Why is there so much sneering at Americans with European ancestry?

[BrBa]

I don’t understand! I identify with all my ancestors whether they came as religious refugees or early colonisers, were already indigenous to the region or brought in as slaves.

Yours
Swiss, German, Native American North, Central and South, Sephardic, Irish, South East African, Scottish, Acadian/French, and English

I have always thought it strange how many Irish people get so annoyed at anyone with Irish roots mentioning it.

It doesn't seem to apply to other countries. Mostly people are proud if someone mentions their heritage.

That is very deprecating to the Irish useful idiots and all that. Let's not.

Second of all - the Irish American vote is not the block it used to be. Sorry to any Irish here but actually a huge % of the Irish American vote goes Republican in this day and age. See most of the presenters on Fox News for example.

We are "superior" in our attitude though.

It is our way or no way. In fact without that belief we would never have had an empire.

We still think our ways are best, our way of speaking English is the correct way, our table manners are the correct ones, our social mores are the correct way, and so on.

@Whenharrymetsmelly is not wrong. Unfortunately.

@Oriunda I can see that under Italian laws you may have the right to claim citizenship but it would still be insincere for your son to call himself Italian if he was born and raised in the UK. If I were your son then I would still say that I had Italian heritage rather than 'I am Italian'. That's just me though.

@Busybutbored Obviously I was talking about how someone describes themselves rather than their genetics. For all you know, that Italian grandparent could have a Greek grandparent and then we're really getting ourselves in a pickle, aren't we? No one is entirely from one country genetically as humans are melting pots when it comes to genes. Breaking news huh? It's silly to say that you are 1/4 Italian. To be Italian is a lot more than your genetics, that is what I am saying.

People outside of the US will think it is a bit odd to go around cherry picking fractions of your genes that relate to various countries and exclaiming 'I'm Italian!' to anyone in Rome that will listen.

There's a cultural difference between the UK and US on this, obviously.
In the UK, anyone with citizenship is considered British and it's bad form to ask where someone is from. If you ask a black person in Britain where they are from, they are probably going to say "London" and get annoyed with any further probing, even if their parents were born elsewhere. The idea of a black British person being called African, unless they were actually born there and have current citizenship there, is laughable and has racist undertones. Yet in America, even black people who were imported as slaves 200 years ago and have no link with Africa whatsoever are called African American.
For white British people with a British accent, if someone asks where you're from, they mean what town did you grow up in. They'd be surprised if you came out with any family history.

We know that! We're not idiots - thank you for that! - useful or otherwise. Biden can do his own electoral calculations, if that's all this is about.

It doesn't mean that Biden's interest, and Irish-American networks and diaspora generally, aren't a benefit to our country. The about-face from Boris Johnson on the Good Friday Agreement when Biden was elected was quite a satisfying (and important) moment.

That is due to slavery. No records were kept as to where they were originally from. The ports they departed from yes, but not their place of origin.

Exactly. We use concepts and language differently in different cultures.

Once we put in the effort to understanding each other, instead of banging on about people being strange or wrong (because obviously we are Right), that's a great thing.

My son is half Italian and half English (and that English is not even half, as I'm one eighth German). Being born in the UK does not cancel out his Italian nationality. We don't even live in the UK anymore. He's entitled to think himself Italian, English or anything in between.

Yes, nobody can tell the boy he's being insincere if he claims Italian identity. That's only for him to judge.

@Oriunda I didn't say he wasn't entitled to describe himself as he wants. I just said I wouldn't in his shoes unless I actually grew up and lived in Italy.

If he has an Italian parent, he can call hinself Italian. His grandchildren can't though.

It is not in Irish culture.

A person from Dublin who had some great grandparents from, for example, Germany, would never describe themselves as German. They would describe themselves as Irish. Which is what they are.

Would his grandchildren not be entitled to Italian citizenship? I thought Italy had no generational limit on dual citizenship, so long as births registered appropriately?

This sort of law obviously encourages continued identification with an international heritage.

@4plusthehound The Irish people are not the “useful idiots”. It’s the heirarchy who think it’s ok to be used for American purposes. Biden spent ages in Ireland doing nothing useful at all. Mainly because he’s a lightweight.

No, that's not my point. Irish people would not normally describe themselves in this way in relation to their descent from another nationality.

But they would understand - often from ties of kinship - what Irish-Americans would mean when they describe themselves as Irish in this sense. Because the Irish-American culture is formed from a long shared history between the two nations.

Understanding that some Americans describe themselves as 'Irish' while only having distant links with Ireland is not at all the same thing as that practice being part of 'Irish culture', any more than the fact that many Italians understand the similarly tenuous use of the word 'Italian' by some Americans means that the practice is part of 'Italian culture'. I understand lots of cultural practices from other parts of the world, but that certainly doesn't mean I share them.

Your claim that this practice is part of 'Irish culture' is just not true.

Of COURSE the Irish are not "useful idiots".

I started my post by pointing out (to a different poster) that the implication they made that Biden is using the Irish as useful idiots" is deprecating.

IHas I used quotes as you did my meaning would have been clearer - I get into a lot of trouble with my bad grammar and spelling!

I can assure you that the Irish politicians involved got plenty out of this for their own agendas - looking at you, Michael Ring! - even before considering what other benefits Biden's visit may bring them.

One small example. There's been a surge in American tourist bookings coinciding with Biden's visit. And Irish tourism is set up to offer them what he got - genealogical enquiries, reflection on emigrant experience.

You think all that's happening at these events is speeches for the cameras? Ireland is a small open economy, gateway to the EU. Great stuff for us to have a US president, whether he'll be re-elected or not, happy to run an ad for the place. Irish politicians are professionals at this stuff.

Once we put in the effort to understanding each other, instead of banging on about people being strange or wrong (because obviously we are Right), that's a great thing.

@belleager And it makes life much more interesting and pleasant as well!

There is obviously a lot of anti-American sentiment on MN, which is fine (it is a UK-centric site after all). My only objection is that so many posters have deeply entrenched views about Americans based on something they saw on Facebook or YouTube, etc. Or if they want to back-up a claim they'll (rather conveniently) come up with an anecdote about an American who didn't know Spanish was spoken in Spain🙄

You just can't make sweeping generalizations about 350 Million+ people based on social media posts or anecdotal encounters.

As to the matter at hand....

UK posters: If an American tells you they're Italian and you're curious, ask them if they were born and raised in Italy. Mystery solved!

American Posters: Don't go to Poland and complain that they're not making the pierogi the way your Babci in Chicopee, MA does. They will laugh at you😀

Now that we've smoothed out international relations, I'm going to head out to the beach as it's a glorious day here and there's a beach chair calling my name!

Hope everyone enjoys their day (not being facetious!)

This feels to me that you have little understanding of American culture.

Americans identify themselves this way.

There are 300 million or so of them! We need to acceot it.

We don't have to like it but we need to accept it.

You're misquoting me there - I've said what I mean on this point

Sanity!

I will grab my towel! 😂

Yes, that about covers it. Enjoy your day!

I guess when you are a young country, your original identity means more? Feels a bit clingy though for a country that fought a war of independence to get away from Great Britain which, at the time, included Ireland.

Not sure many of us in the uk truly believe Ireland got much out of Biden.