Why is there so much sneering at Americans with European ancestry?

[BrBa]

I don’t understand! I identify with all my ancestors whether they came as religious refugees or early colonisers, were already indigenous to the region or brought in as slaves.

Yours
Swiss, German, Native American North, Central and South, Sephardic, Irish, South East African, Scottish, Acadian/French, and English

To be fair, most of Ireland just didn't care. Not proud, not offended. Just vaguely bemused and wondering why someone taped black bin bags over the bins in part of Dublin for the arrival of Joe.

I’m merely trying to understand a sensitive and often complex subject.

https://twitter.com/BackAftaThis/status/1258604855205203970?lang=en-GB

@BrBa In America someone saying "we are from Poland" or"we are Polish" would be widely understood to mean anything from the person having been born in Poland to that person being of Polish descent.

The poster you quoted is taking it more literally; saying "we are from Poland" means that that was your place of birth; you are literally "from" there.

I didn't interpret anything in that post to mean that your ethnicity could only be determined by country of birth though.

According to my Irish husband, his family and our friends over there, as well as Irish media, they very much cared. Lots of lovely reports of him meeting various people, including requesting to meet a now retired priest, who formerly acted as a chaplain in the US army, and actually gave Biden's son his last rites. There were many emotional accounts about that and other encounters. All reduced by British media to "dressing up as a leprechaun, dancing and drinking Guinness" - none of which he did (Biden is a teetotaller, for starters).

But mostly, Ireland understands the value of the outspoken support it gets from the US and many other countries, in the face of the UK's bonkers behaviour over the NI protocol. Most Brits don't realise that the whole of the UK is held completely to ransom by a very small minority of Unionists in NI. This is one important reason why Brexit is such a mess - as those who understood the implications warned would happen (but it was dismissed as Project Fear). The EU stands fully behind Ireland, and both the EU and Ireland have a much closer relationship with the US, despite the so-called "Special Relationship" that the UK claims to have with the US.

Thank you for explaining to an Irish person, living in Ireland, how Irish people felt about what happened in Ireland this week.

No seriously, we really do need non Irish people who are not in Ireland to do that for us. You're so kind. go raibh maith agat

I'm Irish living in Ireland. I enjoyed the visit. We can have different perspectives.

Of course we can, but we really don't need someone who wasn't here and isn't Irish telling us that we are wrong, do we? Telling us how the whole country felt? No, thanks.

We're going around in circles here a bit. We don't need anyone to tell us what to think or to patronise us. Equally we're free to enjoy the visit. Or not enjoy it. Free society and all that. I liked it tho.

We're not really. You and I can discuss whether we liked the visit, and what the mood of the country was. Mrs "My husband said that the whole country was dancing a jig" can feck off for herself though. That's the point.

Ah yeah, fair enough. I did enjoy it (but can't dance a jig alas).

That reminds me of the airport in the US which was piping bagpipe music through the PA "because everyone's Irish on St Patrick's Day!"

The tune? Scotland the Brave.

I'm sure not everyone in Ireland had the same reaction, and no, I'm not Irish. But a lot of my in-laws, our cousins, other relatives and friends, of all generations, who are also Irish people living in Ireland, reported very differently. You clearly had a different experience to them - doesn't make their views any less valid than yours (or vice versa of course).
Our family and friends range from farmers to a professional rugby player, students, teachers and hospital consultants, so an eclectic social mix. They are in Dublin, Sligo, Mayo, Galway, Cork and Waterford btw, so not a regional thing either.

Where did I say the whole country was "off dancing a jig"? And where did I say "my husband said"? I do speak regularly myself with our friends and family over there, and I read Irish newspapers.
You can feck off yourself with your attitude of "only I know what's happening in my country". You clearly don't.

I don't sneer but I do find it strange. Joe Biden is absolutely of Irish descent but your great great grandfather does not make you "Irish". My husband has an Irish grandmother and is therefore a quarter "Irish" and legally entitled to an Irish passport but he would never refer to himself as "Irish", despite being raised by her and knowing lots of his Irish family. It seems to be a uniquely American cultural affectation, like the posh East Coast Americans who trumpet their ancestry back to the Pilgrim Fathers. They don't have the same depth of history we do, American Indians aside, which I think gives them more of a curiosity about their (generally) European roots.

😂

Best never to ask people where they are from. It is too dangerous a question.
The US/ Irish thing is just for political gain. No one takes it too seriously although US money to the IRA to bomb us back in the day was very serious and very wrong.

You literally started your "correction" to me with "according my Irish husband". Do keep up (with yourself, if no-one else).

You totally Britsplained Ireland to me. Just own it. You actually thought you knew better than me what has been going on in Ireland the last week and how people feel about it, because you know a few Irish people. Classic.

You know, I'm so over the cult of personal "identity". It's a modern curse! Sure, everybody has a personal identity and also a group identity (often several), a national identity, a cultural identity and so forth. what pisses me off is the idea that you and only you determine your "identity" - you choose it, basically - and then everyone should damn well respect you for what you say you are. To question or disagree is insulting and is "hate".

Our real identities are shape-shifting concepts made up of an individual's core personality and physical features, then overlaid with our roles in various situations and things like our economic & social situations, where we live, our legal status, what we mean to other people and how they see us. To slap an "identity" label on yourself and demand acceptance feels controlling to me. Narcissistic, almost.

Many of the angrier comments in this thread reflect the tug-of-war going on around "trans identities". The same phrases are popping up, including challenges like "who are you to question my identity?" I'd say everyone has that right if they believe they've got cause to. Your identity isn't something you can unilaterally declare, it's a compound of multiple factors including other people's responses to you.

It's clear enough where I stand on this, I just find it an interesting and somewhat exasperating feature of 21st century life.

How about reading what I actually wrote? I said "According to my Irish husband, his family and our friends over there, as well as Irish media". Not "my husband said" (which I agree would have been a bit pathetic, but it's not what I wrote).

And I couldn't "Britsplain" anything if I tried, being that I'm not British. On the contrary, what I wrote was directed at those Brits (not all, but many) who have zero idea of Irish History and who DO Britsplain and reduce the Irish to dancing Leprechauns with shamrocks. And who ask my husband "So are you from Northern or Southern Ireland" - um no, the country is called "Ireland". Which is internationally recognised as the official name of the country that only Brits ever refer to as "the Republic". Only Brits stuck in colonial times can't accept "Ireland" on its own.

You have NO idea how deep my connections to Ireland are (or not as it's none of your business either way). You're just making assumptions. You don't know how much time I've spent there over the last 30 years, whether I've lived there or for how long, or how many people I know there, or who they are.

I have Irish children - are they allowed to have an opinion? Is my husband, born and bred in Ireland? Are his siblings and other relatives (and there aren't just "a few" - this being Ireland, he has ca 40 cousins, all with children at various stages of growing up; we are also close to a number of his second cousins)? Are our friends, also Irish people living in Ireland? Or do you have a monopoly?

Funnily enough you seem to be taking the general view that has been reported in British right-wing media, ie that Biden's visit was all for show. Maybe you've spent too much time on Mumsnet?

FYI I've just come off the phone from a long conversation with my SIL who has lived in Ireland all her life. And who is very happy about the clear message of support that Biden gave by his visit.

Again, I'm not saying that EVERYONE in Ireland feels the same way - clearly many descendants of wealthy Protestants don't, for example, and I'm sure there are others who like yourself don't care. But you simply can't claim to be the sole owner of the truth. As shown by the other poster in this thread who said that she enjoyed the visit.

According to my Irish husband and my husband said literally mean the same thing.

@GarlicGrace I don't disagree with you. If someone refers to themselves as "Italian-American" and someone else says "That does not meet my definition of Italian", I don't actually see what the big deal is.

It's not necessary to try to win someone over to your point of view. Respectful disagreement is perfectly valid.

I wish anybody could guess why they would mysteriously and for no known reason, do such a thing.

Reading comprehension isn't your strong side, is it? Once again, my full sentence which you keep choosing to quote selectively was "According to my Irish husband, his family and our friends over there, as well as Irish media" , NOT "my husband said". There is a BIG difference. I have spoken first-hand about the subject to a number of "Irish people living in Ireland" which according to you are the only ones allowed an opinion. And I read Irish media extensively.

Again I ask, even if you disqualify my husband (who incidentally was a guest of honour at a number of events commemorating the independence centenary, due to being the direct descendent of someone who was involved, including a garden party at President Michael Higgins' private residence - lovely man!) and my Irish children, on what basis do you disqualify our many Irish relatives and friends who still live in Ireland?

This is a thread on a BRITISH site, about something that happened in Ireland. You claim sole rights to express an opinion. So why are you even discussing it on a BRITISH site if only those who are Irish and live in Ireland are allowed an opinion?

It's Michael D. Or miggeldy. No need to be rude.