Page 11 | Got "told off"- annual leave for teachers strike

Skyblue81 · 2023-03-20T10:31:26+00:00

Feeling confused. AIBU?? Got 3 kids. Teachers were on strike last Weds & Thurs. School said it would remain open, but changed their minds Weds morning. I worked from home on Weds with all 3 kids at home. It was exhausting, so I then put in for 2 days annual leave for Thursday (teachers strike) and Friday (to recover from my exhaustion). Got back to work today to an HR call where I basically got told off for submitting and then taking leave!!!!! Yes OK I didn't give loads of notice, but then neither did my school. Feeling really beaten-down by my workplace. I work hard, and have earned that annual leave. I took it to take care of my children, then have a recovery day. FFS it's not like I went on a bender to Ibiza! AIBU???

melj1213 · 20/03/2023 23:29

CharlieTown · 20/03/2023 19:08

Why does this but make people so angry?I sometimes take annual leave when I'm exhausted. Isn't this a normal thing to do if you have enough days to spare?

Show quote history

Because for all we know work were willing to be flexible with approving the holiday at short notice to accommodate childcare needs but to also tack on a "recovery day" is taking the piss and they've probably just had HR remind the OP of that.

Where I work the official rule is ideally 4 weeks notice (as that's how far in advance our schedules are created) but a minimum of twice the holiday length + 1 days notice. My line manager has always been willing to be flexible if I have turned up and wanted a last minute adjustment for a good reason like childcare issues but I try to ensure that any last minute disruption is kept to a minimum, so no tacking on an extra day to childcare requests.

So in this case I'd have gone to my manager and said "The strikes are Wed/Thurs, I should only need to WFH Weds but if the school closes Thursday I won't get much notice, would I be ok to put it in as AL, even on the day, so I can get paid rather than having to take dependant leave?". If I'd done that my boss would have had no issue with me putting Thursday in as holiday on the day, but if I tried to put a holiday in for Thursday and Friday then my boss would think I was trying to take advantage and when I got back I'd be reminded of the official rule and probably wouldn't get as many favours in future.

Pottedpalm · 21/03/2023 00:46

Codlingmoths · 20/03/2023 10:56

Personally I’d take my children into work the next day , find the person who told them off, tell my darlings James/ina is looking after them today, sit at an adjacent desk and do my work. Even if I had to keep them out of school!

Yeah, of course you would! 😏
What a ridiculous suggestion.

Codlingmoths · 21/03/2023 03:17

Pottedpalm · 21/03/2023 00:46

Yeah, of course you would! 😏
What a ridiculous suggestion.

Show quote history

Well I would. But to be fair I earn well and I’m useful, so I would regard it as doing other employees a favour to make it clear to my work they can’t expect miracles such as imaginary childcare from their staff. But it wouldn’t happen, you are right, because I work for nice people who would say of course take a day off, don’t book it in as you’ve done so much extra recently.

pinkbaglady · 21/03/2023 05:51

Yanbu op

your AL is yours to do as you please with.

if it’s approved then I’m struggling to see how HR had a leg to stand on

CharlieTown · 21/03/2023 09:33

Because for all we know work were willing to be flexible with approving the holiday at short notice to accommodate childcare needs but to also tack on a "recovery day" is taking the piss and they've probably just had HR remind the OP of that

The OP has a finite number of days which will be the same number as everyone one else. If she wants to use one of her quota of days as recovery and it gets approved then why is it taking the piss? It's not an extra day that others don't get.

SkyandSurf · 21/03/2023 09:43

Your annual leave is yours to use, but I agree that's it's unreasonable to give less than one day of notice. Does your workplace have a written policy about how much notice for annual leave?

It depends on the work you do as well. Were other people relying on you? Or having to cover for you?

If I was your boss I'd probably be a bit about taking annual leave to 'recover' from a day spent with your own school aged children, but I wouldn't call you out on it.

I hope you're feeling better.

IamnotSethRogan · 21/03/2023 09:47

It's quite petty of work. I understand what people are saying about emergency dependent care but I know a lot of companies would prefer you can it as holiday as it both minimises the days off you have per annum and it means not pissing about with the accounts department trying to work out what pay to deduct. There wasn't really much you could do and they approved the leave so I think they're being twats unnecessarily

IamnotSethRogan · 21/03/2023 10:05

Also it's worth mentioning that stress and poor mental health are one if the main contributions to our reduction in work force. If the OP identified that she was feeling stressed and an extra day off would help her, then that's a reasonable precaution to make. Britain is always going to be trapped in this race to the bottom Presenteeism if attitudes don't change

isitjustmey · 21/03/2023 10:28

melj1213 · 20/03/2023 23:29

Because for all we know work were willing to be flexible with approving the holiday at short notice to accommodate childcare needs but to also tack on a "recovery day" is taking the piss and they've probably just had HR remind the OP of that.

Where I work the official rule is ideally 4 weeks notice (as that's how far in advance our schedules are created) but a minimum of twice the holiday length + 1 days notice. My line manager has always been willing to be flexible if I have turned up and wanted a last minute adjustment for a good reason like childcare issues but I try to ensure that any last minute disruption is kept to a minimum, so no tacking on an extra day to childcare requests.

So in this case I'd have gone to my manager and said "The strikes are Wed/Thurs, I should only need to WFH Weds but if the school closes Thursday I won't get much notice, would I be ok to put it in as AL, even on the day, so I can get paid rather than having to take dependant leave?". If I'd done that my boss would have had no issue with me putting Thursday in as holiday on the day, but if I tried to put a holiday in for Thursday and Friday then my boss would think I was trying to take advantage and when I got back I'd be reminded of the official rule and probably wouldn't get as many favours in future.

Show quote history

NO IT'S NOT TAKING THE PISS. People are allowed to take time off for whatever they want!

isitjustmey · 21/03/2023 10:30

I have 28 days leave. If I decide to take each of these 28 days to "recover" then I absolutely can. Who's gonna stop me? HR can't dictate to people how to use their entitled leave!

GoodChat · 21/03/2023 10:31

isitjustmey · 21/03/2023 10:30

I have 28 days leave. If I decide to take each of these 28 days to "recover" then I absolutely can. Who's gonna stop me? HR can't dictate to people how to use their entitled leave!

Too many people on this thread live to work, I think.

SkyandSurf · 21/03/2023 11:34

isitjustmey · 21/03/2023 10:30

I have 28 days leave. If I decide to take each of these 28 days to "recover" then I absolutely can. Who's gonna stop me? HR can't dictate to people how to use their entitled leave!

You can use your leave however you like, but it does impact coworkers and the organisation of people take leave without notice.

melj1213 · 21/03/2023 12:54

isitjustmey · 21/03/2023 10:28

NO IT'S NOT TAKING THE PISS. People are allowed to take time off for whatever they want!

Show quote history

Provided they follow the company rules regarding minimum notification.

It's not taking the piss to take time off but if work have bent the rules of notification required to accommodate the OPs childcare issues then it is taking the piss to add on an extra "me day".

Where I work I have to give a minimum of 3 days advance notice for a day off (twice the length of the holiday + one day). If I had childcare issues and rang up on Monday morning and said "I can't come in today due to childcare, I have AL left to take so can you put it down as AL so I can be paid rather than take unpaid dependent leave?" they would happily be flexible to help me out but if I said "I can't come in today due to childcare, can you put it as AL so I can be paid, oh and can I have tomorrow off as well?" they would say no to the following day as I hadn't given enough notice for "just" a day off.

The OPs employer presumably authorised it as it was last minute but HR put in a reminder that for AL requests the proper process should be followed.

lieselotte · 21/03/2023 12:59

Pottedpalm · 21/03/2023 00:46

Yeah, of course you would! 😏
What a ridiculous suggestion.

Show quote history

Last week some people posted on LinkedIn that they had taken their children into the office as they had no childcare during the strikes...

lieselotte · 21/03/2023 13:01

You can use your leave however you like, but it does impact coworkers and the organisation of people take leave without notice

It depends on the job. It doesn't "impact" anyone any worse when I take leave at short notice than when I take it at long notice. If I am not there, there is an impact. But I am entitled to my leave.

MajorCarolDanvers · 21/03/2023 13:11

YANBU as your leave was approved. Sounds like utter jobsworth HR.

Ask them what they advise if future strikes occur?

MajorCarolDanvers · 21/03/2023 13:12

@ChickenDhansak82

You need to give more than 20 hours notice to take holiday.

We don't all work for your employer.

DinnerThyme · 21/03/2023 13:42

NeverDropYourMooncup · 20/03/2023 18:38

I think they were probably being realistic that the OP would have just phoned in sick if it wasn't approved and they didn't fancy having to go through disciplinary action (and the almost inevitable 3 month sick note for 'stress' that would come in shortly afterwards).

Show quote history

Did you mean to tag @PsychoCandy23 instead of me? I didn’t say anything about phoning in sick.

Chickenly · 21/03/2023 13:47

lieselotte · 21/03/2023 12:59

Last week some people posted on LinkedIn that they had taken their children into the office as they had no childcare during the strikes...

Show quote history

There’s a whole world of difference between:

taking your child to work because you had no alternative childcare provision on that day because of widespread school strikes,
taking your child out of school and choosing to take them to work and then rudely demanding that HR babysit your child.

One is a perfectly reasonable and acceptable way to behave and one is going out of your way (and harming your children) in order to be a dick. I’m certain it would result in disciplinary action at my workplace if anyone were actually enough of a twat to attempt it.

wentworthinmate · 21/03/2023 18:54

My workplace has stopped us from using annual
leave days when we HAVE to take 5 days off after negative covid test (having previously been positive). I just don’t understand what difference it makes if I take the 5 days for a prebooked holiday or they pay me to sit around at home whilst on enforced ‘sick’ leave. Once it’s gone it’s gone!

Songbird54321 · 21/03/2023 19:11

I’m confused, how can they get their knickers in a twist over you taking they leave they’ve approved? Surely if it was an issue they’d have declined your request?
And it’s absolutely none of their business what you use your leave for. My work actively encourages people to book in annual leave if they’re having a big night out or weekend so they’re in a fit and well state when they return. The fact we have to use most of our annual leave for childcare depresses me enough without hr having an opinion on it

Pottedpalm · 21/03/2023 19:40

Chickenly · 21/03/2023 13:47

There’s a whole world of difference between:

taking your child to work because you had no alternative childcare provision on that day because of widespread school strikes,
taking your child out of school and choosing to take them to work and then rudely demanding that HR babysit your child.

One is a perfectly reasonable and acceptable way to behave and one is going out of your way (and harming your children) in order to be a dick. I’m certain it would result in disciplinary action at my workplace if anyone were actually enough of a twat to attempt it.

Show quote history

Came on to say this but @Chickenly said it already

Pottedpalm · 21/03/2023 19:44

Codlingmoths · 21/03/2023 03:17

Well I would. But to be fair I earn well and I’m useful, so I would regard it as doing other employees a favour to make it clear to my work they can’t expect miracles such as imaginary childcare from their staff. But it wouldn’t happen, you are right, because I work for nice people who would say of course take a day off, don’t book it in as you’ve done so much extra recently.

Show quote history

It wouldn’t happen because its ridiculous, however ‘well’ you earn. Childcare problems are yours, not your employer’s.

Codlingmoths · 21/03/2023 20:07

Pottedpalm · 21/03/2023 19:44

It wouldn’t happen because its ridiculous, however ‘well’ you earn. Childcare problems are yours, not your employer’s.

Show quote history

Don’t be ridiculous. The school is on strike. She took annual leave. That is taking responsibility. She has children and someone has to look after them, decent employees recognise that staff are human. They get sick, things happen.

NeverDropYourMooncup · 21/03/2023 20:40

DinnerThyme · 21/03/2023 13:42

Did you mean to tag @PsychoCandy23 instead of me? I didn’t say anything about phoning in sick.

Show quote history

Sorry, was trying to agree with you in a way - that they probably felt they didn't have a choice but to either agree or refuse it and be in a position where she'd have to go through disciplinary.