Got "told off"- annual leave for teachers strike

[Skyblue81]

Feeling confused. AIBU??

Got 3 kids. Teachers were on strike last Weds & Thurs. School said it would remain open, but changed their minds Weds morning.

I worked from home on Weds with all 3 kids at home. It was exhausting, so I then put in for 2 days annual leave for Thursday (teachers strike) and Friday (to recover from my exhaustion).

Got back to work today to an HR call where I basically got told off for submitting and then taking leave!!!!! Yes OK I didn't give loads of notice, but then neither did my school.

Feeling really beaten-down by my workplace. I work hard, and have earned that annual leave. I took it to take care of my children, then have a recovery day. FFS it's not like I went on a bender to Ibiza!

AIBU???

Eh, it’s a bit of a meh issue in my opinion.

How much notice are you supposed to give for AL? You knew that the strikes were happening so you didn’t need to leave it that late, you could’ve spoken to your work about possibly needing it etc. You certainly didn’t need to take Friday off. If you didn’t give the amount of notice you’re supposed to give then I can completely understand why they’re annoyed. On the other hand, the leave was approved and you are entitled to take leave. I think that them making a comment but not formal sanction of any kind or any form of follow-up is pretty balanced. Just a “do better next time” comment, which is fair enough.

Depends if it was approved and what your workplace policy is. I don’t think many places let you just submit it and go.

We don't need a reason for taking annual leave.

I work in HR and cannot imagine being bothered or involved in this, they are acting very strangely. If your manager approved it then it should just be fine. Sorry you’re being made to feel like that.

Whether you have a valid reason or not to be exhausted isn’t really relevant. You said you took the days off because of the teachers strikes - you didn’t. No one is saying you aren’t allowed to be exhausted, just that it’s a bit disingenuous to say you booked two days off for the teaching strikes when actually you booked a day off to look after your children and another day off to recover from looking after your children. I can see why an employer would be unimpressed that you took leave at such short notice for a day that wasn’t necessary. Everyone deserves a day to relax but that doesn’t mean you can’t give reasonable notice (which I assume your contract says you should give).

What? Why would she need to do that? She took the leave because she was unable to do TWO jobs as she had done on Wednesday, hence needing to 'recover'.

Your manager definitely approved both days? What are they saying the problem is, is it that it should have been dependants leave instead? (where I work I'd get reminded if policy if I booked AL to cover sickness, for instance)

Did you respond and say you requested leave and it was approved, so don't understand why they're contacting you? That's what I would do in the first instance, copying in line manager in case it's something they're aware of already and can explain to either you or HR.

Sounds very bizarre seeing as the leave had been approved..

Hope you are OK op. All sounds very stressful 💐

I don't understand the problem as you say it was approved by your line manager. What have HR said is the problem?

It’s not yours or her employers business why she needed a day off though? It’s her annual leave and she can use it however she wants. If she wants to use it sitting in her pyjamas staring at the wall then she can. You don’t have to give a reason why you want a day off, your boss doesn’t get to say ‘Nah, I don’t think a holiday to Shropshire deserves time off’ it’s your personal time to do with what you will.

You also don’t get to tell someone why they’re exhausted. The OP was working and doing solo childcare at the same time. If she’s tired, shes tired, you don’t get to police what makes someone exhausted or not. What a strange attitude to have.

OP, if you were given the annual leave and it was signed off then there is no reason why anyone can have a go at you. It was signed off and you took it. Maybe it was short notice but check your schools leave policy - if it states in there you need to give more time then address it for the future, if it doesn’t then you have no reason to be chastised. Good luck.

You’ve avoided the question multiple times now (almost certain this will cross post with you answering because it always does). How much notice are you supposed to give for annual leave?

Giving last minute notice for unforeseen events - absolutely fine. Giving last minute notice for things you had notice of but chose to ignore might impact you (the strikes) and for a day to relax (the day after the strikes) is not reasonable.

Saying that they approved it isn’t really a defence either - they didn’t have to approve it and if you’re going to use that as a stick to beat them with then they probably won’t approve it next time around.

If her employer expects a certain notice for annual leave requests (like every employer I’ve ever come across) and OP didn’t give it then it’s absolutely their business why she’s breached her employment contract 🙄

Your second paragraph has no bearing at all on what I said in even the most tangential way. In fact, you’re desperately attempting to imply I said the opposite of what I said.

But they did approve it? If they hadn’t then she wouldn’t have taken it. But they said ‘Yea, have the days off’ so she took them?

she also said she had no notice of the strikes either.

She took Friday off (whilst he kids were at school) to recover from Thursday (not working and looking after her children). It’s in the OP.

So, Wednesday she worked and looked after children. Thursday she didn’t work and looked after children. Friday she didn’t work and didn’t look after children.

Yes, IF. We don’t know either way. They approved the days off though, so her reasoning is irrelevant.

You’re nitpicking at her reasons and you’re making assumptions about her contract. You have no idea what is in it. All you know is that she requested, then they approved.

You asked, it was approved. The strike days can't be helped, and the only extra day was the Friday, which was also approved. How you use your AL is up to you and if it was approved that's on them.

HR knew strikes were happening, it's hard cheese all round. I'm no pisstaker and I'd be annoyed at this stance too if you're an otherwise reliable hardworking employee.

Without hearing the conversation its difficult to judge. If it was a call asking why you took leave at such short notice that's fair enough. If you said it was for unplanned childcare and they said you mustn't do that, then HR is being unreasonable. If they said their system had flagged up late leave and said OK, just try and give us as much notice as you can.
If they questioned the Friday that's reasonable too, however it was your manager who approved it not you. If you were genuinely too exhausted to work Friday you should have taken sick leave however ultimately if you request leave and your manager approves it, idcsay that's their issue.

Just because they approved it doesn’t mean they can’t be annoyed that she didn’t give correct notice (if she didn’t, OP has refused to answer that question). They were being a good employer approving her request despite not having too - that’s not a point against them here. What do you think would’ve happened if they’d not approved the leave? Sounds like they did her a favour.

Everyone had notice of the strikes. It’s been all over the internet, it’s been on the news, it’s even been on mumsnet. The school not confirming that the school would definitely be shut doesn’t mean she couldn’t make plans or at least give her employer a heads up.

No one is nitpicking except you. As explained multiple times now, them approving her leave doesn’t mean she’s absolved of responsibility for submitting the request late.

We don’t know what’s in her contract because she’s refused to say. I’ve never come across any employment contract that says you can request annual leave with no notice. Have you?

Check your annual leave policy. Sometimes there’s a need to give x weeks notice for a day leave and y weeks notice for a week.
If not and your line manager approved then that’s all you need to say it was approved.
Check rules on wfh with children and emergency dependents leave too.

It really doesn’t matter. She asked her manager and her manager said yes. If the manager was wrong HR needs to talk to them.

I don’t know what HR does in your organisation, but in ours they are there to advise management of policy and implementation. Not to take it upon themselves to tell of employees for taking leave they’ve been approved to take.

Eh?? You’re the one saying her reason for this and this isn’t true because she did this and this - you’re the one nitpicking about her wanting leave.

No we don’t, and if you read my original comment rather than getting yourself all worked up you would see I said it depends on what is in her contract. You are assuming you know her contract - you’ve even said yourself you’re assuming.

And yes, in my last job I could request leave from my line manager and go on it the next day. In my fathers business, it is the same. If you read the thread, other posters have said the same in their jobs. Just because YOU haven’t experienced something, doesn’t make it not true.

If the leave was approved then work was in the wrong. You need to calm down and tell HR your manager approved the leave. You sound really stressed.

That’s down to her line Manager who approved it though? She requested, they said yes. Irrelevant if they were doing her a favour, she asked and they said yes. All she did was ask! They could have said no. To punish someone for asking for something and then being given it and accepting it is utterly ridiculous.

It doesn’t sound like HR are annoyed it was approved - they’re annoyed that it was requested late. Not sure why people are struggling with this concept so much. Just because it was approved doesn’t mean that OP was reasonable to request it at the last minute.