To ask a mum to keep her kids quiet on the train?

[Wiennetta]

I specifically booked a seat on a quiet carriage as I’m working on a 4 hour train journey (as are most people in the carriage, or reading, snoozing etc). Next to me on the other side of the aisle is a mum with a two year old who is watching his iPad on full volume. He has been running around up and down the aisle with another child, shouting, screaming and so on.

I was trying to concentrate on something, listening on my headphones and politely asked the mum if they could keep it down - at this point the kid was literally next to my seat, in the aisle, jumping up and down and shouting. She just said, ‘he’s two, what do you expect me to do?’

I mean they’re kids, they’re little, they’re bored. But AIBU I thinking the parents should at least try and moderate their behaviour, remind them to be quiet, try and get them to sit down and do something a bit calmer? Even if it’s not always successful?

Or preferably not book the bloody quiet carriage.

@GrinAndVomit - You have kept me entertained this morning with your responses, thanks! 😂 Take your children on the train, you sound like a great Mum and you won’t be causing any bother.

Don’t understand the harsher responses. If you book the quiet carriage, you should expect quiet. The OP has already said there are spare seats elsewhere. Judging by some of the behaviour the OPs described, she’s just ignorant and entitled.

Headphones on the kids, absolutely. So selfish and ignorant of parents to let kids go on devices without them. The mother sounds useless.

Then don’t sit in a quiet carriage with them.

In the days before iPads etc, I took my eldest ds on a 10 hour flight ( with a change) to the USA. It was hard work keeping him entertained but made worth it as at the end of the flight, a couple of the other passengers came over and said that they hadn’t realised there was such a young child on board. Of course that was when children were expected to “fit in” with adults rather than the other way around. Nowadays it seems that children rule!

She didn’t mention sitting in the quiet carriage with her children.

There are two separate conversations - the initial query and Grin and Vomit asking if she could quietly play Disney on the iPad to keep her children entertained, who was then told that her 17 month old should respect the needs of the adults that may have to sit near a small child.

I mean, that's just not true. Reasonable people respect the needs of small children. But playing a movie out loud isn't actually a need. A lot of us had very demanding toddlers before there were screens; we do sympathise and there is no problem with Grin's toddler being noisy and active on a train - just a problem with her playing a device on speakers in public.

But she has said she could sing songs and has been told that’s inappropriate. She has said the alternative will be that her 17 month old is loud and will want to run around - also unacceptable. She has been told, basically, that her toddler should act like a much older child (which is clearly outside the range of what is developmentally appropriate or possible) for the comfort of the adults around him. Ridiculous.

Agree those responses are ridiculous - toddlers will be toddlers! The issue is about devices and no headphones for which there is no excuse. And when it comes to sensory issues about things on heads, I remember vividly the frustration of hat-refusal in the snow so I get it. But then I never let my kids on bikes/trikes/scooters without a helmet and they understood it was non-negotiable so I think it's the same with headphones and devices - you don't get to do it unless you put the thing on your head!

It's a values ( or lack of?) thing found in certain sectors of society - and then people wonder why their kids aren't "school ready" when they go to nursery or school.

Yes that’s fair enough in those situations. But if her 17 month old won’t tolerate anything on his head (which is totally normal at that age), the alternative is to play the iPad quietly without headphones or to entertain him in another way (such as singing). The alternative is not to try to engage a 17 month old in a conversation about the texture of a wall or not go out at all.

Forgot to @OfCourseImNameChanging

No one wants to hear you singing either in a public place they cannot escape from. It's cute for you but everyone else is sitting with gritted teeth.

Was visiting family once and we all went out to lunch. About 5 children, 8 adults. My nephew's wife though it was appropriate to sing at the table to keep the youngest ones 'entertained'...😳

If you can’t cope with other people’s perfectly reasonable noise, I’d suggest driving.

If people can’t respect areas that don’t need excessive noise they shouldn’t be there.

I don’t understand how people find it hard to stop their children being tiny dicks?? There’s a time and a place for children to play and shout and mess around, trains isn’t one of them. And if your child cannot behave for a bit don’t take them there! Dd sits perfectly well for long train journeys, and I’m slack af it’s truly not difficult.

@GrinAndVomit I'm personally a rather grumpy traveller, but I have to say I'd much rather hear Disney so quietly I can block it out with my own headphones than singing (nothing worse unless you're particularly blessed with a good singing voice). I don't know if anyone's mentioned headphone spli... Just kidding. I don't think you should put your plans on hold because of people on here, at the end of the day you have as much right to get from A to B than anyone else.

I'm not yet a parent so forgive me if this is naive or not at all age-appropriate but would your child do any interactive activities that maybe they haven't done before? What about taking some string, play dough and other materials and asking them to create certain shapes or even letters? Or maybe you could take some crayons and on your way to the station you could pick up some leaves, sticks etc and ask them to do some rubbings? Or maybe if you know the route (or even Google Map it!) you could print off some pictures of what they'll see along the way and play a sort of bingo game when they see each thing? I was once a teaching assistant (but for a short time hence why I fully understand these activities may be more suited for an older child) and found that children were amazed by these sorts of things.

Whatever you do, please don't give up on your trip for the sake of people on here. As long as you aren't in a quiet coach, people have to understand that kids will be kids and public transport is exactly that, public! If people aren't happy to encounter noise or children, they should upgrade (it doesn't always have to be expensive using the likes of Seatfrog) or find an alternative method of travel themselves.

If a child takes headphones off, turn the volume off, rinse and repeat, they'll get it eventually.

She hasn’t said her children act like “tiny dicks”. She has said that at her toddler’s particular age he’s hard to keep entertained. A quiet iPad or singing songs are not unreasonable solutions.

@GrinAndVomit you entertain your kids the way parents did before screens became a thing. Books, colouring, stickers, a simple game for the older two. Looking out of the window and playing the game where you get one point for a field with cows in, two for horses, three for sheep. The little one can join in with this. Mine loved stickers at this age as well and spent a happy hour sticking them on herself and then in the book.

In your position I’d be more forceful about it being a quiet carriage. I’d ask her if she knows it’s a quiet carriage and why she booked it. I’d aim to get at least some acknowledgement of my perspective. If she replied, “What do you expect me to do, he’s 2?” I wouldn’t focus on his noise in my response, I’d focus on the carriage issue and say, “Thisis a quiet carriage you therefore need to move to a non quiet carriage. If you don’t, I will ask a guard to ask you to move.” I’d then find a guard. Failing that, I’d move to another carriage.

I know I'm the meanest of all the meanies. But just to re-emphasise.

I have travelled by train a lot, with children and grandchildren, in UK and elsewhere. I also travel by train without children or grandchildren of my own.

I hate hearing other people's bad choice of awful music and/or popular film scores and see no reason why anyone should inflict their choices on those around them. I really do enjoy music but would never think of inflicting my choice (no, not even the final chorale from BWV 140) on others; they might not like it, you see (irrational though that would be in the case of that 'Wacht Auf' by JE Gardiner's band ...).

[In other countries in Europe, 'Quiet Coach' on a train means 'Quiet!', and you will not get away with any noise ime. (I even noticed the disparagement of an involuntary cough on Deutsche Bahn one time. (OK, in 1st Class, but still ... not my cough, luckily!)) Not so in England. This is sad. Could do better, English people: should do better.]

Outside the quiet coach (not all train operators even have such things, sadly), sure, laugh, sing to your small children. Recite poetry to them, play I Spy games with them, talk to them (you should talk, incessantly, even to pre-verbal children, ask your friends with doctorates in child development if you have any). Mostly I will enjoy listening to you and your small children, and if not, well I have noise-cancelling headphones.

But, please, please, don't play music or film sound tracks out loud - or allow your children to do so. To even think of doing so is selfish in the extreme and marks you out as a bad person (even worse than the meanest meanie on MN, yes, for sure). No need to do it. Don't do it.

Seems a minimum. Maybe we can agree on this?

The ipad without headphones is an unreasonable solution.

To you. I have auditory sensitivities and still - personally - it doesn’t bother me at all. I’d rather hear the quiet murmurings of a device than adults squawking and hollering as they tend to, taking loud calls, or chomping on their Pret sandwiches.

But as @sewexe has said, if @GrinAndVomit isn’t to use the iPad without headphones then she of course should be able to chat, sing, play silly games and so on. She has every right to take her young children on the train and to manage that as best she can. If others can’t cope with those sorts of noises, then they should make other arrangements.

And it goes without saying that in the quiet carriage everyone should be quiet.

I agree with all your post except obviously the ipad bit - it's an actively antisocial behaviour and we need to teach kids from the start that headphones and devices are as non-negotiable as bike helmets. Noise from devices is an increasing issue in public spaces and it's always incredibly selfish and rude. Everything else you say, I'm completely on board with! @Se@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16@Segway16