his first full year he was leading wicket taker in the team and 3rd in the whole adult league, he was playing County, colts and in 2 adult teams so had so much match time and training. Once he finished colts he isn't quite so good as plays a lot less and has other commitments so understands it won't quite go his way as often. My 15 yo doesn't play yet as he has no interest in playing a 6/7 hr match right now.

However, from how I read it we are talking about this lads first adult match, I would expect the coaches/captain to manage this better and him get some sort of opportunity or at least be pre warned he may not this time.

Both mine play cricket and my DH helps manage one of the age group teams so I know about all the politics and batting and bowling orders etc. I really feel for your DS. Fair enough if the team was a strong one and known good bowlers were taking precedence, but if there really isn’t much in it, and the bowlers there weren’t doing a great job anyway, the captain should have considered those other bowlers who weren’t higher up the batting order.
I’m not entirely sure if his team is a fully kids one or mixed kids and adults, but one thing we’ve found is as the age groups get older, often the batters / bowlers are chosen by the captain who is going to be one of the kids, rather than an adult, and they’re less good at remembering to put the quieter members in and more easily capitulate to noisy parents. Though adults can do that too!

Can your son advocate a bit more for himself? Speak to the captain / coach and say “please can I have some more overs in the next match?” Loads of the other kids will be doing this. I’ve got a pretty quiet DS who is often in the situation you describe and he finds that although he is a gigantic introvert, it helps when he speaks up for himself. People need a nudge.

I do also get the private schools frustration - the reality is that the gulf between cricket teaching / facilities at private schools and those who are at state schools and “just” do club cricket is vast, and hard to manage. Our club is very inclusive and works hard to make space for all, and advertises / runs lots of additional coaching programs for state school kids. But those private school kids just want to play cricket as well - they’re just kids playing the sport they love. And luckily for our team, they and their families are great and v supportive of the club and help with coaching too.

Doesn't bowling depend a bit on the other team's style? If their batters clearly struggle with slow bowling, then the captain is going to put the slow bowlers on, because it would be daft to put on a bowler that they will just be hitting sixes off. So the bowler who does well in one match may well never get off the bench in the next one.

Also, if you love cricket you need to remember the importance of fielding. I always remember the scene in Forest's "A Cricket Term" where it is pointed out to the heroine that fielding can be what wins a match, hence she makes her team practise it rigorously and they are very successful in cutting down the other sides' opportunities for taking runs; and in the final she is inspired by Mr Tallboy in "Murder Must Advertise" and takes the last wicket by an inspired throw at the stumps from out in the field.

However, from how I read it we are talking about this lads first adult match, I would expect the coaches/captain to manage this better and him get some sort of opportunity or at least be pre warned he may not this time

He won't just have started cricket though with his first adult match. My two have been in that same position many times since they started youth cricket at 11. There must have been other matches with similar outcomes.

Golden bear, but we are not in a Scandinavian country. Cricket is a very British game and we introduced it to the commonwealth. If a 16 year old wants to be selected to bowl, as OP's son does he probably needs some 1-1 coaching sessions to improve. My son has had loads over the years, as well as club group training. It's about £40 an hour. It's like music if you want to get good you have to put the practice in. My son used to play for a small village team that was very friendly and had the 'everyone will have a turn attitude' in the second team. The thing is by not playing out their best batters and bowlers they rarely won. My son got frustrated when some poor bowlers would go for over 20 runs an over, when they had good bowlers who would keep the run rate down taken off to let poor bowlers have a turn. He left and joined a very competitive club. He started in their fourths but is now playing in the third team of this club but even the third team are in a much higher division than the seconds at his previous club. He likes to bowl against better batters and his game is improving. He hopes to be promoted up to the seconds by the end of the season. He wants to play for the first team as they are in the Premier League. He knows his ability and performance will determine how successful he is. He wouldn't be crying he would be out there doing more practice and asking me to book him some more 1-1 sessions. I think OP's son was probably upset and stressed after a week of solid GCSE exams.

I think it was an 'in education team' so university age to last couple of years at school but basically a team for young people who didn't make the first two teams that were serious and did the full batting orders etc. It might well have been classified as junior or non full adult, not sure. But it worked and the good players left for better teams and the rest just kept together. What team would a 16 year old be playing in as per OP?

This has got to be a joke, surely.

But reading TFT it seems everyone needs to find the club and team that is best for them. From absolutely focused on winning and improvement, or more participatory and focused on enjoyment. I suppose the issue is when your friends are in one type and you are more suitable to another type.
Our son was not very good at football but loved playing in the team and being a part of it. Always on bench but at least with football he got on to play if they were 3.0 up, with 10 minutes to go. Cricket doesn't lend itself to that, unfortunately

Most people on this thread seem to be ignoring/not understanding that this is the FOURTH 11s and the boy is 16. A decent captain would not allow them to become demoralised like this, they'd make sure a youngster was involved in the game.

So he’s a bowler? By 16 they are all pretty settled into their talents - batting, bowling or all-rounder (both). Is he a spin or pace bowler? That will also make a difference because depending on the opposition and the conditions they might choose to use more pace or more spin.

I would suggest you try to learn a bit more about the game as that will help you to support him better. I watch cricket with my DS15 and ask lots of questions and it’s quite a good bonding experience for us. Cricket is a great game and has provided DS with some lovely friendships. And also some moments of great frustration and upset for him! But overall it has been a positive experience. We are in Australia and my English DH finds cricket to be far less class-based here than the UK where he says it’s really dominated by elite schools. In Australia kids tend to play for local clubs that bring together kids from lots of different schools - both state and private.

Generally it’s up to the captain to decide the bowling order and set the field. It can absolutely happen that a player doesn’t get to bat or bowl one game because their team doesn’t lose all their wickets and then they bowl out the opposition cheaply so bowlers who were going to come in further down the order don’t get their chance. My DH is a coach and he wouldn’t allow a player to be in that position for more than a week. It helps that our DS is the captain so he just tells him that X needs to bowl in the early overs or get moved higher up the batting order.

But I really think it would be helpful if you got a bit more interested in the sport just so you can understand it. It sounds like your DS loves the game and doesn’t want to give it up.

I always remember the scene in Forest's "A Cricket Term" ....

I mentioned The Cricket Term upthread. I thought I wouldn't be the only person here thinking of Mr Tallboy.

It's the same in every sport once you are playing competitively, not just doing it to entertain the kids. Turning up doesn't get you a spot - selection is based on ability not just being there. I understand why your son is upset, but that didn't mean the captain/coach were being unreasonable. Your son has 4 choices; play for a lower standard team and get more pitch time. Stay where he is and accept he won't play much. Stop playing all together. Or find another sport he is better at.

Selection in the 4th 11s should not be based purely on ability, especially with the youngsters. This isn't high level cricket

Selection in the 4th 11s should not be based purely on ability, especially with the youngsters. This isn't high level cricket

Not high level, but it still matters to the teams who are playing it. By 11 they want to win. And if a player costs them a match, they will be pretty hard on them.
My DS has played competitive sport his whole life, through school and uni. Some sports clubs are social and it's made clear when you join that's it's for fun. Some aren't - they play to win. Sounds like ops soon is playing for a team in the latter group. Nothing wrong with that.

But the forth team at a competitive club might be in a higher league than the seconds at a 'everyone gets a turn' club. In competitive cricket the team wants to win. I just asked my son a question. Would you rather bowl and your team lose or not bowl and they win? He said it's a no brainer the team wants to win and if he does not get to bowl because the pace bowlers coming on earlier take all the wickets cheaply then that is good because other teams they play later in the season will fear them more. In cricket it really is all about what's best for the team and how to win and get the points. If a team comes in the top two clubs at the end of the season they get promotion to the next league. This to competitive cricketers is the holy grail. OP's son might be better finding an 'everyone gets a turn' type of club who are not so focussed on winning and possibly be in a lower league, or improve his game. It is the level of competitive league they play in, not if they are the first, seconds, thirds or fourth team that matters. I know the fourths in my son's team are far better than the second team he used to play in, and the third team he plays for now is in the same league as his old first team and are second in the table whereas his old first team is second from bottom in the same table. His team is pushing hard for promotion. I still think if OP's son wants to improve he needs to practice in the nets more and get some 1-1 coaching.

True, but the team didn’t win, the bowlers who played weren’t particularly good. If you’re just stuck fielding while the brilliant batters do well and the well chosen bowlers take the opposition out, then fair enough, that’s the game. It makes it more frustrating when you are at least as good as the bowlers chosen, who aren’t doing well, and could therefore easily have been rotated round. Of course these things happen and it’s going to feel much worse after a week of GCSEs.
Best thing OP’s son can do is be annoyed, regain composure, and ask for more overs next time (in advance).

My friend plays for England in a veterans team. She's in her 50s and was in tears at a recent international match because she didn't get the pitch time she felt she had earned. It doesn't change - competitive team sports will always be like this.
If your son is serious about wanting to play more, get him to talk to the coach, find out what he needs to improve and then help him put in the extra training.

Hi OP, does your sone consider himself a bowler, batsman or all-rounder? Was this a 20 over game or 50? Was the reason he never got a chance to bat because his is quite low down the order and they never got that far or was he substituted? No offence but if he is struggling to get a shit at bowling or batting in the fourth team of a club perhaps it is time to move on to a different club?

can't remember the term he used because cricket is full of fucking stupid terms no one understands
Why not say to him 'I'm sorry, you're not selected,'

I guess you're not familiar with cricket? it sounds like your ds isn't either if he thinks that fielding isn't classed as playing?

it sounds like your ds isn't either if he thinks that fielding isn't classed as playing?

OP said her son is a bowler. I bet he'd realise the importance of fielding if the fielders were repeatedly dropping catches off his bowling, or letting his balls go for four because they couldn't be arsed to chase them.