To discourage friendship - gun in house

[Concernedrethis]

So more of a WWYD?

NC again. Possibly outing.

Moved to rural area two years ago. DS (Year 6) has struggled to find his feet. Been bullied horribly. Has three school friends. Some non school friends now.

Recently, one of his school friends (who has male older siblings) told me that his dad has a gun, has a gun licence, has let him shoot it and keeps it for something (I can’t remember what) ‘and protection’.

I have had a few interactions with the parents and they seem nice. They live in town in a terrace house, not a farm.

What would you do?

Previously my DS has been at the house once for a birthday party. They live close by so likely will walk together to and from school when they go up to ‘big school’.

I don’t know how the gun is kept. I don’t know the older siblings well.

Would I be unreasonable to not allow my DS to go to their house? WIBU to ask the mum about it?

I have never known anyone with a gun before. UK based.

Such bollocks. There are plenty of weirdos who know how to behave in public, the police aren’t psychic.

Guns in rural areas are very common.

Must depend on the area. DS’s has been checked once in the last two years.

A family friend is a gamekeeper and has lots of guns (they shoot different distances and accuracy) and gets at least one unannounced visit a year, sometimes more.

I don’t know anyone who has a license and doesn’t take gun safety seriously.

The only person who should have access to the keys to the gun cabinet is the shotgun license holder. No one else should even know where they are kept. That is an absolutely fundamental part of gun ownership and licensing. I have no idea where the keys are and do not want to know and our kids certainly don't. Our gun cabinet is also alarmed.

Dh has guns because he shoots clays at a fairly high level and we have always been very strict about them.

Incidentally, our local police force have been known to do random drop ins to check on guns, locations of keys etc.

I was recently in thw USA and they had a PSA about this in the TV. Basically encouraging having a conversation bout how the gun is stored, who has access and presenting your own worries and boundarie

Of course, the issue always is if the otherwise responsible gun owner has some form of unreported mental health issue. Unless they go to their GP, who will then inform the licensing authority who will remove the guns and license. But unless/until that happens, or someone reports a concern, then there is nothing to trigger (pun fully intended) the withdrawal of the weapons.

This is particularly difficult to police if it is in response to an incident, such as the gun owner coming home to find their partner in the middle of an affair. Have a google, and see how many stories pop up.

A relative of mine had not locked their gun cabinet. They got a fine but was allowed to keep his license.

@Concernedrethis you should talk to the father and let him know his kid has been mouthing of (maybe phrase it better). I grew up in a house with guns and would have been in serious trouble if I told anyone, it's just not the done thing. Good gun owners don't tell just anyone they have weapons at home, and neither should their kids.

I wouldn’t let my DC attend the house. End of discussion.

Find out if the sibling is telling the truth, speak to the Mum - be honest about your concerns.

I know someone whose Dad was on a shooting team - every year the police came out to inspect the gun (locked in a gun cupboard) and the key to the cupboard (also locked away in another part of the house). Is that system in place? The Mum will know. If she doesn’t give you a convincing answer then keep your son away.

Being a licensed gun owner doesn't make you a model citizen.

Derrick Bird - 8 murders
Jake Davison - 5 murders
Thomas Hamilton - 17 murders (16 of them children)

Of course there are many more statistics available. But an adult who is allowing a child to use the gun and boast about it to other minors (if its true) - all I will question is, do you know the state of their mental health in that case or their background?

www.gbnews.uk/news/nhs-gps-to-be-alerted-to-mental-health-of-gun-owners-after-spate-of-fatal-shootings/332294

Both my parents were target shooters so I grew up with firearms in the house (locked away, separately from the ammunition). As said upthread, safety was the emphasis. I knew better than to talk about my parents' firearms at all for security, but I can see how boys in particular might "talk big" at school to show off which might explain the "protection" comment?

DH has shotguns for clay pigeon shooting, so we too have guns in the house (locked away very securely). Most people who aren't family or shooting friends just wouldn't know he had them, as nobody knowing you have them is the best security. As said upthread, the licensing system is strictly supervised by the police, and you must have your GP's sign off at each licence renewal. In rural areas having shotguns for clay pigeon shooting, country sports or pest control isn't that unusual so you probably know more people with guns in their houses than you realise, OP.

I am absolutely horrified and appalled by the idea that DH's equipment for his hobby, if known about, could frighten the parents of any of DS's schoolfriends into stopping DS's little pals from coming to the house or isolate DS at school. [I suspect in a rural area most people wouldn't bat an eyelid but] if a friendship that was important to him was impacted, that would be rubbish for both children. In that situation I would really hope the parents would talk to us and ask any questions/share concerns and hopefully find reassurance. Please do talk to them, OP.

I grew up in a house full of firearms as my Dad shot competitively (not animals). Licensing is strict. There are spot checks. Firearms must be kept in a locked and out of view cabinet at all times (My Dads cabinets were in secured in the loft space).

My ex husband also had firearms and we had to have CCTV and a particular type of house alarm as part of the license conditions. I cannot imagine anybody just having guns laying around, ready to shoot with kids running around.

Why don't you have a conversation with the parents? Perhaps the child is showing off "my Dad's got a gun" as my own son used
to do about his Dad's rifle. I wouldn't hesitate to speak to them if you have concerns but I imagine they can reassure you.

To add, when my ex assaulted me and the police were called, they came and removed his guns in the middle of the night, without warning. They simply don't mess about with stuff like this and any responsible firearms owner knows that.

Has it crossed your mind that this kid is not telling the truth about this ?

A shotgun recoil would possibly send him flying

Guns do have 'working' uses in the UK. My grandfather, father, uncle and cousins all had guns when I was growing up. All licensed and locked away. This just doesn't seem like a 'thing' to be concerned about to me. Crime involving guns like this is incredibly rare, crime involving guns like this perpetuated by the licence holder is even rarer.

@Wonnle totally agree re recoil. I've never attempted to use a shotgun cos there's no way I would cope with the recoil!

Sarah Everard's killer - Wayne Couzens- was a firearms officer who slipped through the net. He apparently shot a classmate for amusement aged 14, with his father's airgun - before joining the Police force as an adult.

Of course, no one is saying all licensed gun owners are potential killers. But Jake Davison was approved for a weapon in 2018, two years after his own mother had referred him to a counter-terrorism programme because she had serious concerns.
Police still allowed Jake Davison to keep the weapon even after he went on to assault two teenagers in a park. (Following this he murdered a 3 year old and 4 adults by shooting)

The police can and do make mistakes and they are privy to classified information that you will not have access to.

In your post there are already red flags. From personal experience - proceed with caution.

We live rurally and the majority of our friends shoot and own guns, from landowners, farmers, farm workers, to incomes who take up rural pursuits.

Therefore it seems very odd to me how worried and upset some people on here are, including talking about not letting their children go into a house where there are guns.
I would say that you wouldn't necessarily know that people owned guns.
The only reason I know about lots of our friends is because they end up on the same shoots as us, or at clay pigeon locally on Sundays.
Gone are the days of the loaded shotgun standing up in the corner, or above the fireplace. Safety is all. We want to keep our guns, and our lives, so we jolly well comply.

I can't remember what age our DC were when we first let them fire a shotgun, upper primary school age, I think, under close body contact supervision. Neither of them took to it, unlike some of our friends' DC.
If they had, a long period of careful and constant supervision and teaching would have ensued.

OP, I would certainly ask these parents about their gun ownership and safety, simply because the word “protection” has been uttered in the same breath as domestic gun ownership. So inappropriate.
You need reassurance that they are sensible and/or they need to know that their children are being indiscreet about guns, and worse, showing off and displaying the unsafe and irresponsible attitudes of people who shouldn't be allowed near guns

People who own guns are pretty normal about it. I'd be happy to tell another parent about how it's locked in the house, that ammunition is kept elsewhere and my DCs do not have access to it.

The majority *of people who own guns (but certainly not all) may be pretty normal about it - from your own experience.

I think at least half, if not more, of the kids in my class at school "had a gun at home". (Rural area, many on farms etc, but also those who lived in "mid terraces"). The laws surrounding guns are EXTREMELY strict and it's highly highly unlikely unless this is an extreme circumstance that the kid will be playing with the gun on his own, let alone knowing where it was even kept in the house. If you've any concerns at all, you absolutely must report it to the police as a matter of urgency.
If the parents are happy to take their kids out with what presumably is an air rifle to practice, power to them. I'd much rather my kids learnt to respect a gun and know how it works than mess about with one and get injured

I wouldn't want him going there I'm afraid.

I am aware it's completely legal to have a gun license and that the laws are strict, but it would be about personal choice for me. The boasting would also reinforce my opinion.

My DH has around 30 guns in our house. Police come around to check our home security and everything is licensed.

I've no idea where the keys are, but they're all locked away in safes that are bolted to the walls/floors.

I couldn't care less.

He's a paediatric doctor, so I'm quite at some of the comments here.

In our parts, it's generally the more well off people who have guns. I'm sure there are plenty of drug dealers too but plenty of sport shooting going on here.

Also - no bunnies. He promised he'd only shoot targets/clay pigeons.

Also to add:

Very, very few people know he has them. Mainly family and his club members.

He would be thoroughly upset if our DC ever told anyone in school.

My husband had a shotgun many years ago, locked in the cellar in a specialist cabinet. We lived very rurally then and he shot clay pigeons on our land.

He sold it when we had children . If he ever wants to shoot now, he books a session at a venue.

In a town-house, “for protection”? No.