Is threatening illegal immigrants going to stop them coming?

[LadyGAgain]

Channel migrants face lifetime ban on returning to UK www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-64848101

I read this with horror. I know we are a tiny island with limited resources but this legislation seems callous and cruel. These people are risking their very existence getting on these small boats and to then be locked up and shipped off again to who knows where. Plus the cost to us as tax payers. AIBU to suggest that I don't have a solution but this one seems extreme.

I think asylum centres are a great idea and one I would really welcome. But I wonder how many of our EU neighbours would welcome the UK opening its own one, now that we've left the EU? I think they'd tell us to fuck off, frankly, and tbh I wouldn't blame them.

I agree with your point about different standards for Ukrainians as well.

@Clavinova May I be the first to congratulate you on managing to copy and paste a link from the future (Oct 2023). You have surpassed yourself.

Aren't we supposed to be Singapore-on-Thames now we have Brexited?

Correct, and the poorest pay a higher proportion of their income in VAT than the richest do, which together with other indirect taxes, means that a nurse will pay a higher proportion of their income in tax than someone in the top 1% of earners.

The opening page of the bill openly states that its authors don't think it's compatiable with the ECHR.

Anyone who thinks this is a good faith attempt to stop the boats and not just another brexit war is kidding themselves

I hardly know where to start with that.

You may not have had time to read the rest of the thread so I shall post a brief summary for you.

1. The UK takes in a small proportion of the refugees that are in Europe.
2. There is no international law that says that asylum seekers need to apply for asylum in the first safe country they come to.

In 1995 a few polls showed Labour had a less than 20% lead, one as low as 15% Look how that turned out almost two years later...

Labour's average lead in 1995 was much higher than 20% though;

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Opinion_polling_for_the_1997_United_Kingdom_general_election

🤣 I have family there and no it’s not a shangri la. Of course, the rich expat community from the west there on high paying jobs are usually happy as they live in privileged bubbles, able to afford servants and what not. But the regular folk, not so great of a life. It has its own problems as a country.

They also have much more strict immigration controls and citizenship laws than we do. Which is understandable given the overpopulation.

In fact you can’t even hold dual citizenship- if you are born with another you have to renounce it by age 18 or they strip your Sing citizenship and deport you. You don’t even have to be a terrorist like Shamina Begum to be denied your birthright citizenship. If you’re not Sing, you can’t immigrate there and settle or naturalise either like you can here. If you’re an immigrant and your job ends, you lose your visa and have to leave the country. If your marriage to a Sing citizen breaks down, you have to leave the country.

Wouldn't that fit with the current government's aims of making the UK a poor place to do business?

May I be the first to congratulate you on managing to copy and paste a link from the future (Oct 2023). You have surpassed yourself

Oh yes - so I have - I obviously meant to post October 2022.

Well, let's wait and see Clav. Maybe we can return to this after the next GE and see who was right!

Don't whatever you do point out that there are 1/4 of a million empty homes in the UK and 3/4 a million 2nd homes.

How does Australia implement strict border control, stop the boats and remain part of the UN?

How does an apple get to be crunchy and made into cider, whilst an orange is zesty and comes in segments ?

Ah shame no answer..

Thought not.

Neither of your points discount what the poster is saying.

There are plenty of safe countries in the middle east and Africa which is where the majority attempting to relocate to Europe for more money come from.

The lack of asylum laws is the reason people moving for higher pay can shop around so easily.

By moving asylum seekers to centres in other countries, PNG is one such, I can't recall where the other is.

To be an asylum seeker one needs to be seeking sanctuary because one is not safe in the country one came from. If one was just moving for higher pay one would not be an asylum seeker, easy mistake to make.

So if we do what Aus has done would you be ok with it?

The boat issue has gone from thousands to near zero since turn back boats was introduced

France lets us do our border checks on French soil. Plus it could be integrated with embassies. I don't think they would mind if it meant the UK taking some of the asylum seekers.

why the uk why us all the time?

It's not, it's really, really not.

A huge part of the problem wrt to how asylum seekers are perceived is down to people like you, who read an article on the subject, maybe see a few inflammatory social media posts, hear some news soundbites about it, and then decided that's all the information you need to form an opinion on the subject.

Worse it's not just a casual opinion, but an entrenched one that you peddle to others and refuse point blank to move from no matter how frequently and robustly it's pointed out that you are wrong.

Perhaps you could start be reading the full thread where many posters have already addressed your claims, I'm mean not one of the things you are moaning about are asylum seeker specific issues, not one, and in the majority of cases the cause of the problem lies squarly on the shoulders of government.

France lets us do our border checks on French soil.

Worth noting that they wouldn't if the UK withdrew from the ECHR (or UK staff would have to be subject to the ECHR).

why the uk why us all the time?

Fucking hell, I missed that doozy. 😂

Imagine actually thinking that.

The thing is Finland has a land area about 40% bigger than the UK, and a population about 1/14th of that of the UK, so all refugees should go there.

The boats haven't stopped. Turnback and takeback are huge parts of the policy alongside offshoring of processing and settlement.

I suspect it's slightly easier to do turn back and takeback when you're not trying to do it in the middle of one of the world's busiest shipping lanes where the crossing across a narrow body of water into densely populated areas can be done in very small boats against which pushback/turnback tactics could be very dangerous.

Not to say that crossing the Timor sea in a rickety boat isn't perilous, but it's a different problem altogether.