To want DS to go to the best university?

[Oilrigger]

DS now has five offers from universities: three Russell Group, one a well-regarded uni but not RG and one a newer university (former poly years ago) offering him BBC (he is predicted AAB). The courses are pretty similar at all five unis (can't go into more detail because he would be furious if he found out I was posting on MN!).

He is adamant that he wants to go to the former poly because he likes it the most. He also reasons that he will have a more enjoyable and less pressurised time there and that he is more likely to get a good class of degree (2.1 or 1st) from the ex-poly - rather than a 2.2 from a Russell Group uni that he just scrapes into. So he is going to firm the ex-poly (he won't have/need an insurance as it is his lowest offer).

AIBU to want him to firm one of the more prestigious Russell Group unis and insure the former poly? DH says I am as it is DS' decision and he's the one who will be going to uni.

@DrPrunesquallor curious about your comment, " Actually I did recommend Queens to another DS who’d avoided it because we re Catholic ( I think he’d got carried away with old news articles )" - I'm not sure why that would affect anyone's choice?

Queen's has pretty much always had a large population of Catholic students. This is from 2019:

"It said: “Of those who declared a religious affiliation, 35.8 per cent of students at Queen's identified themselves as Protestant, 50.6 per cent identified themselves as Catholic, with 13.6 per cent other/not declared.”

There's been a tendency for more students from a Protestant background to study elsewhere in the UK.

Re the OP, it's horses for courses. A huge amount depends on what your DS want to do. Eldest DC did their primary degree in a RG, and postgrad in another RG. The source of the primary degree matter not a jot though, because their career choice is totally dependent on the postgrad. 2nd DC also did their primary degree in a RG but the most crucial part of that degree was the placement year. Without that experience, they wouldn't have a cat in hell's chance of getting to where they want to be.

My primary degree was in a RG too, but subsequent postgrad and MSc were post 1992, same one. I actually hated the place! Not the course so much but the building - drab and utterly soulless compared to the lovely historic red brick!

@Oilrigger One of my DC chose an ex poly over offers from 4 RG universities. She was dead set on it (wouldn't even visit the RGs) so I let her get on with it. She hated it - not least as she found that a lot of her peers lived at home and had very different experiences and expectations from hers (she wanted to have a proper student experience, whereas they treated it as more like being at sixth form college - and she also felt quite isolated when they all went home at the end of the day and were doing stuff with their families and local friends at weekends). Lots of them had worked very hard to get CDD at A level, whereas she is lazy and had done very little for her ABB - so (no nice way to say this) she wasn't with people of a similar academic ability. She jacked it in and is starting again at a RG university next year.

She wouldn't have listened to me, though. And if I'd put pressure on her to go down the RG route, she'd have hated it on principle at that point, and it would have been "all my fault".

I'm old enough to remember when having a degree was supposed to be a really fun and engaging experience before joining the drudgery of work. Yes, working hard was important (I got a 2:1) but it wasn't supposed to be the next stage on the travelator to retirement.

I feel like a lot of MN view life as an airport with the ultimate goal being a seat in first class. It's such a joyless way to view life.

I would try to encourage him to choose whichever uni has the most funding in that specific department, regardless of if it's a former poly or not. I would also look at the course outline at each uni. I know eg my friends who studied medicine at Oxbridge didn't get anywhere near as much practical, hands-on experience as they did at my uni which let first years meet patients for various things, like expectant mums.

I'm a total non-scientist so don't know if something is particularly niche or not. I was curious to understand if the PP's DH was in fact only looking at a very small sample to recruit from anyway.

DD1 was at Nottingham Trent some years ago and chose it because the labs were so much better than most other unis for her particular interests.

Many unis have lovely research labs which undergraduates only get to see during their open day visit.

Sorry I didn’t mean to quote you as realise you asked the question 😊.

Nottingham Trent has soared through the ratings in recent years 👍

Seriously? If you are a recruiter, is that the policy of the agency you work for, or a personal quirk?

I would give him your reasons for why you think he should go to X uni but it’s his decision and you need to support him with it.

There are going to many things that you don’t agree with but he’s his own person and he needs to make his own decisions, whether he regrets them or not.

Going to a low ranking uni is not going to take away from his degree in any way.

Maybe he just doesn't want the pressure, which is fair enough.

But in some sectors - like law - the university really matters. More so than the grade (e.g. a 2.1 from a reputable uni is worth 100 times more than a 1st from one that is less so). Make sure he is aware of this for his future career prospects. Because if he has a certain career path in mind it will make a difference (in certain sectors).

His life his choice. End off.

Did you go to a RG university?

My son didn’t meet his grades-he could’ve gone to his insurance. I couldn’t understand why he preferred to do a foundation year at his first choice instead of going straight into his first year at his insurance. A wise friend told me not to pressure him towards his insurance because if it all went wrong at his first choice, he would put it down to life experience. If it went wrong and I’d pressured him, he’d blame me. So I just supported him. He did his foundation which gave him a lot of confidence, got a first and then did a masters and got a distinction at one of the best universities in the country. His UG degree wasn’t a RG, but he still did very well at his PG which is. So I would encourage him to go to the one where he is really enthusiastic about the course and the uni-he will be more likely to do well at something he is enthused about.

If you want him to go to the “best” one and be unhappy and probably drop out then go for it 🙄

The Trent biochemistry labs were lovely even to my untutored eye. Having two scientist DDs I feel like I have tramped through every chemistry and physics lab in the kingdom!

Polytechnics became universities in 1992. The Russell Group came into being in 1994

Time to move on

Trent also has great nightlife for those so inclined!

Meant to say, 2/3 of the intake dropped out from DC2's cohort in RG uni.

OP out of curiosity did he pick his own college/sixth form and his own subjects?

Hi OP - I see you are not keen to say course or uni, which is a shame as advice would be more meaningful.

Here are my thoughts:

• He needs to want to go where he goes so he should make that decision,
• However, if his main reason is that it will be easier to get a higher class of degree, then I agree that that is a poor reason (and very possibly not even true)
• RG is certainly not the be-all and end-all - depending on the course
• There is something in the suggestion from PPs that the grades others achieve will have a bearing on your experience. DD went somewhere where a lot of students had similar grades to her at A level (BBC) and she felt that it was a more relaxed vibe and not as cutthroat as she suspected it might have been at Warwick. But a friend's DD got A-star and two As and is at a uni which offered her BBC - and I think she is finding that a bit of an issue. I recall one of the best things about my uni experience was suddenly being among people who were so much better at my subject than I was. That's unlikely perhaps if you are a low-aiming high-achiever, to coin a phrase.
• Please PLEASE can we stop talking about 'ex-polys'! Few of the students at them were even born when they were polytechnics. They are universities. And Lincoln Uni is not an ex-poly fwiw. No such thing as Lincoln Poly.

I recruit for somewhere graduates want to work. It's blind on school, university and name. I'm interested in the cv, personal statement and competency examples at the first sift.

OP, there was a post on here a few months ago where a mum was feeling guilty for forcing her dc to go to a Russel group uni, they were miserable and wanted to drop out.

My dd had offers from 3 Russel groups, they offered her A*,A, B which was her predicted grades. She had her heart set on Exeter Uni until we viewed other unis and she fell in love with a non Russel group who offered her B,B,C. I was worried when she wanted to secure the non Russel group uni but I had to let her make her own choice. Taking a uni offering B,B,C took a huge amount of pressure off her and meant she has no worries about not meeting the grades. She’s now coming up to the end of her first year and is loving uni life and the course she chose, she 100% made the right choice.

@Oilrigger
He really won’t get a 2:2 at a RG university. Very few do. With his predicted grades he’s not got an offer from Oxbridge or Imperial has he? So he’s really academically ok and should do as well as the majority. A 2:1 from many RG plus universities is better than a first from a lower regarded one.

I also think careers are seen as important by more grads at RG. They expect certain careers. They learn with others who are ambitious. This isn’t everywhere and on every course but lots of students see the elite RG as a stepping stone on the cv.

Plenty of DCs have fun at university. It’s not all work and no play. Also I agree with local students choosing local universities skewIng the student body. They probably don’t have much ambition to leave their city, ever.

A 2:1 from a top 15 RG is worth more. He would get this! Employers don’t always look at university but they do tests to choose the candidates to take forward to interview . RG university grads still do better and earn a premium over others so it’s possibly false to think he will do just as well with a first from a bottom 50 university. It also depends on what degree subject. A lot!

Another issue sometimes considered is why a AAB student didn’t challenge themselves. Recruiters know where they could have gone! So they might question the decision. They might think DC is lazy and unambitious. If he is. That’s it really. Sounds like it.

@Oilrigger apart from the snobby ex poly term I can understand your concern.

My daughter was offered places at University’s ranked 1, 2, 3 and 5 for her subject, only number 5 was a RG Uni.

Anyway she completely changed her mind where she wanted to go and is at number 54. The teaching is very hit and miss but she is enjoying the course and has made great friends.

What does make a difference is it offers extra vocational hands on qualifications separate to the degree but directly related to the subject and that is what I think we make her stand out to future employers.

I was very worried but she is now an adult and it’s working out well in the end.