Got "told off"- annual leave for teachers strike

[Skyblue81]

Feeling confused. AIBU??

Got 3 kids. Teachers were on strike last Weds & Thurs. School said it would remain open, but changed their minds Weds morning.

I worked from home on Weds with all 3 kids at home. It was exhausting, so I then put in for 2 days annual leave for Thursday (teachers strike) and Friday (to recover from my exhaustion).

Got back to work today to an HR call where I basically got told off for submitting and then taking leave!!!!! Yes OK I didn't give loads of notice, but then neither did my school.

Feeling really beaten-down by my workplace. I work hard, and have earned that annual leave. I took it to take care of my children, then have a recovery day. FFS it's not like I went on a bender to Ibiza!

AIBU???

Same here. If I ask my manager for the afternoon off now and say I have ok'd it with the team she'd let me have it. Different workplaces work differently, and it'd be different if we were super busy.

HR are in the wrong. They need to speak to the person that approved the request.

Sorry you’ve been subjected to this. If there was an issue with the short notice, then your manager needed to communicate this but instead you followed the correct procedure and took authorised annual leave and are now being pulled up on it. This is an issue with your manager not you. I hope your day improves.

All the commenters on here saying the manager is to blame are the people causing managers who are sticklers for rules and make everyone else’s lives hard because they won’t be flexible. The manager helped OP out, they won’t do that again if they get this kind of response. Next time you need annual leave and you miss the deadline by a day because you forgot or got distracted and your manager says “sorry, you missed the deadline, no time off to see your kids’ nativity”, blame the attitude that the manager shouldn’t approve leave that’s after the deadline…

errr...no. Dependants' leave is to arrange emergency cover, not to provide childcare yourself. Refusing DL is, indeed, illegal, but it is for emergencies only. It might be illegal to refuse a second day's DL if you could demonstrate clearly that your arrangements made on day 1 had broken down unexpectedly, creating a second emergency on day 2.

Does you contract actually explicitly say you don’t need to give statutory notice or is your workplace just flexible and allowing you time off despite not giving the statutory notice? If it’s the second, that’s exactly what the manager did here and that’s exactly what the manager is getting grief for.

We were asked in my workplace if we needed to take leave to cover childcare (special leave is paid I'll add) I didn't need it my kids school didn't strike, I know other people took it though and work were fine.

You maybe should have made it clear the reason for the last minute request, I can't see the issue if you do something office based where the world doesn't stop turning if you take a day off.

The manager helped OP out, they won’t do that again if they get this kind of response.

It wasn't OP's response!

This is about HR's flexibility, not the managers.

The manager was flexible and officially approved the leave, so if that's a problem for HR that's not OP's fault and it should be the manager who makes the point of their inflexibility being an issue.

Why is your HR moaning for taking annual leave? You could have taken that leave to scratch your arse at home. It makes absolutely NO DIFFERENCE. The leave is yours to take.

If I were you I'd be considering my future with a company that seems so backwards that they moan when people take annual leave.

Op I remember working from home with two small children during lockdown and it was so awful. I'd be on a meeting and my kids would literally be scaling furniture and putting their hands down the toilet in the other room. It was just undoable and I really relate to that exhaustion.

AIBU really isn't the place if you're feeling vulnerable and need support, I'm afraid, but I hear you.

@Chickenly no mine just doesn't say anything about a notice period for annual leave

I understand. It is very tiring and you are not unreasonable to want some time to yourself 🌸

Then you need to familiarise yourself with the law surrounding compassionate and family leave, because what your employer is doing, is illegal. You are allowed reasonable time off (although not necessarily paid) to deal with family emergencies like a sick child, but have to give your employer an idea of how long you will need and when you expect to be back at work. Expecting you to be back at work despite a sick child, is only reasonable if you can make arrangements for their care beforehand.

What @Madmog said is illegal conduct.

Then statutory rules apply and you should be giving 2x the length of leave notice. So, for a week off, you should give two weeks notice. If your employer is letting you give shorter notice than that, it’s because they’re being flexible and accommodating.

Wednesday and Thursday should have been emergency dependents leave (unpaid but you have a right to it) as you didn't know till Wednesday morning you would need it. it is unreasonable to WFH while doing childcare.

That surely depends on the workplace? Mine would always allow annual leave to be taken if there was an emergency (eg sick child) rather than it being unpaid emergency leave.

Some of the replies on here are really weird.

The op took approved annual leave. It doesn't matter how much notice she gave or what she used it for. If the manager shouldn't have approved it then it's on the manager.

I have never worked anywhere where hr would even notice this as they have better things to do than scrutinise an annual leave system to see when people requested leave.

HR probably don’t have a problem with the manager being flexible. They probably just want to make sure that being flexible doesn’t become a motive for people to take the piss - hence why OP was reminded to give appropriate notice in future. The manager being flexible is a good thing for everyone unless people start to abuse that flexibility - HR have just set an expectation so that the expectation doesn’t become to give last minute notice.

With respect, this is nonsensical. She was unable to attend work and gave as much notice as possible. She could have just phoned in sick on the day and still been paid. To refuse leave would have been flagrantly discriminatory. Your employee handbook needs a hefty update methinks!

Then statutory rules apply and you should be giving 2x the length of leave notice. So, for a week off, you should give two weeks notice.

Nope.

But do you need to wait for approval before taking leave or can you just book and take it? Regardless of the school situations and your 'exhaustion'. What would happen as normal?

If you are supposed to wait until approval then YABU if not then YANBU.

FYI the school won't have 'changed its mind' the will have realised on Wednesday morning they don't have the staffing levels to open safely.

Teachers do not have to inform heads they are intending to strike. The point of a strike is it is supposed to be disruptive and inconsiderate. I'm sorry it's come to this but that's the whole point of one.

If the above is correct then HR are unreasonable. If you have a union I would go through them to complain (if you’re a member of course!

and for those who say did you get you leave authorised, I would submit leave requests 6 months in advance and they would be approved until 2 months after I had taken it 😂😂😂

HR are BU for undermining your line manager who approved the annual leave. Not sure why they’d be getting involved at all and if there was an issue they should have taken it up with your manager not you!