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Nicola Sturgeon Resigns

364 replies

Blessedwithsunshine · 15/02/2023 10:03

Thoughts?

OP posts:
Plitvice · 15/02/2023 12:33

🌞

MargaritaRita · 15/02/2023 12:34

All political lives, unless they are cut off in midstream at a happy juncture, end in failure, because that is the nature of politics and of human affairs.
Joseph Chamberlain (1977)

BashirWithTheGoodBeard · 15/02/2023 12:37

Hbh17 · 15/02/2023 12:32

I still think that she ran with the gender stuff to force a confrontation with the UK Govt & then thought she could use that to push forward with independence. Even tho the GR Bill was not in her manifesto & is, seemingly, not supported by the majority of her electorate.
Then it all blew up on her face.
But from what I can see, she has failed on independence, on Covid (too many rules for too long) and on health & education.
The hints about financial issues are tantalising but, even without that, it was obvious that she had reached the end.

Oh, its a given that she was trying to force a confrontation. Why she chose that particular issue remains a mystery.

HufflepuffRavenclaw · 15/02/2023 12:37

She had definitely reached the end. She is not going to get her referendum in October 2023. The "de facto" referendum idea is a non-starter. She took over from Salmond in 2014 thinking she would succeed where he failed, and lead Scotland to independence.

Fairly clear that is not going to happen in the next decade, or longer. So she's quit to let someone else deal with the fall out and the mess of spending the last 9 years banging on about IndyRef2, writing papers on it, strategising for it, raising money for it (and then "losing" said money) while all the time taking your eye off the everyday business of economy, health, education.

Userg1234 · 15/02/2023 12:43

Please and sorry for being a dense man, but why would a politician leading a country face discrimination by having gone through/started the menopause? I am not being goady but looking for education

midsomermurderess · 15/02/2023 12:43

I’m sorry to hear this. She is a very talented politician.

TheShellBeach · 15/02/2023 12:44

She's a brilliant politician and an excellent leader. I joined the SNP because of her.
However, the nonsense over the GRR caused me to rethink it all and I have always wondered how the hell she could possibly have thought that people can change sex.
Her blindness in this area was very damaging to women and to women's rights.

tigger1001 · 15/02/2023 12:45

HufflepuffRavenclaw · 15/02/2023 12:18

Her Covid rules were more about being different from Boris. Agree that looking back it's hard to understand how she managed to convince so many that her action was proportionate. How it was OK to have thousands mingling at football matches while it was simultaneously not OK to have a friend in your front room for coffee.

Yep.

And I think many are now questioning that. Looking back it all seems nuts. Especially at the point where our numbers were worse than England who had relaxed their rules.

Untrainedmelody · 15/02/2023 12:46

Good- was sick of her

rioseco · 15/02/2023 12:49

Happy Days😁
2023 the year that keeps on giving.

ismu · 15/02/2023 12:50

TheShellBeach · 15/02/2023 12:44

She's a brilliant politician and an excellent leader. I joined the SNP because of her.
However, the nonsense over the GRR caused me to rethink it all and I have always wondered how the hell she could possibly have thought that people can change sex.
Her blindness in this area was very damaging to women and to women's rights.

There was literally no way to oppose this bill though, that's why it was called in rather than going to the Supreme Court.
The only way to mitigate to increase safeguarding would be through case law, hanging it on Nicola was very convenient.
@tigger1001 as for covid don't pollute this thread with any of those tin hat views and backtracking, the rules were really popular and had a high level of compliance, hindsight is a fine thing and it was her absolutely strongest time.
I think it's odd so many women step back from politics compared to men, and I don't think attributing it to menopause would be wrong.

C8H10N4O2 · 15/02/2023 12:52

ismu · 15/02/2023 10:20

I think it's really worrying. Jacinda Ardern, the female PM of Moldova and now Nicola, and of course Liz Truss ( no matter that she was horrendous, her policies are being revived already). Why are all these female politicians stepping back suddenly?
It's a literal witch hunt- every failure pinned directly on these women and the abuse they personally experience is unbelievable.
GRR was the final straw but don't forget EVERY party in the Parliament voted for it and the recommendation for the reform actually came from Theresa May's Conservatives in 2016.
I can't see any of the available replacements being any use at all, and the only likely woman is anti abortion on religious grounds , careful what you wish for.

"all these female politicians"?

Two women leaders have stepped down this year, one after six years in office, another after eight years in office.

Natalia Gavrilița offered resignation after failing to get her policies through parliament.

Truss left on ground of sheer incompetence.

Have you checked how many are left or how this compares to turnover of male leaders? There are still 17 women leaders just within Europe. Plenty of men have also lasted just a year or so.

As for "literal witch hunt" - presumably you missed some of the reporting on male leaders in Europe?

If the criticisms were the tired of misogynist twaddle on her fashion sense, hair style, baby brain, menopausal woman etc I'd agree with you but they are squarely on policy areas and frankly the leaked emails and financial investigations would be an issue whoever is leader.

ismu · 15/02/2023 12:59

Where are you getting 17 female leaders in Europe @C8H10N4O2 ? I've attached a screenshot from 2021, and apparently there are 44 countries in Europe.

Nicola Sturgeon Resigns
Jizzle · 15/02/2023 13:00

I think it is a huge shame she has stepped down, I think she has been great for Scotland, and despite what a lot of people on here seem to think, great for women and rational policies.

I have a huge amount of respect for how well she has done despite the near constant media harassment and screeching from irrational TERF's.

In her and Arden we have lost two really strong, determined women from front line politics due to the unbelievable stress and pressure that is put on them by the media and men who just want to see them fail.

Abhannmor · 15/02/2023 13:02

Her Covid record is better than that of Johnson. A low bar admittedly. Its easy to say - in retrospect - that Covid restrictions were too draconian

But it was a completely unknown quantity.

  1. Fatal , at least for some people.
  2. No cure
  3. No vaccine.
  4. Overwhelming ICUs.

We watched in some astonishment as England lurched about crazily from ' Let it rip' to lockdown to ' eat out to help out ' back to lockdown ad nauseam.

When people try to revise history they should bear in mind it was only 2020. Even oldies who caught Covid multiple times can remember that far back !

Johnnysgirl · 15/02/2023 13:07

and despite what a lot of people on here seem to think, great for women and rational policies
Can you explain that in more detail @jizzle ? And a little further detail on "irrational terfs" would be useful too 😳

Rhondaa · 15/02/2023 13:09

Abhannmor · 15/02/2023 13:02

Her Covid record is better than that of Johnson. A low bar admittedly. Its easy to say - in retrospect - that Covid restrictions were too draconian

But it was a completely unknown quantity.

  1. Fatal , at least for some people.
  2. No cure
  3. No vaccine.
  4. Overwhelming ICUs.

We watched in some astonishment as England lurched about crazily from ' Let it rip' to lockdown to ' eat out to help out ' back to lockdown ad nauseam.

When people try to revise history they should bear in mind it was only 2020. Even oldies who caught Covid multiple times can remember that far back !

You need to compare her 'covid record' to an equally small country, pop of 5m as opposed to England's 55m. Also pop density of 70 per square km as opposed to England's 434 per square km. Really, really relevant with an infectious disease.

She also ok'd the necessary discharge of untested patients to care homes to make way for the surge yet strangely never got demonised for it.

OMG12 · 15/02/2023 13:13

Botw1 · 15/02/2023 10:26

@ismu

I agree

The lack of decent female politicians or females in position of power is depressing as fuck.

We're getting no where

It’s fine male politicians can stick on a bit of lippy, but some tampons whack on a pink dress and Bobs ya Auntie. Equality restored (statistically)

Northernsouloldies · 15/02/2023 13:21

Good riddance hopefully get a first minister that can accept advice and recall events if they fuck up.

OMG12 · 15/02/2023 13:22

Jizzle · 15/02/2023 13:00

I think it is a huge shame she has stepped down, I think she has been great for Scotland, and despite what a lot of people on here seem to think, great for women and rational policies.

I have a huge amount of respect for how well she has done despite the near constant media harassment and screeching from irrational TERF's.

In her and Arden we have lost two really strong, determined women from front line politics due to the unbelievable stress and pressure that is put on them by the media and men who just want to see them fail.

Ah - you would have put a convicted double rapist in prison with women would you?

”Screeching TERFs” lol. Are these the people seen by the vast majority as rational sensible people concerned about the safety of women and children.

WiIson · 15/02/2023 13:23

How can she be great for women when she's unable to identify what a woman is?

C8H10N4O2 · 15/02/2023 13:25

ismu · 15/02/2023 12:59

Where are you getting 17 female leaders in Europe @C8H10N4O2 ? I've attached a screenshot from 2021, and apparently there are 44 countries in Europe.

As per your map's title it is a map specifically of EU female leaders, not European female leaders.

Its also out of date (Germany no longer has a woman leader) and doesn't show EU specific leads such as Ursula von der Leyen.

C8H10N4O2 · 15/02/2023 13:31

The Daily Mash quick off the mark!

www.thedailymash.co.uk/

Thebestwaytoscareatory · 15/02/2023 13:36

TheShellBeach · 15/02/2023 12:44

She's a brilliant politician and an excellent leader. I joined the SNP because of her.
However, the nonsense over the GRR caused me to rethink it all and I have always wondered how the hell she could possibly have thought that people can change sex.
Her blindness in this area was very damaging to women and to women's rights.

People can change sex officially though, at least in a legal sense, that has not been up for debate or review at any point. The point of the GRR bill was to address concerns raised over the difficulties in obtaining a GRC, which had been raised since the introduction if the GRA in 2004.

As gender recognition is devolved the Scottish government undertook a public consultation on the matter in 2017, which found the majority of respondents favoured changes to the GRA that made it easier to obtain a GRC. They then produced a draft bill, which had cross-party input and support, and undertook a 2nd public consultation in 2019, where again the majority of respondents were in favour of the bill.

Westminster also undertook a consultation on the matter in 2018 but, despite the majority of respondents being in favour of removing most of the barriers to obtaining a GRC, chose not to act on it.

They then spotted an opportunity to sow more division and to distract the public from their own scandals and fiasco and so blocked the Scottish GRR bill from taking effect. What was their reasoning again? That we couldn't possibly have two different GRC standards as we need equality legislation to be uniformed across the UK? That sounds reasonable until you realise that equality legislation is not even remotely uniform across the UK (why devolve parts of it if this is your goal??), the Equalities Act 2010 doesn't even apply to Northern Ireland ffs (but I forgot they don't count as part of the UK in they eyes of Westminster).

Whatever your thoughts on the content of the GRR bill, the fact remains that the Scottish government followed the democratic process and had full parliamentary and public support for the bill. (You can argue as to whether or not there was true public support but, both consultations returned majorities in favour of the changes. If you disagree then you should have participated in the consultations and encouraged others to do so as that's how our democracy works.)

Westminster on the other hand ignored public opinion and rode roughshod over democratic process. If anyone has blindness in these areas it's those who refuse to engage with governments to ensure their views are legitimately heard and those who will happily ignore attacks on the democratic process because they have strong feelings on a subject.

Back to the topic of the thread. I feel it's a shame to loose an experienced, committed and passionate politician but as she alluded to herself it's better to go out willingly than being torn to shreds by your own party.

TheKeatingFive · 15/02/2023 13:40

People can change sex officially though, at least in a legal sense, that has not been up for debate or review at any point.

No one should be advocating enshrining scientific falsehood in law though. So the GRA did need reviewing, but addressing this as a starting point rather than the direction it was taken in.