To be horrified by these ‘baby boxes’?

[TheObstinateHeadstrongGirl]

This just came up on my newsfeed and I’m absolutely horrified by the whole concept of women abandoning their newborns in the US:

www.newschannel10.com/2023/02/10/newborn-surrendered-baby-box-installed-less-than-3-months-ago/?fbclid=IwAR1qz7BbrIeF390b6YXl4mAscw82cTvt-Bzwnp_LMaZMMCjBcpltEZGHav0#ldzrvrvoa7ecauugx04

Im NOT having a go at these women, and this is supposedly to prevent newborns being abandoned in unsafe places.

But surely the answer isn’t “Hey brand new mum with raging hormones, probably depression, who is tired, stressed and not thinking straight - put your baby here for a nice new family” - it should be about supporting mums with PND, improving practical support, healthcare and rights of new mothers and reproductive rights. Not just “Oh well you don’t feel OK today so probably best you don’t be a mum, here’s a little box to pop your baby in”.

My spidey senses were tingling so when I did a bit of further research, the woman who started these is, of course, fiercely anti abortion. So that’s what it’s all about. it’s about not allowing women their reproductive rights but making them go through a birth they don’t want, have the trauma of having a baby they don’t want but it’s OK, and the heartache of giving them away - no harm done ey 😡

I’ll spoil it for you, a huge amount of them are 16 or under. Children who have been the victims of rape and incest

How convenient for the rapist

There are a lot more traumatic reasons that women abandon babes than PND!

You're making a lot of assumptions here, OP.

I think they're doing a good thing.

What do you mean? @Coyoacan

Like it or not, circumstances mean these boxes are needed. They save lives.

Not wanting to be a mother or parent isn't always to do with ruddy PND

Not wanting to be a mother or parent isn't always to do with ruddy PND

But does anyone know why a mother cannot just take their baby and hand the child over to the authorities?

Sorry if this has been said already, haven’t read the full thread yet, but in a country like the US with such terrible sex education, strict anti abortion laws in some states, and religious pressures, these boxes can be absolute life savers to both the child and the mother.

it’s awful that in this day and age, they are needed when there are other options and preventions available.

I feel so sorry for anyone who feels they have no other option but to give up their child.

In some places having a child out of wedlock is a huge no no and very frowned upon.

Perhaps these women and girls were afraid of this.

This stuff is driven by the adoption industry. That’s the unspoken subtext with a lot of anti-abortion activism. Much less bureacratic hassle in selling on an abandoned baby with no mother on the scene. If the mother gives up the child officially then she’ll still have ties to it and the social services will try to help her keep her kid, and even if she gives it up she might want to see it after adoption.

You need to better understand U.S. culture , OP. This program works very well and saves babies.

Dave, are you part of the adoption industry by any chance?

This. 1,000 x this.

This stuff is driven by the adoption industry. That’s the unspoken subtext with a lot of anti-abortion activism

That certainly makes sense.

I think you're misunderstanding the choices some of these women/girls make. It isnt
A. keep the baby and struggle or
B.conveniently get rid of the baby

We havent somehow we've made B so appealing women will be enticed to surrender a child.

Do you believe needle exchanges 'encourage' people to take drugs? Does a life jacket encourage you to jump in a canal? These are emergency safeguards not lifestyle choices.

The choices some of these women face is
A. Put the baby in the box where you know it will safe
B. Leave the baby someone else.

There are states in US where abortion is illegal. Women are forced to bring life into this world that they aren't able to take on that responsibility.

I'm pretty sure there is a wealth of information at this point to encourage contact.

I don’t believe for a second that it encourages woman to drop off their babies just because they’re ‘having a bad day’. If someone has reached that point it’s better the baby is left safely. I don’t think it’s the case that if you leave the baby in the box you’ve surrendered them and can never have them back, that’s not the case when babies are left elsewhere. The story I saw about the boxes it was very rare (and thus newsworthy) that they were actually used

There’s no easy solution to baby abandonment, even with supportive programs there will always be ones that fall through the net. It seems better to respond pragmatically and have these, than have more babies left to die of exposure.

Some women will have PND, some will be girls as well as women, and victims of abuse. Others will abandon a baby so as to not be traced later on. Some will simply just not want a baby. Voluntary relinquishments are rare in the UK because of abortion laws, but it’s a different story in countries where it is harder to obtain.

I think there is a balance to be struck between supporting a woman to keep a child if that’s what she wants, and supporting her in relinquishing one if she doesn’t. I do think those women in the latter category can be treated like they don’t actually know their own mind, which can lead to pressure to keep a child because ‘that’s what a woman wants, really’.

Belalala it should be hard to relinquish a baby because the mother baby dyad has a value above its two component parts. Adoption is already a worse option that that baby having a well and supported mother and if you make relinquishment easy then you have no way of knowing whether the mother was well or could access support . You do make it easier to hide abuse, incest, trafficking and lots of other issues that affect girls and women. You make it easier for the rapists and abusers to escape justice. Even if non of those factors come in to play we see that if women can access basic income support and housing then they hardly ever chose to place their babies for adoption. Compare the uk stats versus the USA ones and you see that their adoption industry is driven by the economic vulnerability of women. It will be further supported by the reduction in women’s control over their own fertility.

Baby box users represent the women and girls most likely to be victims of abuse but any girl or woman easily able to relinquish a baby is also likely to be vulnerable to external pressures. The safety of babies and females should not be driven by convenience. That signature on an adoption paperwork is no moment of empowerment.

When I came accross this I was also horrified a few months back but once I had time to think I totally agree with it now. Women,girls who've been raped and ended up with unwanted pregnancy at least it gives them another option rather than abort a child. Also all the dumped babies still see it in uk wouldn't we much rather they were put somewhere safely where they will be taken and cared for by professionals who know how to care for them.

Except these boxes are not a new thing.
these boxes have been around for years.
a great alternative for babies being dumped (by (for-example, teenage moms, struggling parents, unexpected moms/ moms with drug problems) in bad places and the babies not making it.
it’s also only for babies up to a certain age

These boxes were started in 1999 and are prevalent across Europe.

Do you think these countries are just super keen on women getting pregnant and abandoning their babies so they're refusing to do anything but put safety boxes out for the babies?

An av of 1 baby a week is abandoned in the UK

Wanting your baby adopted outside of your family brings lots of problems. In a lot of cases, if the birth mother is opposed to her relatives having residency, it causes her to be ostracised. Then there's the Father's side. Forcing them to go down the paper trail route could put them in danger, especially in a gun owning country. I wonder why someone would dump a baby in a place it would only be found dead, which happens often in the UK, but they do. These boxes save the lives of babies and probably quite a few of their mother's lives, as well. We can deny it all we want, but there's a stigma to giving up your baby, still.

I support anything that saves a baby's life

Wanting your baby adopted outside of your family brings lots of problems. In a lot of cases, if the birth mother is opposed to her relatives having residency, it causes her to be ostracised. Then there's the Father's side. Forcing them to go down the paper trail route could put them in danger, especially in a gun owning country

That is an interesting and valid point, however what you are saying that this a way to circumvent the law, which is not fit for purpose, and to desenfranchise the father

baby boxes have been around for a while, prior to this there were certain "acceptable" safe havens HOWEVER some of those spots/places can no longer offer this help (churches are often locked all day and firehalls don't have staff walking the grounds).
it remains illegal in usa, canada, uk (quick google not all inclusive) to abandon a baby in an unsafe space.
so it's helpful to have safe boxes (the canadian ones are in big inner cities).
most of the babies are not from safe loving environments they are from drug addicted homeless rough living circumstances a population of women who are not engaging with figures of authority.

How long would it take to change US law in every state to allow safe abortions?

How long would it take to introduce proper health care and benefits for mums/pregnant woman in the US?

How long would it take to change the opinion in some communities about births out of wedlock?

How long would it take to provide proper support for women who fall pregnant after being raped?

Of course all of the above should happen. And people should never stop campaigning.

But the thing is OP, all of the things you mention will take a fuck ton of money and time to fix - and that’s providing those in charge have the appetite to do so….which is doubtful.

In the meantime babies will continue to be abandoned. At least these boxes provide a safe place in the meantime. Babies will still be abandoned, even without the boxes - and there’s a very good chance that they’ll die.

There are very very few babies abandoned in these boxes - 8 last year? - so it’s hardly encouraging a flood of women to hand over their baby when the going gets tough.

These boxes have been in existence since medieval times. They’re a safe solution to a dilemma.