to think about leaving DH due to infertility

[backoftheplane]

DH and I have been together nearly 11 years (for context, he's actually DP, we're not married but we've just been together for ages and that's how we refer to each other). We found out last year that we have no chance of conceiving naturally due to male factor infertility. I want to explore whether ICSI is an option. I found an excellent fertility doctor for DH a month ago and he still hasn't made an appointment. He said he wants to think about whether or not he even does. I'm devastated. I've posted previously about how depressed the whole situation is making me. Beyond saying he wants to "think about it" DH won't talk about it (he gets angry when I bring it up). He has said no to donor sperm (which I tend to feel the same way about). I just want him to go get a scan. I want to know that we did everything we could. He says he definitely wouldn't have an operation - even the small one needed if ICSI were to be an option. I'm not coping, and I'm considering leaving – but this also feels unfair to DH. When I brought it up again today he snapped that he wouldn't put pressure on me if the situation were reversed.

I've been looking at a lot of previous MN posts about this. It seems that when women who are infertile post about their male partners leaving because of infertility, the overwhelming advice is that the male partner is awful, should be prioritising the female partner with infertility issues and standing by them etc.

When it's the opposite way (my situation) – a woman who is with a male partner with male factor infertility, the overwhelming advice is to leave because otherwise the female partner will regret not having children.

I'm so torn. I know it's not necessarily fair to leave because of something outside of DH's control – but I do feel like it is within his control to explore our options, and he is not doing this. And, even if I do leave where does that leave me? I'm not automatically just going to have children. I'm 38. I will be grieving the end of a decade-long relationship, trying to set up my whole life again, and I'm sure that partners that you want to have children with don't just suddenly appear. So instead of being childless and in a relationship, I would be childless and single. I'm not interested in 'going it alone' either – I simply don't have the support network or financial security on my own.

I just think about the future and feel so sad and lonely. I also live on the other side of the world to all my family and good friends, and I just don't know where to turn.

Please note, I am NOT looking for suggestions like adoption, donor sperm, lifestyle changes etc... I have spent 6 months looking into this and I already know what my options are and what would / wouldn't work for us.

We had ICSI and my partner never had surgery only had to give sample in hospital xxx

Then your choices leave you where you are now. if you think your only chance having children now leaving finding another partner and conceiving, personally I think that's pretty unrealistic.

so the real question is do you want to stay with him or not?
you don't need to decide now, it doesn't matter, want to come to terms with not being able to start a family anyway.

Icsi doesn't require surgery, it is a technique to inject the egg with one sperm. It sounds like your partner might have very low / no sperm (if he might need surgical extraction) or a potential variceole (if he needs a scan).
It sounds quite overwhelming and it might be he is struggling to process what is happening and the potential treatments.

I'm sorry you're not getting on right now, I hope you are able to talk openly and both of you can share how you feel and find a way forward that you're both comfortable with.

Check this out for sure. Many years ago we had ICSI and there was no surgical intervention for him. The difference between that and IVF is that the sperm is injected into the eggs directly instead of just in a dish etc. I think the only surgical intervention is if the sperm is not moving at all then I think it's extracted.

DH earns a lot more than me and he has paid off our mortgage so we are financially stable enough to have a child together

'We' aren't. He is. You're calling him DH when he's a DP and he paid off a house and you can't afford rent. Is the house in both your names? Who didn't want to get married?

I'm sensing a general lack of equality. If you were a millionaire, would you leave and have a baby alone?

As an aside why don't you want to marry your boyfriend? Do you have any security or does he hold all the cards, it is right for your boyfriend to hold the cards if he has put the money in.

Being together 11 years and waiting until you are 38 to start trying was always a risky strategy. And while you could find someone quickly and get pregnant quickly, time is really against you.

i think referring to each other as husband and wife id also a really bad idea. You're not his wife. You're bit financially secure in your own and have none of the legal benefits of marriage. I think the refusing to engage with infertility treatment when he was wanting to ttc is a small part of a bigger issue.

why are you not married? It isnt like neither of you ‘believes’ in marriage as you refer to each other as you are. So why no actually legal wedding in 11 years?

and the mortgage is paid off. Whose name is on the house deeds? Both?

I have quoted what I think are some key points:

DH won't talk about it (he gets angry when I bring it up). - and he won't have counselling

I just think about the future and feel so sad and lonely. I also live on the other side of the world to all my family and good friends, and I just don't know where to turn.

Things are not good between me and DP at the moment (and haven't been since we found out about infertility six months ago), I'm so far away from any kind of support, I probably won't have children (or anything that goes with that), and my mental health is a complete mess.

If I were to leave, I would barely be able to afford to rent a place on my own given the rising cost of living, let alone afford to properly support a child as a single parent (DH earns a lot more than me and he has paid off our mortgage so we are financially stable enough to have a child together).

Firstly you are not actually married so you are in a vulnerable position and financially dependent on him. How is your home owned; are both your names on the deeds and are you joint tenants or tenants in common with 50% each?

It sounds to me as if your relationship is in a real mess and without any support around you, I can understand that you are feeling very lost. If I were you, I would move back to my home country for a while (and consider making the move permanent) to take care of myself, get support from family and friends, explore options for counselling (sometimes it can take a while to find the right fit). If I were you I would also freeze my eggs ASAP. That will buy you a little bit of time, in case your DP comes around or you decide to go it alone after all. I think individual counselling should help you work out your priorities.

Given that he's refusing to talk about it and refusing couple's counselling, I wouldn't feel any guilt about walking away at this point. It sounds as if financial dependence is the only reason to stay with him atm. That is no real reason to stay.

You need to work out how important it is to you to have children. For me, no man would have been worth giving up motherhood for. But others might feel differently.

I think you are within your rights to leave. It’s not the infertility it’s his lack of doing anything about it when he knows it’s so important to you. We also have male factor infertility. My DH gave up alcohol and caffeine for the 5 years it took us to get pregnant, he took every supplement I gave him religiously including some dodgy Chinese herbs. He tried every diet I suggested and he saw a urologist and had an operation to improve the quality of the sperm. If we hadn’t been successful I would never have left him as we both gave it our all together as a team, and that’s how he parents too. I wouldn’t be able to be with someone who cared so little about something so important to me to even make an appointment.

@blueskies94 unfortunately, this is the situation we are in. He has azoospermia (ie. there is zero sperm), so further exploration is needed to work out if there is any, and then a minor surgery would be needed to retrieve the sperm if any is found. It's all very big 'ifs'

We were in a similar position 20 years ago. I found a charity called Foresight preconception care (now closed) who put us in touch with a local nutritionist. We were also told that there was no choice to conceive naturally due to male infertility but after a few months of no drinking, healthy eating and lots of supplements my husband's sperm health had improved and we conceived naturally. Would he consider this natural route if medical interventions are not an option for him?

@Hoping1 there is no sperm – he has azoospermia. We would only be able to do ICSI if sperm were able to be retrieved via surgery (a big 'if')

Which is more important?

Being with the man you love, or potentially/maybe having a baby?

He should get the treatment so you can both move forward on having a child but you seem to think it ok if he doesn’t go further with the infertility investigations. He should be so nice to you because you are so understanding but if you want a child now is the time to look for a new partner. Your existing partner could leave you for a woman with children further down the line. You could regret not having had a child when it’s not possible anymore for you.

It sounds to me like he's scared. If he doesn't go for the scan, he can still let himself think that he isn't totally infertile, that it can be rectified. So he has a bit of control over his life and masculinity.
You keeping on about it (no criticism - we'd all do the same. I'm just talking from his pov) is going to make him dig his heels in even further because he's going realise just how important this is. And how much he's letting you down if he is infertile. (I doubt he's verbalised this to himself - it'll be all in feelings).
I don't know how you move forward, especially when you're under such tight time constraints. But if the worst came to the worst and he refused to do it ever, how much do you love him? Would you rather be childless with him or with a child either with or without someone else. You do sound like if you had someone else to get pregnant by, you'd leave him, to be honest.

@VenusStarr in our case, it would require surgery as he has azoospermia. There is no sperm. The only way of retrieving the sperm – if there is any – is surgically.

A couple of anecdotes but they are slightly off topic so not sure if helpful or not.

1. Some friends of mine had ICSI. It was for genetic rather than physical reasons so no op needed. It was a slight faff but they conceived on the first go. So it can definitely work. Not sure of the stats for your particular case of course.

2. Slightly different situation but me and my partner delayed TTC for various reasons (health and other). When I finally said "right let's go for it" he said he wanted to wait and think about it for longer. I was really upset as I was worried we would leave it too late. We were at a stand-off. In the end I suggested we leave it 2 months and I wouldn't mention it at all, but after that we had to have a proper serious conversation. I kept to my word. When I brought it up after 2 months he had thought about it and said "yes let's do it". Could you do similar with your DH? Give him a couple of months to process things without feeling he has to keep talking about it, but after that you get to have a serious talk and not be fobbed off.

Good luck anyway.

Neither of you are in the right or wrong here.

He of course feels like a massive failure and doesn’t want to have to deal with this, knowing that there’s a chance he can’t ever have kids and so where would take leave the marriage?

Right now there is a chance that he can do something about it and you may be able to conceive.

If he has these tests done then that could be the relationship over, so he’s literally having to weigh up the risks.

Of course I can completely see your side of things and time isn’t on your side.

You need to decide whether you want your DH or children more.

I would think you are awful to leave him, just like I’d think a man was awful, but I would understand it.
Sometimes the need to have children had to come before your need for a relationship.

Only you can decide what’s more important - a child or DP.
If you decide that it’s a child then you’re going to have to be honest and telling him that you need to leave as if you don’t try and have children now you will never forgive yourself.

Of course there are no guarantees that you will have a baby but if you don’t try you won’t know.

What you can’t do is separate and go looking for someone else, then try and get back with him in s couple of years if it doesn’t work out.

You say you can’t do it alone but there’s no guarantee that a new partner don’t leave as soon as you are pregnant.
I’d be thinking if I can’t do it alone then I won’t have DCs.

OP as much as a truly sympathise with your situation you’re batting back every bit of help perfect strangers are trying to give you with an air of annoyance.

You yourself know your options no one here is going to have a magic answer. But if you want it laid out…

A - Tell DP you are desperately unhappy and if he doesn’t agree to at-least the most simple of tests you’re not sure the relationship will last.

B - Leave DP with the unknown’s, you may meet someone and have children you also may not.

C - Adopt or use donor sperm.
(Which I I know you have said you don’t want.)

All difficult decisions in their own rights, but you have to put yourself first. You can’t force DP to do anything but you can tell him the consequences of your feelings if he doesn’t.

I know I’ll get shot down for this but since he hasn’t taken the step to marry you, I’d have no qualms over keeping an eye out for an “upgrade”. Even try online dating.
If you meet someone you can see a future with you can leave the relationship and crack on with TTC with new partner.
If not, then you’ve still got him as a fallback option so you don’t end up single.

Legally, you’re single until you’re married 👍

I'm not coping, and I'm considering leaving

Sounds like you've opened the back door and got the suitcase down from the loft. When you're ready to leave him, that suggests the damage in your marriage goes far deeper than infertility. That having a baby together would not mend your marriage, and he knows that. He doesn't need a scan, a doctor , or counselling, to tell him it's over.

You're already turning over in your mind, your options and a future for you that doesn't include DH. I think in your heart of hearts, you know its over too.

That must be very painful. For both of you.

Ouch. I bet he feels pretty shit about having no sperm and having to have investigations which may still lead to the conclusion that it’s not possible.

He hasn’t said no. Just that he wants time to think.

I think I would give him time to think but put a deadline on it. Not because you’re being mean and pressuring him but because biology means he can’t take forever. Maybe give him a(nother) month and say you won’t bring it up in that time but you absolutely need a decision at the end of that month.

In the meantime I would be thinking about what is your plan if (a) he agrees to investigations but has no viable sperm or (b) he still says no to investigations. Obviously you may feel very different about DP in scenario (a) than (b).

Good luck. One question which isn’t clear from your posts - how important is having a child to you?

Realistically the only option for you to have your own child is via donor sperm. I know that instinctively this is not something your partner is likely to like or that you necessarily want to consider, but I would suggest that both of your think about it very carefully indeed.

A relative of mine did this, and her husband ultimately went along with it because he loves her and felt that, even if it was not his child, he would be able to love the child because it was hers - and in fact that has proved to be the case: he's been a brilliant father and he and their child have a really close relationship. For what it's worth, the clinic looked for a donor with similar physical characteristics and background to relative's husband. None of them regret the decision.

my hubby had infertility - your hubby is being a dick sorry. Your 38 time is not on your side and he is not willing to sort himself out. Is there a chance he had the snip when he was younger but never told you? Sorry but he sounds like a man that does not want kids.

YANBU - as I see it, you would be leaving because you now each want different things, rather than because he is infertile. Even if you did want to leave because of his infertility, it would be the right thing to do rather than possibly feeling bitter and trapped. He would be free to fing happiness with someone who doesn't want children, which is obviously easier as you get past your 30's.