Shook up by death of someone I don't know

[Greengables4]

I knew who she was, she dated a guy I used to chat to a bit. I'd seen her on social media but didn't know her in person, though she had one or two mutual friends. She was pretty and seemed popular with a loving family. She lived in my area.
She committed suicide a few days ago and was only in her early 20s. I find it so heartbreaking, even if I didn't know her. It's really got me down for some reason, I like many others cannot comprehend why, but I suppose only the people who take their own lives know why, they have their reasons.
Does anybody else ever feel like this if they didn't know the person? I felt the same after Caroline Flack, chilled to the bone

I know this isn't the point of this thread but I agree with this.

No, I don't think you are overreacting OP. Suicide isn't just sad (though of course it is), it's also scary. When the individual was seriously ill, or had suffered an unbearable trauma, it makes sense. We feel desperately sorry for them, but it's comprehensible. The truly scary cases are the ones in which the victim seemed to have everything to live for. Maybe it scares us because we fear it could be us some day – or somebody we love. I mean, if X could do it, when she was young and bright and chatty and seemed to have everything to live for, maybe we could.

I can think of several examples from my own life. A neighbour was like this. He had a devoted wife, lots of money, a young son and a beautiful house surrounded by fields and woodland. It just made no sense – and the fact that it made no sense terrified me.

Oh god, another competitive grieving thread.

I'm not usually one for sensitivity, but I know someone who took their own life and I can totally understand on a visceral emotional level.

"Committed suicide" sounds like she did something wrong and taints her last actions on this earth... Which is especially awful as the wrongdoing was inflicted upon her (sexual abuse by an institutionally powerful male and the societal response to that).

The above may sound dramatic, but I genuinely believe you'll only understand if you know someone who died by suicide.

If someone who knew her personally used the term while grieving, I wouldn't even comment, but on a random conversation (especially online) like this it's fine to spread a bit of awareness.

It's always shocking and sad when a young person goes. Especially in the case of suicide.
I was once on a Eurostar train coming through France back to England when a young man stepped in front of the train. It was shocking and terribly sad. It was about 5 years ago, and I still think of him often.

I'm not arsed with engaging in a hostile and obviously baiting argument online. I don't care how anyone speaks about the death of their own loved ones. If you want to say they committed suicide, go ahead. As I said in my comment above, I would never comment in response to someone personally grieving for someone they know.

This is a thread about a random person OP doesn't know taking their own life. Someone else pointed out more sensitive language in general, especially for when we don't know how that person's family or friends may feel.

I was relating my own experience about a loved one taking their own life. I agree with what that poster raised as a potential angle/viewpoint, and that is the language I choose to use personally. I actually only heard that distinction recently, so I think it's good for others to learn about it and make up their own minds what language they want to use, if they've been personally affected by suicide. It's certainly not a crime to have mentioned it.

To answer OP's question though, no, I've never felt shaken when hearing that people I know of (but don't know personally) have taken their own lives. At most I feel a mental curiosity and mental sense of "ah how sad". (It's obviously a very different story when it's someone I know personally.)

I wonder if I'm in the majority or minority with that lack of emotion though. I think people who do feel shaken etc (and while it's obviously not a "true" emotion, I also don't think it's performative) are much happier in their own life in general, and thus have a much stronger belief in/assumption of the universal sanctity and happiness of life.

What are WE supposed to say then? I 'get' saying someone has commit suicide is jarring for some, because (as some posters have said,) it harks back to the days when suicide was a criminal offence/a sin.

But what on earth is wrong with 'they took their own life?'

As I said @Move22 what are people meant to say then?!

I agree.
It's not an offence anymore.
But it IS a tragedy.
OP YANBU to feel upset at that happening to someone.
I can think of a few folk over the years, some I've known a wee bit, most I haven't
There 'but for the grace of god etc' could go any of us in the wrong circs.

@Greengables4 YANBU to feel sad and shook up about this young woman's death. The death of anyone is sad, but the younger they are, the worse it is. Someone taking their own life in their 20s is dreadful... it's bad at any age, but if they are in their 20s, it's so sad.

Sadly, I have known about 7 people who took their own life over the past 20 years. 3 of them were in their 20s. 2 in their early 40s, and 2 in their 50s. 5 women, 2 men. Despite the stats I have read about more men taking their own life than women - I have known more women. Don't know of anyone who has taken their own life after the age of 55 oddly.

Informing is not 'policing'. I agree with what @Move22 said.

Sorry, I have know 7 people who took their own life, not about 7 people. Actually 7.

I had this girl on my Facebook. i feel so bad for her two best friends

The suggestion is you say 'they took their own life' or 'died by suicide' rather than 'committed suicide'. It is the word 'committed' that is the issue as it harks back to when committing suicide was deemed an immoral action akin to committing murder.

It's one of the fundamentals taught in Mental Health First Aid qualifications as part of the desire to reduce stigma and make mental health something that's OK to speak about, to ask people about and to encourage people to help and be helped, rather than suffer in silence and shame.

You’ve misread the post you quoted. It specifically cites ‘took their own life’ as an option.

I agree with you. My best friend just weeks before her 33rd birthday killed herself. I’m not about to split hairs with which correct term to use.

All I can say is that suicide, for the victim and their friends and family is one of the most terrible and misunderstood ways to die. When the person doesn’t leave a note (as is often the case) you’re also often wondering, why. Even though deep down, you do know the reasons why.

I heard my ex colleague (a bitch and a bully) criticising a close friend and client of our boss, saying how selfish he was to end his own life, yet I’m sure this man hadn’t exactly wanted to gas himself with the exhaust pipe from his own or his parents’ car. This same ex colleague used to tell me, almost with glee, how her DM had witnessed with her grandson, a jumper at the nearest train station, and what it had looked like (I won’t describe it here).

@Greengables4 I think one of the reasons some deaths by suicide shock is because they are people who appear to be living the type of life we think should make them 'happy', or a life that is similar to ours. This is frightening because it means it could be us one day, or someone we love.

YANBU OP, it’s horrible for you.

Who’s ‘we’? @Move22 Not in the UK are you; just to let you know, it’s not considered respectful to hijack a grief thread with fringe terminology attacks.

Back to OP. Of course it’s natural to feel upset by this person’s death and the manner in which she died, as it is upsetting, especially when a young woman, who seemingly from external appearances has everything to live for, is obviously battling some internal upsetting issues, and sadly hasn’t been able to get the necessary support from her family and friends or mental health professionals or suicide charities (Samaritans).

I can’t say I’ve heard of a suicide of someone I didn’t know (I might’ve forgotten) as most people I know who did die in this way, I knew as eg friends or a girlfriend of my brother. A few people recently and over lockdown I’ve seen have died on social media (Facebook/Instagram school friends/acquaintances) then yes, I have been really upset as these people have died either before 50 or on 50 and that’s no age to die either. A few of them it was addictions/drink problems too. People rarely say the real reason online (naturally) unless they know them well, and that’s understandable too.

@GonnaGetGoingReturns (Please note I'm not arguing, just having a conversation out of interest... If this is offensive or upsetting or splitting hairs, my apologies, and please ignore it.)

Perhaps it also depends on the circumstances of death? Everyone with mental health issues will feel deep shame and self-loathing. But in some cases, society itself will have decided this person has done something outwardly shameful (even before they died).

Some examples are being publicly victim blamed (eg for sexual abuse, especially if there are big institutions, legal cases, etc involved), or bankruptcy (common in the region I used to live after a historic economic crisis). "Committed suicide" is almost like a verdict/ confirmation of their guilt and wrongdoing. I know it's just words but yeah...

As if they took their own life because they knew they were guilty. At least, that's how I felt the local press and public narrative went around the person I loved.

OP, I think you may be referring to a lovely young lady known to me - her case is tragic.

Any suicide case is tragic. I’m fed up of hearing on TV, media etc about ‘talk to others’ ‘talk more’ ‘there’s so much support out there for MH’ … the cold stark reality is NO THERE’S NOT! Politicians and professionals keep insisting things are good (re help/support) … well get in the real world, open your eyes … it’s NOT TRUE. Young people are bring horrifically let down by the system! Heads should roll in many cases .. but nothing will happen, nothing will change. 😡

Your reaction is normal. It isn’t “just” the death of this young person , you imagine how her family feel, how it would feel if it was someone closer to you, the utter sadness of a young over son feeling driven to suicide. It’s all part of your empathy.
It will take time to process what has happened and if you feel overwhelmed or very affected in the next weeks make sure you speak to someone. You can always call Cruse or The Samaritans. Look after yourself.