To think schoolgirls wearing exposing skirts isn’t a feminism issue but a safeguarding one?!

[Moonicorn]

Following on from the thread about skirt length inspections, AIBU to think stopping underage girls from revealing their underwear and bum cheeks to male teachers (or any teachers) isn’t ‘internalised misogyny’ but basic safeguarding?

Or am I just ‘not enlightened enough’ to understand that underage girls can expose what they want to grown men as long as they’re ‘happy and comfortable’ with it?

Disclaimer: I believe adult women can wear whatever TF they want and are not responsible for men’s reactions to them, but this is about children which is a different ball game.

Interested to know your thoughts!

We do have a dress code policy. They have detentions but they and their parents do not care … and this is why we get situations where schools take drastic measures as each and every day pupils come in not adhering to the rules.

Absolutely

Who said they are sexually attracted. I think male teachers in these instances said they feel uncomfortable.

I used to work in a youth centre. it was for both genders, but mostly it was boys that came in. They were 12 -13 years old.

If they all came into the centre with their bums showing, I would have felt massively uncomfortable. In fact I think I would have stopped working there it would have made me feel so uncomfortable. It's just wrong to have to look at young teenagers bottoms. I would feel terrible.

And teachers have to see this every day.

I’ve seen girl’s labia as I’m teaching (to ex wear things without tights) - it embarrasses me and I’m an old woman. God knows how my 20 something colleagues feel.

*they wear

Because that’s what they see at home. What their parents allow them to see on TV. How they see people dressed to go out. What they see if they are let loose to roam the streets where they live. We live in a hyper sexualised culture, and parents choose not to protect their children from it. I guess for some it’s too much like hard work. But some seem to be good at it and it’s not an issue for them. So it’s probably mostly down to parents attitudes, what they let them do, and the types of people they let them hang around with.

Oh I absolutely agree, completely, however having a teenage DD, I know that the boys are the main instigators of bullying and sexual harassment in her school.
It's not something I like, or can change- outside of ensuring that my male child does not involve himself or see that type of behaviour as acceptable.

I also say this as a victim of a sexual attack by two boys I attended school with. The school did nothing, the police didn't intervene much, they didn't learn, just moved on to more girls that were vulnerable to their attacks.

I wish that the world wasn't like this.

But... other than you, did anyone care? Is this just a generational thing? The next logical step in feminism and freedom for girls?

Honestly I feel that some people would defend a girl’s right to go to school naked if she wished.

I don’t know why some people’s version of feminism seems to demand the total abolition of basic dress codes, in each and every setting, when it comes to young girls.

Exactly.
The same argument could be made that male teachers should leave if they are uncomfortable with the sexuality of their female students.
Arguably they are not suited to teaching that age group.

I report the dress code to pastoral. The pupils have detentions (which are challenged by parents/guardians because they’re not badly behaved etc …) but nothing changes.

I do not condone “she asked for it” culture and want my own daughter to avoid sexual harassment. I don’t know whether it Rd because I grew up in 90s grunge but it does make me feel uncomfortable to see areoles and labia when I’m teaching. If I worked in another workplace I don’t think I would see this.

Upbringing?

I don't actually think a single person has defended the wearing of the shirt skirts. Can anyone point out the posts wear people are saying it's ok?

Mooshamoo · Today 19:45
Who said they are sexually attracted. I think male teachers in these instances said they feel uncomfortable.

That’s the feminist spin on this, at the beginning of the thread.
The male teachers are the problem here. If they are not sexually attracted to the children, there is no problem. Let them wear what they wish.
If they have a problem with it, it’s sexual attraction and they should be sacked because they shouldn’t not be allowed near children.

It is this sort of thinking that sets women back in society.

You mean other than the feminist ideologues; the posters saying their daughters do it but what can they do? The poster saying her daughter has a short stretch skirt that rides up when she walks and when she sits down; The posters saying its normal and they used to do it when they were young; The consensus here is that parents approve and condone the flouting of dress codes, because it’s part of life, they used to do it, and if teachers have a problem with it, it’s the teachers problem for being attracted to children.

Not one parent has said they would stop their daughters from doing it, or discipline them if they did.

So I think approval is fairly universal among parents here.

I think the participating male teachers and the school head in that school should be put on administrative leave pending a full enquiry into their behaviour, and if the head had the option to ask female teachers to decided to use male teachers instead, they should be sacked. And I don’t think male teachers should be able to hide behind the old excuse of, ‘I was only following orders.’

How ridiculous.

When I worked in schools, there was always a rule to never speak to a child alone, and if it HAD to be alone prop the door open because false allegations/infatuations DID happen. It’s not about male teachers being sexually attracted (what about lesbian teachers?) but being careful as to jot out yourself in a difficult position. To me thats perhaps why girls shouldn’t have a god given right to show the staff what they had for breakfast via a tony skirt.

Also when I worked in schools (not too recent past) even the most staunch of feminist teachers disagreed with girls having tiny crotch/bum flashing skirts. These are children FFS it’s in no one’s interest to sexualise them

Are you talking about this post?
She isn't saying her daughter wears it. I can't see a post where anyone is saying that.

Sorry @WillowBeeT i see your post was most likely sarctastic (it’s been a long day here at Obstinate HQ)

I can't see on this particular thread where anyone is saying that it's ok.

What people are going against is the "she asked for it" mentality.

Most people were saying that the girls should wear trousers.

I don't have a daughter but if I did I wouldn't allow her to dress in a way that was indecent. I wouldn't allow my son to go around the streets topless, but it would be fine for the beach.

I do think that there is a weird over the top focus in society about how girls and women dress and it starts early on. Some schools still in this day and age won't allow trousers for girls for example.

But who is saying girls are asking for it by wearing short skirts?

Theyre breaking the dress code so they ARE asking for a bollocking the same if boys did for not wearing their ties properly

The issue is not that male teachers would be sexually attracted and that they are therefore the problem. The issue is that by having it all out on display, teachers and other students have no choice but to see and can then be accused of perving, looking, etc. In a society where now, allegations of any kind are taken v v seriously and can be career ending, putting people on the sex offenders register etc it's not fair to put them in that position. They can say til they're blue in the face that they were not attracted, were not perving etc but judging by some of the posters on this thread, they'll not be believed as they're make so = guilty. Better for all concerned if an appropriate dress code is actually enforced.

So I have a direct F2F conversation that told me my daughter was provocative with her legs. Distracting boys. She’s the problem. I’m furious that provocative has ever been used.

@Skirtingtheissue and was she?

Reality is that not ONE girl wore a skirt of any kind when we had Covid safe regulations. Not one.