To wonder how I approach my neighbour about her nude son

[Meanswell]

So i feel quite awkward in posting this but i am wondering the best approach as I don’t want to upset anyone but i need to protect my child.

A neighbour who lives near me has a teenage son with non verbal autism. He sometimes like to stand outside the front of the houses. Today my daughter was taking the dog out for a walk. He was outside naked with everything on display. My daughter stood in one spot and he kind of ran towards her. She came straight back in and locked the doo. I genuinely don’t think he meant anything by it but he was left alone for a couple of minutes.

I genuinely don’t want to upset his mum and I know he doesn’t understand why he cannot do that. My daughter feels quite shocked and said she will never go out the front again. I am now worried if he acts inappropriately again, how do I approach this situation gently.

Okay then a single episode of possible 'indecent exposure' as described by the OP wouldn't put this young person any where near the ballpark for those sort of assessments

That may be the case, but that isn’t an argument against reporting it and having it handled appropriately.

His behaviour meant that he did pose a threat to the DD as well as to himself. If he continues to be allowed to act in that way it could result in him assaulting someone, or being assaulted himself. Early intervention is in everyone’s interests.

Okay then a single episode of possible 'indecent exposure' as described by the OP wouldn't put this young person any where near the ballpark for those sort of assessments

but when out fully into context - he has been outside only in underwear before, so this is an escalation - and that is very important.

plus he ran towards a child, who was standing still. Another escalation.

these facts must be considered during any risk assessment, which would cover risks to the boy and to others. The fact his behaviour escalating is paramount to any competent assessment.

I've noticed this too and where are the fathers in all this?

Hormones, sex drive, and puberty come disabled or not. Ignoring and downplaying it doesn't make it disappear.

@onirgellep
"Okay then a single episode of possible 'indecent exposure' as described by the OP wouldn't put this young person any where near the ballpark for those sort of assessments."

We don't know if it was a single episode or not. He could have done it before to other people. The op wouldn't necessarily be aware of that.

And for that reason I would have no hesitation in letting the relevant authorities know about this incident.

"Whether prevention is best achieved through prison, secure hospital, or effective supervision (which this boy did not have) should surely be decided on a case-by-case basis, by those qualified to do so."

No one will be doing a deep analysis based on this one incident. The police will pass it on for social care to deal with.

But if you want to continue with your fantasy of locking learning disabled people up, that's up to you. It won't be your decision.

Whether it’s required at this stage, or may be in future, will be for the authorities to decide. As a previous poster said, we know this is one incident against OP’s dd, but we don’t actually know if he’s done this before, and/or has been reported before. If it is a first incident and he goes on to do it again, then reporting it at least means there will be a record of his history.

But if you want to continue with your fantasy of locking learning disabled people up, that's up to you. It won't be your decision.

Erm, I think I clearly stated that it’s for professionals to decide, not for mumsnet posters.

if you think wanting it to be reported in order to safeguard OP’s DD, the boy himself and others he may target is a ‘fantasy of locking learning disabled people up’, then go for it 🤷🏻‍♀️ learning disabled or not, I don’t think those that demonstrate threatening behaviour that poses a risk to others should go without supervision or detainment if deemed necessary.

Its pointless talking about what you would do in another country if the incident in question happened in the UK. Even in other countries, I strongly suspect that the decision whether to take a case to court is not left solely to the decision of the purported victim's mum. And we do come back to the issue of whether this boy has in fact committed any offence at all, given the issue of whether he has capacity.

"I don’t think those that demonstrate threatening behaviour that poses a risk to others should go without supervision or detainment if deemed necessary."

I have said in my posts that this is a safeguarding issue for all involved and given that he is known to be standing outside in his underwear, I would contact social services as this isn't ok for any teenager to be doing.

You have no right to decide to press charges in your country in relation to an incident that happened in another country.

Unless your country has a principal of strict liability, I would seriously question whether this boy would be found to have committed a crime if he lacks the required mental capacity and/or is unable to form the required intent.

If this girl was frightened - and OP doesn't actually say she was - is it better that she spends time making a pointless complaint to the police which goes nowhere, or that the boy gets the proper support, care and possibly treatment so that long term there is no likelihood of recurrence? Even in the wildly unlikely event that he were to be locked up, it would be for a minimal time and she would still find herself living next door to him.

Well there's lots of things we don't know about this actual incident let alone your possible 'other episodes'

As it stands using only the OPs posts which seem to understand the young mans lack of clothes as part of his autism/sensory difficulties and therefore difficult to explain to her understandably frightened daughter

And leaving out all the posited sexual narrative for which there is no evidence from the OP - crucially no reportage of an erection/masturbation/past or present sexualised behaviours

It makes for a very different Safeguarding referral that would not trigger the sort of assessments being discussed leading to secure provision

If on the other hand the nakedness outside the home happens again/becomes persistent and/or sexual elements emerge then that's obviously a different matter

Yes, non-verbal doesn't automatically equate to low intelligence. But it's clearly not end of, and the issue anyway is not intelligence but mental capacity. You can lack capacity to make certain decisions or form intentions, but still be perfectly intelligent.

I don't think anyone is saying that an autism diagnosis means that you can behave as you please. But the simple reality is that IF someone with severe autism lacks capacity, then they may not be committing any criminal offence and you won't help people like OP's daughter by saying that they are. That equally doesn't mean that they should be left alone to do whatever they like; what it means is that those concerned should be going down a different route, whether it's by way of providing treatment, proper support and education, full time 1:1 care when they are out and about, sectioning them, or a combination of any of those.

If you intentionally expose your genitals, and you intend that someone will see them and be caused alarm or distress, you would be guilty of the criminal offence of exposure under s 66 of the Sexual Offences Act 2003 (SOA 2003). This carries a sentence of up to six months in prison or a fine on summary conviction, or imprisonment for up to two years on indictment.

I have worked with someone who has a severely autistic young son who has very low cognitive levels and massive sensory problems that have never been properly addressed, and one of those relates to the feel of most clothes. Unless they are just right he does tend to throw them off, so he needs carers with him all the time if he is out and about to ensure he is comfortable and, if necessary, to deter him from undressing. My understanding is that that is not that unusual. If, as frequently happens, his care arrangements break down so that he is able to get out, and he then feels uncomfortable and throws all his clothes off, the remedy that would help everyone most would be to put in place reliable care arrangements (and keep trying to work with him to help him cope with his sensory difficulties) - not to waste the police's time.

Yes, I’ve been very clear that we don’t know, hence why a potential sexual element cannot be ruled out. Hence why the possibility of there being previous incidences cannot be ruled out. I am not saying there was a sexual element, or that he has done this before, but nor am I dismissing the possibility of both.

That’s why it should be referred to the relevant authorities.

The poster was saying that if this happened to her daughter in the country they live in then she would look to pursue charges.

Surely the police can be the ones to decide whether it’s a pointless case, rather than having the decision made for them? If he has done this previously, or continues to escalate in future, it is also important for the police to be aware of this.

They can also be the ones to refer to the correct authorities if he is found to lack competency.

Sadly, Indecent Exposure isn't a crime that the police take terribly seriously - of 10775 offences logged in 2020 only 594 cases reached court. The vast majority of IE isn't even reported and the actual incidence is unknown - official figures say 10-20% of girls & women but probably much higher

5-10% of serious sexual offenders have a history of IE

No crimes perpetrated by men are taken seriously. Why would they be in a system created by men for men.

@Rosula
"You have no right to decide to press charges in your country in relation to an incident that happened in another country."

It's hypothetical. As is everyone else's reply on this thread.....

Indeed

I think it was @TrashyPanda who pointed out that the boy's behaviour is escalating - he previously stood outside in his pants, now he is standing outside naked and has begun to approach people. In these circumstances, having a polite but firm word with his mum AND a call to Social Services and the local PCSO is the best course of action.

It's all very well saying that his mum should supervise him, but how many people here look after autistic adolescents single-handed, and are literally on their knees from lack of support? Getting official support now may prevent either this boy or another person from more serious harm later on.

Agree totally.

So true. Was definitely my experience.

Any update, op? Did you talk to your neighbour?