How do you discipline a "spirited" toddler?

[MooseBreath]

I am at my wits' end.

DS is 2y9m and an absolute terror spirited. I hate saying spirited because it's associated with parents who let their children run riot, but DS is seemingly feral. He has been hitting, pushing, biting, shouting, rejecting bedtime, and constantly challenging every single boundary, no matter how tiny. He has a relatively new baby brother (4m), but has been very good with the baby.

When he does something wrong, I tell him nicely not to do that and redirect him. If he does it again, I give him a warning, and a third time results in "time out". For this, I put him on a mat in the hall, explain calmly but firmly why he is in time out, leave him for 2 minutes, come back and explain again why he was in time out, and he says sorry then we hug and I tell him that I love him.

Over the past 2 weeks, nursery has told us 3/4 of his sessions that he has been pushing other children. Before this, it was only DH and I that bore the brunt of the pushing, and I am so concerned about his behaviour now impacting other children.

I have no idea what to do. DS is such a sweet, loving, funny, curious little boy. He is so smart. He can count to 30 (including objects), name and identify all the letters of the alphabet, speak in perfect sentences, and had excellent dexterity, so I don't think it's an inability to communicate. The terrible twos are making it so hard for my wonderful boy to be the child I know he could be.

AIBU to ask what to do? Boundaries are clear and set, DH and I are consistent and a team.

He’s naughty and you’re being too soft on him 🤷🏼‍♀️ raise your voice a little. And don’t do ‘third chances’ if he bites or pushes, punishment there and then.

Magic 1,2,3 worked on ours. Well, made us feel we were doing something anyway.
You need to buy the book and read through quickly. It’s

‘that’s 1’

carries on…

’that’s 2’

carries on

‘3’ and put them in your place of choice.

It stops a lot of it at ‘that’s 1’

So, like what you’re doing, but really stripped back and no chatting.

He's 2 and has had a big change in his life. 2 year olds are going through big development leaps. Parents will have their own preferred strategies for discipline, but what matters is that the chosen approach is consistent and appropriate.

Personally I would look at the situations where the behaviour happens and aim to set him up to succeed. Then when boundaries that are challenged are clearly, lovingly and firmly held, probably with not as many chances as you're given. I tended to say "X is not acceptable. You have a choice A or B. If X happened again there was a logical consequence". Any hitting/pushing/shoving was an instant removal from the situation though.

To me there's too much grey area and all the different chances is making it hard for him to work out what's acceptable and isn't.

I'd also add, fulsome praise for when he's doing the behaviours that you wish for.

We do loads of praise for good behaviour, I forgot to mention that!

@LolaSmiles When you say "remove him", what do you actually say or remove him to?

It's difficult to pinpoint behaviours because at the moment, it is honestly all of them. Currently, every waking moment is a huge challenge.

I wouldn’t give him three chances with anything that might hurt you or another child. Pushing, biting, hitting ect - you immediately remove him and stop the game or go home.

With shouting or general naughtiness I’d give one warning ‘don’t do X do Y, or we’re going home’. Then go home (or stop what you’re doing) if he doesn’t.

Your current strategy feels a bit like you’re teaching him that it’s OK to be naughty for a while.

DD has been on the receiving end of a bite, that the parent said a very mild ‘no we don’t do that’ after. I thought that was quite shitty of them.

I agree with less chatting. They just don’t understand it. It has to be super simple.

Is he getting enough sleep? My “spirited” child woke very early and her hitting almost happened at particular times of day when she was hungry/tired. Getting her to sleep later was impossible so I tried to get her to bed earlier, or naps at the weekend (enforced via a long buggy walk if necessary).

I repeated to my child over and over again before nursery: what do you do if something makes you cross? (answer “tell a teacher”). What do you not do? (answer: hit or hurt). Over time this made a real difference, I think.

You may need the nursery’s help in figuring out if there are particular times or triggers for the pushing, to see whether this gives clues towards the solution.

He will grow out of it. He’s just less good at controlling his reactions right now than some other kids. Good luck.

He isn't getting enough sleep. He stays awake at least an hour after being put to bed at 7:30 and is waking at 5 and is then grumpy because he's still tired. He has a GroClock, but ignores it or unplugs it. He is also supposed to nap for an hour, but keeps waking after 20 minutes.

He's still young. Yes the behaviour he is displaying is not on and he needs to be disciplined but it can take a little while for kids to realise mum means it. Don't give in to him. Stick with the warnings then time outs. I would give time out immediately for things like hitting or pushing though. He will soon get it and start reacting to consequences but you cannot give in.

No naps! He clearly doesn’t need them anymore.

Get him out of the house and exercising in the morning or afternoon, whichever works for you.

if he hurts another child somewhere you immediately remove him from the situation (soft play, park) whatever and go straight home. You have to tell him why, don’t be angry but be very clear.

7:30 is probably too late for him. Start bedtime at 5:30/6ish with a view of getting him into bed for 6:30 latest.

Be firm and use instant repercussions. If he bites/hits you you remove yourself from the room immediately (making sure he’s safe) and once he’s calm you explain why. If he’s using a toy to hurt you take the toy away and explain why.

1,2,3 doesn’t work for him. You have to set examples at home so he’s not doing behaviours you don’t want at nursery expecting 3 chances.

Also I found time outs didn't work for my son. They made him angrier and angrier.
He reacted better to consequences such as leaving somewhere, stopping the game, toys away, no book before bed etc.

I've found that taking away a toy or no book, etc. makes him way worse, which is why I use time out so that he can calm down.

I recommend reading some Sarah Ockwell smith because the whole naughty step thing is outdated nonsense. Your child is essentially still a baby with no impulse control, you need to help regulate his feelings not isolate him from you.

Sorry if that sounds harsh but you really need to adjust your expectations, as do a number of people commenting on this post.

For a 2 year old?

I'm sure you will have a great relationship when he grows up.

Drop the nap.

I don't think my expectations are unrealistic - I don't want my DS to hit, push, and bite. We talk about emotions all the time and it's clearly not helping him regulate his feelings.

**RedRobyn2021 · Today 21:06

I recommend reading some Sarah Ockwell smith because the whole naughty step thing is outdated nonsense. Your child is essentially still a baby with no impulse control, you need to help regulate his feelings not isolate him from you.

Sorry if that sounds harsh but you really need to adjust your expectations, as do a number of people commenting on this post.**

I'm an Early Years Lead Educator and agree with this 100%

It’s might not be about praise but attention. He has probably spent the last year with distracted parents due to pregnancy and a new baby. When his behaviour isn’t what you want, he gets attention. It’s likely that no matter what you think he doesn’t get enough from you when he is behaving. A short statement of praise isn’t always enough; do you have lengthy (more than an hour) daily one on one time with him? It could be he had learnt that the way to get your attention isn’t by behaving well.

Well no because he’s 3 and 3 year olds are too little for complex emotional chat. See the ‘gentle parenting’ thread from a couple of days ago.

It sounds like you know what to do. He is getting over excited. A new brother is probably causing him a little anxiety and excitement even if he isn't mean to the baby (which is good). Then when it gets too much and you are in conflict over anything he can't control his feelings and it kicks off.

All three of mine did this. It was exhausting. The youngest went through a phase of biting people just because she was pleased to see them and we were like shit dog owners shouting 'don't worry she's friendly!'. Between pre-empting known triggers (if turning the TV off before leaving for nursery causes tantrums switch don't turn TV on in the morning for example), firm boundaries (1,2,3 is good, I am glad I never got to three as I didn't know what to do then) and reducing stressors (don't talk when they are losing it, they can't hear you, it's just annoying noise) we muddled through. They are non-biting teens now who are all quite lovely.

It is completely normal. The other children at nursery will be doing it too. He is still a sweet little boy.

That's harsh redrobyn, no? The child in question is almost 3, definitely not too young to understand consequences.
My son is 4 so maybe some of my consequences are too old for the child in question but they were my examples.
My son knows if I have asked him to get ready for bed and he continues not to listen to me he won't get his bedtime story. Not exactly ruining our relationship I wouldn't say!

@Moonicorn But then what do I do to help regulate his feelings? Because I thought I was doing the right thing.

DS gets about 30 minutes of undivided attention twice per day. Anything more is unrealistic, as much as I wish I could give more.

Can you/nursery really look at what happens when he pushes/hits/bites - are there common times, triggers, locations, things leading up to it… when we started keeping a diary we realised fairly quickly that DC1 was for example hugely triggered by transitions- so when getting ready to go somewhere, leave somewhere etc. Gave him a sand timer clock to count down to leaving and problem improved. DC1 was incapable of playing nicely with other children with certain toys, those toys got retired. Every child is different but your DS will be doing this for reasons.

And I’d drop the nap and really work on bedtime/getting enough night time sleep.

So he gets one out of every 24 hours? Is it really undivided or does he tag along with you whilst you shop or are planning things/dealing with life admin etc? Unfortunately you need to find the time for him; it’s no good saying it’s unrealistic.