to point out that one Y chromosome does not make you a male

[Nimbostratus100]

In response to other posts insisting that one genetic test and one Y chromosome makes an athlete indisputably male with no room for error, I just want to point out that it not true.

There is always genetic exchange, for example, between a mother and baby, so anyone who has had a son will still have Y chromosomes in some cells in their body, and that will possibly show up in a genetic screening.

I am all for keeping men out of women's sport, and defining them genetically, but please lets not go over the top - one test does not prove you are male

Women really aren't the ones looking stupid and aggressive here.
Sports testing is not the same as forensic testing after swabbing a door handle at a crime scene.

whats your point?

Forensic scientists may be working with a few cells on a door handle - dont you understand that?

Eh? What's your point 🤣🤣🤣🤷‍♀️

I very much doubt when trying to decide what sex category someone competes in for sport they'll be swabbing door handles

And there will be an appeals process just as there is for drugs testing....
I fail to see a problem?

In the future, all athletes will be tested or none, you cant test only people you don't like the look of

This would work out fine for female athletes. Crack on!

Not entirely convinced it's certain posters who look aggressive and stupid.

Well not the ones you are accusing anyway 🤣

Wait. So as the mother of a son, instead of taking a pay cut to work part time and finding myself on the career slow track, I could have dug out a few residual Y chromosomes, waved them around and got a pay rise?

Fuck me. Another way I’ve been doing it wrong all these years.

You seem to be shouting at us over some silly straw man argument.

Who do you think is doing this “one Y chromosome in one cell means a person is male” stuff you are on about?

Microchimerism isn’t some sort of Gotcha.

I'm not understanding the problem OP. As smarthomenhas said, they're not looking for one Y, they're looking for a Y in 99% of cells in the sample. A few stray Ys due to micro chimerism isn't evidence of incorrect sex testing. They don't just test one individual cell. There also doesn't appear to be evidence that chimera cells replicate so again, not possible that a random sample could contain nothing but chimeras.

And tests are relatively cheap and quick these days, so testing twice isn't really a biggie.

There is no problem here at all - sex can be determined by swabbing and testing. Easily.

Yes it can happen in women that, as far as they know, have never been pregnant. Thought to be due to early miscarriages. That paper also speculates that it can happen from sexual intercourse with a male. We are talking tiny, tiny amount of male cells though in comparison to the overall cell count of a female, which is why this hysteria from the OP about genetic testing for athletes in nonsense. Genetic chimerism is actually quite common, but the results would express that. And me having a few cells floating around from my sons, or even derived from those cells, would not make me show up as male in a genetic test. Because they will be a tiny, tiny, tiny proportion of my cell count and not every single one of the cells from the swab sites will be a foetal-derived one, if any.

It's a fascinating subject though, as they seem to be concentrated in injury sites in mice, so there is speculation that it is an evolutionary mechanism that evolved whereby the foetus sends helpful stem cells to repair damage in the mother to further the chance of her survival long enough to nurture the offspring to maturity. I quite like the idea of some payback for all this months of carrying them around!

🤣🤣👏

😂😂

It's getting to hysteria levels of desperation now.

We've had a thread where there was "concern" that insisting on single sex toilets would lead to men pretending to be transmen.

Now "concern" that genetic testing of athletes could lead to women with a twin brother or mothers of sons being banned from competition.

"Don't look there women! Look over here! There's nothing behind the screen."

Yes of course, why are you saying "crack on" like that?

this is exactly what I mean by aggression.

Pointless, and unconstructive, and does nothing for womens cause at all, if the default response to anything and everything is aggression

Aggression???

exactly, as their currently is

but what I am pointing out is that the reflex hate, hostility and aggression from people supposedly wanting to support women's rights, does not help in any way, and there needs to be far more understanding towards women who are found to have a Y chromosome show up in their testing

This.

Im actuall amused and laughing at the moment rather than aggressive. LOL at a geneticist believing that foetal transfer in a mother would make them fail a genetic test to determine if they were male. LOL at the idea, planted by the OP, that athletics bodies are proposing looking for 1 Y chromosome in a sample of 100s of thousands of cells.

Why do they test then? Surely officials can just look at athletes and know so doing tests seems a bit of a waste.

Being excluded from the female category isn’t abuse.

And it would never be done on the basis of a single test, the chromosomes are just a screening stage before further investigations and not all XY athletes are excluded from the female category, it depends on the reason the Y is present and if the Y resulted in a male puberty or not.

5ARD is very, very different to CAIS.

A girl who become an acquired chimeras due to bone marrow transplant will have Y chromosomes in a blood test (but not in a skin cell test). This would not exclude her from the female category in sports because she doesn’t have a DSD, she hasn’t had a male puberty and the donor’s blood cells make her no more male than she would be if she’d received a kidney from a male donor.

You really don’t seem like a geneticist 🤦‍♀️

Literally no one has shown any hate or aggression to women or indeed transwomen. Indeed the situation you’re discussing has literally never actually happened. This is totally your invention. You don’t need to defend any imaginary women who have been diagnosed male based on a chemeric cell…..

I suspect OP is a "geneticist" rather than a geneticist.

Everyone involved in athletics knew Caster Semenya has a DSD, long before it was accepted as fact. I doubt CS has ever consented to a genetic test, they tested for testosterone levels, and boughed out of female athletics when it became clear the jig was up.

If a woman athlete has given birth to a male child, we can be 100% sure she is female.

OP do you remember this?

I've had 4 sons. Still waiting for the genetic advantage for sports.