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To wonder what part of this statement reminded Gary L of Nazi Germany?

1000 replies

marmaladeo · 11/03/2023 16:55

This is Suella Braverman's statement Gary Lineker was reacting to when he said "This is just an immeasurably cruel policy directed at the most vulnerable people in language that is not dissimilar to that used by Germany in the 30s" ... twitter.com/GaryLineker/status/1633094764865126400

If she was saying she wanted to stop immigration I could understand GL's reaction. But she's not. I don't understand why anyone would not want to "stop the boats" when 1. they're lethal and 2. they're being run by criminal gangs. If GL had made it clear he wanted to stop the boats but thought this policy was the wrong way to do it, then fine. But he didn't - he just made an extremely inflammatory statement. He might be getting lots of love from some quarters, but personally I think he's an egotist who is playing into the hands of the people smugglers.

OP posts:
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JudgyVonHolierThanThou · 11/03/2023 17:54

marmaladeo · 11/03/2023 17:19

It focuses on stopping the boats, not stopping immigration.

I lived in Australia when they introduced a similar policy. It was also controversial, but it stopped (most of) the boats.

You’re advocating Australia’s immigration policies from the early 2000s as a humane solution?

Seriously?

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 17:54

Iam4eels · 11/03/2023 17:53

Under the terms of the 1951 Refugee Convention there is no requirement to claim asylum in the first "safe country" reached.

More than that it is expressly written that asylum seekers can claim asylum in any safe country.

IClaudine · 11/03/2023 17:55

Iam4eels · 11/03/2023 17:53

Under the terms of the 1951 Refugee Convention there is no requirement to claim asylum in the first "safe country" reached.

Exactly. If they were such a requirement, many asylum seekers would never even reach northern Europe.

ThisNameIsNotAvailable · 11/03/2023 17:55

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 17:50

Define 'reputation' please. 'Reputation' according to who?

Internationally with anyone who has an interest in human rights and an awareness of what’s going on. Quick google search threw up this for example www.hrw.org/news/2022/01/10/djokovic-case-highlights-australias-cruel-immigration-policies

IClaudine · 11/03/2023 17:55

There not they

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 17:55

Can I ask everyone to do something before posting further.

Watch this short explanation of the various relevant laws to asylum seekers.

twitter.com/crimlawuk/status/1634330359839031301

IHaveaSetOfVeryParticularSkills · 11/03/2023 17:56

I think it's important to remember also the economic situation in 1930s Germany and frankly, current situation mixed with upcoming policies and language used...
I think it's quite easy to see why comparisons are being drawn

Nanalisa60 · 11/03/2023 17:56

TheSnugglyDuckling

Jews weren’t immigrants in Nazi Germany they were bloody citizens and it is unbelievably racist and othering - towards Jews - to suggest there are any similarities between people coming over illegally for economic reasons and Jewish citizens of Europe who were murdered simply for being Jews.

This is so true

Iam4eels · 11/03/2023 17:57

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 17:54

More than that it is expressly written that asylum seekers can claim asylum in any safe country.

There is no definition of "safe" either. Say I was fleeing my home country and ended up in France, technically safe but I don't speak French, I don't know anyone and I don't have any future prospects l however I speak some basic English and I have a cousin settled in England who knows someone who can give me some work. Where would I feel safest?

Rhondaa · 11/03/2023 17:57

We must say illegal crossings for the pedants, small boats full of economic migrants and asylum seekers crossing the Channel via illegal people smugglers.

These illegal crossings need to stop. There is nothing in the linked statement suggests there is any oft moaned about 'othering', just clear facts.

HannibalHeyes · 11/03/2023 17:57

IMustDoMoreExercise · 11/03/2023 17:48

Of course they can be. They need to claim at the first safe country and they are not doing so.

I think the exercise you need to do is for your brain...

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 17:57

Nanalisa60 · 11/03/2023 17:56

TheSnugglyDuckling

Jews weren’t immigrants in Nazi Germany they were bloody citizens and it is unbelievably racist and othering - towards Jews - to suggest there are any similarities between people coming over illegally for economic reasons and Jewish citizens of Europe who were murdered simply for being Jews.

This is so true

Except the part that says this is about illegal migrants. Its not it is about perfectly legal asylum seekers.

Please take a watch of this video to understand the law more.

twitter.com/crimlawuk/status/1634330359839031301

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 17:58

AmericasfavoritefightingFrenchman · 11/03/2023 17:26

In particular, it’s the way she talks about our systems being ‘overwhelmed’ and also the choice to put a monetary value on what these people are ‘costing us’.

And what exactly is untrue about these statements? Is the truth offensive now?

The same people bashing SB are the ones complaining about food shortages, the state of the NHS, lack of places in schools, pollution, etc. Do you think uncontrolled immigration will make these problems better or worse?

HannibalHeyes · 11/03/2023 17:59

Rhondaa · 11/03/2023 17:57

We must say illegal crossings for the pedants, small boats full of economic migrants and asylum seekers crossing the Channel via illegal people smugglers.

These illegal crossings need to stop. There is nothing in the linked statement suggests there is any oft moaned about 'othering', just clear facts.

Exactly! Now you're getting it!

As soon as they reopen legal routes, these "illegal" crossings would dwindle to nothing!

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 17:59

Rhondaa · 11/03/2023 17:57

We must say illegal crossings for the pedants, small boats full of economic migrants and asylum seekers crossing the Channel via illegal people smugglers.

These illegal crossings need to stop. There is nothing in the linked statement suggests there is any oft moaned about 'othering', just clear facts.

No the crossing aren't illegal either. It is not illegal to cross the channel, I have done it several times.

Why this constant othering of a group of people? Does it make you feel good?

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 17:59

Iam4eels · 11/03/2023 17:57

There is no definition of "safe" either. Say I was fleeing my home country and ended up in France, technically safe but I don't speak French, I don't know anyone and I don't have any future prospects l however I speak some basic English and I have a cousin settled in England who knows someone who can give me some work. Where would I feel safest?

It's not our responsibility to make people 'feel' safe when they are safe already in France

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 18:00

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 17:58

And what exactly is untrue about these statements? Is the truth offensive now?

The same people bashing SB are the ones complaining about food shortages, the state of the NHS, lack of places in schools, pollution, etc. Do you think uncontrolled immigration will make these problems better or worse?

I somehow doubt the living standards of 67million people will be massively impacted by 50,000 people.

Rhondaa · 11/03/2023 18:00

Nanalisa60 · 11/03/2023 17:56

TheSnugglyDuckling

Jews weren’t immigrants in Nazi Germany they were bloody citizens and it is unbelievably racist and othering - towards Jews - to suggest there are any similarities between people coming over illegally for economic reasons and Jewish citizens of Europe who were murdered simply for being Jews.

This is so true

It's disgusting isn't it. Lineker using this false equivalence about such a horrific time in history to score points and get a few likes. So utterly appalling.

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 18:01

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 18:00

I somehow doubt the living standards of 67million people will be massively impacted by 50,000 people.

It's not 50.000 people is it? Also, if they are illegal, it's 50.000 too many

Bimbleberries · 11/03/2023 18:01

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 17:58

And what exactly is untrue about these statements? Is the truth offensive now?

The same people bashing SB are the ones complaining about food shortages, the state of the NHS, lack of places in schools, pollution, etc. Do you think uncontrolled immigration will make these problems better or worse?

Well some of it might well make it better, indeed. We are desperate for workers in many fields, so that would help, if we had safe, legal, and rapid means of processing people who want to come.

Lack of places in schools, NHS, pollution, food shortages etc could all be different if we chose to invest in them, and voted accordingly.

We aren't suffering food shortages because of asylum seekers. We're more likely suffering them because of consequences of people voting based on prejudice or propaganda.

sunshinesupermum · 11/03/2023 18:02

Jews everywhere are sick to the very very back teeth of having one of the worst events in history being dragged out by unimaginative gobshites to compare a case that is nothing like Nazi Fucking Germany.

This. 100%

jgw1 · 11/03/2023 18:02

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 18:01

It's not 50.000 people is it? Also, if they are illegal, it's 50.000 too many

Please can you stop othering a group of people by calling them illegal.
If you do not understand why it is perfectly legal to seek asylum in any safe country please watch this video.

twitter.com/crimlawuk/status/1634330359839031301

I do wonder at your determination to prove Lineker's point.

AllThingsServeTheBeam · 11/03/2023 18:02

IMustDoMoreExercise · 11/03/2023 17:48

Of course they can be. They need to claim at the first safe country and they are not doing so.

Oh dear. I hope you aren't passing any of your knowledge onto any kids

MrsandProud · 11/03/2023 18:02

ThisNameIsNotAvailable · 11/03/2023 17:55

Internationally with anyone who has an interest in human rights and an awareness of what’s going on. Quick google search threw up this for example www.hrw.org/news/2022/01/10/djokovic-case-highlights-australias-cruel-immigration-policies

What these groups think is irrelevant frankly. Their mere existence is dependent on injustice being perpetuated so...

gogohmm · 11/03/2023 18:03

You don't have to look far to see the similarities. It's the portrayal of their needs as being not important. They are not risking their lives for no reason, treat the cause, not the action, good on Gary

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