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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Original poster

To think good on her ?

202 replies

bluelollipop99 · 24/02/2023 23:38

I have a lovely friend who is 36 weeks pregnant, ( her first baby ) , and she mentioned she was having an ELCS.

I asked if the baby was breech, and she said "no medical reason, but I didn't want hours of absolute agony, being told too short staffed for an epidural, tearing , never being the same down there again , feeling tearing with a 25% risk of an EMCS anyway. The NHS will never tell you this , but the NICE guidelines say if you request an ELCS they have to give you one, even if the midwives fuss about it."

I had a great fear of giving birth, but went ahead with vaginal birth as there was the clear pressure at the hospital that having an ELCS for non medical reasons made you "less of a women."

But thinking about it , my cousin had an ELCS at the same time and her recovery was not significantly longer than mine; to make up for the agony I went through.

I also think it's a bit bad that you only get this of you are literate enough to check the NICE guidelines.

AIBU unreasonable to think ELCS is often the best option for some people, and good on her for not being shamed / guilted out of this ?

OP posts:
MaryKateDanaher · 25/02/2023 10:04

I had one, I would 100% endorse it. I was fairly well recovered physically after about a week, enough to do some housework and have a stroll with then DP and baby.

Contrast to my sister who went through a horrendous natural labour over 72 hours and ended up having an emergency caesarean at the end of it. Traumatic for both her and baby, and she took far longer to recover because of it.

Horses for courses, everyone's choice is valid for them and I don't judge - but I know (and can see from this thread!) that others do judge. I couldn't give a flying fuck, personally.

safeplanet · 25/02/2023 10:04

No regrets but staff shortages made things stressful at times. It must be even worse now.

Although I said I would prefer any subsequent births to be vaginal the state of the NHS and maternity care now would maybe make me go for a CS just because it's managed better.

misslooloo · 25/02/2023 10:04

I wanted an elective C for my first - all the reasons you mentioned - but went ahead with a natural birth. I can hand on heart say it was the most incredible experience of my life. Yes it hurt, but my first thought when I had my daughter was “I want to do that again”.

Fast forward a few years and I needed an emergency C when they realised my son was breech. I have never felt so cheated out of anything in my whole life! I went with the C because it was the safest option at that point, but to this day I still feel sad for missing out on the experience.

misslooloo · 25/02/2023 10:06

I should add, this was MY experience. Others, like a good friend of mine who was traumatised by her first birth, opted for a C the second time and I totally get why! I’d have done the same.

Zanatdy · 25/02/2023 10:09

CS is more dangerous so they won’t just give one because someone doesn’t want to give birth. Well maybe they do but they shouldn’t when it costs a lot more money. Childbirth is meant to be painful and whilst I had a terrible recovery with DS1 I sailed through labour with Ds2 and DD, not a single stitch and drove home after DD (2.5hrs after birth). I certainly recovered much faster than my best friend who had 2 CS

Crumpetdisappointment · 25/02/2023 10:10

if she goes into labour early and there are no elcs slots she might not get her wish

even for me, with a breech birth, planned elcs, if i had gone into labour early i might have not been able to have a section. they had to persuade me, it was in the end my choice though, due to breech worries. although you can have a vaginal birth for breech, i had the fear put into me!

Zanatdy · 25/02/2023 10:10

misslooloo · 25/02/2023 10:04

I wanted an elective C for my first - all the reasons you mentioned - but went ahead with a natural birth. I can hand on heart say it was the most incredible experience of my life. Yes it hurt, but my first thought when I had my daughter was “I want to do that again”.

Fast forward a few years and I needed an emergency C when they realised my son was breech. I have never felt so cheated out of anything in my whole life! I went with the C because it was the safest option at that point, but to this day I still feel sad for missing out on the experience.

My first birth didn’t go brilliantly but I had those feelings with DS2 and DD. I was so proud of my body and will always be the most amazing achievement. Not taking anything away from anyone who needed a CS but if you can give birth naturally then great - it can be amazing

Alwayswonderedwhy · 25/02/2023 10:13

At the time of having my kids I would've said yabu. After living with the damage caused forceps I'd say yanbu.

Choconut · 25/02/2023 10:14

I wanted a vaginal birth but the more safe choices that people have the better IMO. It's not possible to be more of a woman or less of a woman, you just either are or you aren't and you try to make the best choices you can.

Original poster
bluelollipop99 · 25/02/2023 10:14

Also my absolute pet peeve is when midwives fall over themselves to say well done and congratulate women for managing without an epidural when they give birth vaginally . As if those who give birth with an epidural are somehow lesser ?!

OP posts:
safeplanet · 25/02/2023 10:15

@misslooloo I felt like I was cheated too.

@Crumpetdisappointment I tried induction first as I really didn't want the CS but also had the fear put into me by one registrar!

safeplanet · 25/02/2023 10:16

Also my absolute pet peeve is when midwives fall over themselves to say well done and congratulate women for managing without an epidural when they give birth vaginally

I wasn't congratulated for my lack of pain relief probably because I had demanded it & by the time it was sorted it was too late, that really pissed me off!

usernother · 25/02/2023 10:19

My child is in the forces and I was very proud of her for choosing to do so. She's worked really hard to get to a senior level and is now on a great salary, with lots of paid leave and some flexibility to facilitate family life with children. They are well looked after and have good perks.

usernother · 25/02/2023 10:20

Just realised I answered the wrong post. Whoops lol

Pudmyboy · 25/02/2023 10:22

I agree with personal choice, the only thought I had is about the baby picking up 'good' bacteria during travel through the vaginal canal, which helps them grow their own 'good' gut bugs, which doesn't happen with C-section delivery

LuckySantangelo35 · 25/02/2023 10:24

Whenharrymetsmelly · 25/02/2023 02:59

No, there's so much more serious risk for you and the baby. Not to mention that its likely to make it much harder to breastfeed etc

@Whenharrymetsmelly

there isn’t more risk

and it does affect breastfeeding

get your facts straight

Valentina12 · 25/02/2023 10:25

Pudmyboy · 25/02/2023 10:22

I agree with personal choice, the only thought I had is about the baby picking up 'good' bacteria during travel through the vaginal canal, which helps them grow their own 'good' gut bugs, which doesn't happen with C-section delivery

Well I mean mine are 9 and almost-6 and I can tell you that this has certainly never impacted on their lives 🤷🏻‍♀️ I think we overthink everything.

LuckySantangelo35 · 25/02/2023 10:27

Zanatdy · 25/02/2023 10:09

CS is more dangerous so they won’t just give one because someone doesn’t want to give birth. Well maybe they do but they shouldn’t when it costs a lot more money. Childbirth is meant to be painful and whilst I had a terrible recovery with DS1 I sailed through labour with Ds2 and DD, not a single stitch and drove home after DD (2.5hrs after birth). I certainly recovered much faster than my best friend who had 2 CS

@Zanatdy

women should not have to suffer unnecessarily and be deprived of choice and autonomy over their bodies in order to save the nhs money

LuckySantangelo35 · 25/02/2023 10:28

misslooloo · 25/02/2023 10:04

I wanted an elective C for my first - all the reasons you mentioned - but went ahead with a natural birth. I can hand on heart say it was the most incredible experience of my life. Yes it hurt, but my first thought when I had my daughter was “I want to do that again”.

Fast forward a few years and I needed an emergency C when they realised my son was breech. I have never felt so cheated out of anything in my whole life! I went with the C because it was the safest option at that point, but to this day I still feel sad for missing out on the experience.

@misslooloo

no guarantee you would have had such a good experience second time round though…

LuckySantangelo35 · 25/02/2023 10:34

@FindingMeno

women should not have to suffer unnecessarily and be deprived of choice and autonomy over their bodies in order to save the nhs money

misslooloo · 25/02/2023 10:34

Which is exactly why I went for the C. Safest option in those circumstances. I could have chosen a natural breech birth (something I was offered at 9cm dialated) but I went with what felt right at the time.

NellietheElephantpackedhertrunks · 25/02/2023 10:36

Shitfather · 25/02/2023 09:50

I had an ELCS after an extremely traumatic birth. The vaginal delivery involved induction, episiotomy and loss of a lot of blood. I felt like I was sitting on shards of glass for days. It was a punishment for being a woman. ELCS was a breeze. I recommend every woman request one if that is her choice.

Flowers very sorry to hear that. I guess the problem is that we don’t know how it will be for us individually until it happens.

I ended up with a drip for both DC due to meconium the first time and an (as it turned out, unnecessary) induction for the second. No forceps, ventouse, episiotomy etc. Yes, it was painful even with pain relief but my recovery afterwards was really quick (I went shopping for baby clothes the morning after, wearing a pad for the bleeding of course). I definitely wouldn’t have wanted a C section though because I’m too 🐥

Runaway1 · 25/02/2023 10:37

Zanatdy · 25/02/2023 10:09

CS is more dangerous so they won’t just give one because someone doesn’t want to give birth. Well maybe they do but they shouldn’t when it costs a lot more money. Childbirth is meant to be painful and whilst I had a terrible recovery with DS1 I sailed through labour with Ds2 and DD, not a single stitch and drove home after DD (2.5hrs after birth). I certainly recovered much faster than my best friend who had 2 CS

The consultant told me ELCS is the safest option for the individual mother and child.

LuckySantangelo35 · 25/02/2023 10:45

MargaritMargo · 25/02/2023 08:11

Electing for a section is fine, it’s there for a reason.

not sure why people are putting “ “ around the word natural when referring to a vaginal birth, like it’s not a real thing. Vaginal births are the natural way that humans have babies. There’s no “ “ about it.
Our bodies are designed to give birth vaginally, sections were invented.

If there’s options for a section and someone would prefer it then that’s great, absolutely does not guarantee a risk free birth and no complications after.

Have I judged someone I know for having a section under general twice rather than a vaginal birth or an “awake” section? Yes. How are you going to brave a lifetime of parenting when you’re too scared to be awake when they’re born?

@MargaritMargo

cos most parenting challenges don’t involve hours upon hours of excruciating agony, risk of vagina/perineal tearing, fecal and urinary incontinence, vaginal prolapse, etc etc

obviously y

follyfoot37 · 25/02/2023 10:49

bluelollipop99 · 24/02/2023 23:38

I have a lovely friend who is 36 weeks pregnant, ( her first baby ) , and she mentioned she was having an ELCS.

I asked if the baby was breech, and she said "no medical reason, but I didn't want hours of absolute agony, being told too short staffed for an epidural, tearing , never being the same down there again , feeling tearing with a 25% risk of an EMCS anyway. The NHS will never tell you this , but the NICE guidelines say if you request an ELCS they have to give you one, even if the midwives fuss about it."

I had a great fear of giving birth, but went ahead with vaginal birth as there was the clear pressure at the hospital that having an ELCS for non medical reasons made you "less of a women."

But thinking about it , my cousin had an ELCS at the same time and her recovery was not significantly longer than mine; to make up for the agony I went through.

I also think it's a bit bad that you only get this of you are literate enough to check the NICE guidelines.

AIBU unreasonable to think ELCS is often the best option for some people, and good on her for not being shamed / guilted out of this ?

Why do you need to be literate to read the NICE guidance - it isn't written in Runes or some archaic Old English for god's sake

  • let's be honest, if people come on here for medical advice, they aren't going to bother with actual advice from a professional body or anyone who has undergone several years of medical training midwifery training so deserve everything they get