to ask why it's seen as rude, unreasonable or seen as taboo to point out certain things

[pillow56]

Example I have seen many threads on mn saying how expensive it is to have kids and how people can't afford them/more kids which is fair enough.

Yet when people both in real life and on mn say that struggling parents who had alot of kids shouldn't have had so many kids if they couldn't afford them then it's an unreasonable thing to say and they get criticised for pointing it out?

Like it's different if the parents had good jobs before the kids came along but they lost them or some unforeseen thing happened that hit the finances but I'm talking about parents who never had cash or a great career before the kids came along. It is perfectly their right to have kids but surely they know that kids equate to expense before they have them so are they surprised?

I'd love to have kids myself but I can't afford them but I wouldn't find it offensive somebody pointing out the financial realities of kids if I suddenly planned to have kids tomorrow. So why do people get offended by this?

Everyone has opinions on how other people choose to live.

It is polite to keep them to yourself.

I cannot fathom how people who are very well off would rather spend £50k extending their four bedroom detached house rather than give the money to a food bank.

But I don't say anything because we can all live our lives how we choose.

after she left the room my other colleague said to us she shouldn't have any more kids then. It was a fair point but the others told her it was a rude comment and I secretly agreed and could see nothing wrong with it

Even IF something were true, doesn't make it not rude to point out.
For example, looks- we all have our flaws, that's true, so why not point them out to everybody? It's true so that's all that matters after all.

The children are here, what is the point in saying shouldn't have had them? It's no different to idiots who give 'helpful' life advice along the lines of "should have done it my way" hmm. Ok, but they didn't do it your way and now it's done and can't be taken back, so unless you have anything useful to say don't say anything

My POV is I agree with the your viewpoint however it doesn’t need vocalising.

I haven’t read all the previous posts but a lot of the early replies are quite defensive and not addressing the situation you described, that someone struggling financially decided to have more children.
But if you are asking whether it’s ok to air that opinion, I don’t think it’s helpful or necessary.

There will always be people who make decisions to live a lifestyle being their means and feel entitled to be financially supported by the government. And there are others who take personal responsibility for funding themselves and their life choices without expectation of financial support.

People want to hear what soothes their ego, but what the truth is.

If they’re able to clothe and feed them and give them the love they needs, what’s your issue

i'm talking about the ones that can't afford to do this, know it but keep having kids....

The children are here, what is the point in saying shouldn't have had them

She said shouldn't have MORE, not had any.

As someone with a lot of children I find this incredibly rude. Both myself and DP work full time and are by no means rich but manage on our wages. The cost of living increase could have put us in poverty if we had debts to manage ( as many low income families do) or didn't have our emergency fund. It doesn't take much to tip the balance if one of us lost our job for some reason.
Families that are large are usually very hard working and for me personally I am proud of the fact that we both work hard and do have our own income without having to rely on the state

Yes but for the zillionth time I'm talking about the parents who DO NOT work, have NO cash, struggle with multiple kids yet keep having more. GO READ MY POSTS BEFORE JUMPING IN WITH THIS BOLLOX,

Your question is about why it’s rude, not why people have kids when they’re hard up, so I’m going to address that. Not everyone finds social nuances easy, and for a lot of people it can be hard to understand why saying something ‘true’ or direct might be ‘rude’.

It’s about the emotional function of conversation.

The most likely effect of telling someone they’ve made decisions you wouldn’t have made in their position, is that they will feel isolated and ashamed. When someone is already having a hard time, it’s not kind or helpful to rub their nose in it by pointing out the ways you feel they have exercised poor judgement.

It would be rude to sit at the bedside of someone dying of lung cancer and say, ‘well, that’s what you get for smoking.’ This might be logical, but is not going to be helpful or comforting. And it won’t be news to them. When someone is already having a hard time, it is unkind to say things that will likely increase their suffering. It’s a case of if you don’t have something nice to say, don’t say anything at all.

Also, as a pp pointed out, it is hurtful to say that someone should not have been born. It is hurtful to people who grew up poor to hear that their very existence would have been best avoided. Sure, that may not be what you mean by saying ‘don’t have kids when you can’t afford them’, but once the kids are there, commenting on whether or not they ought to have been brought into the world is insensitive at best.

We all go through life and make various decisions that make our lives harder. We know the ways our own decisions and behaviour have contributed to our struggles.

I also wonder whether, as someone who does not feel in a good position to have children, some of your own feelings of grief and loss colour your reaction here. It can seem so unfair that people go ahead and have children, when you don’t ‘get’ to have them - because of your own circumstances beyond your control, and the choices you make in light of them. It can feel unfair that other people
feel able to forge ahead regardless of practicalities, and you don’t.

These are such emotive topics. And I am sorry for the r struggles you are dealing with.

There are loads of “matter of fact” things that whilst true and indeed obvious (if you boil it down) but which we as a society have determined over hundreds of years are socially unacceptable and/or impolite to say them (for a variety of complex and evolved reasons)

Do you often struggle with social/societal or cultural norms?

I know people around me who have kid after kid etc and then moan about money but they had no money with 3 kids so why then have another 3

And that was the ethos of my posts and what my colleague was pointing out but most posters here choose to ignore it

Yet when people both in real life and on mn say that struggling parents who had alot of kids shouldn't have had so many kids if they couldn't afford them then it's an unreasonable thing to say and they get criticised for pointing it out?

You can't just get rid of them though. They're here, advice about what they should or shouldn't have done however many years ago their child was conceived isn't doing anything. It's not just pointing out the truth as you say, it's just being rude. If I tell somebody with a big nose that they have a big nose, does it being the truth make it not rude somehow?
And that's just aside from the fact we have no idea how a child came to be, so many instances of abuse and coercion that we hear about. Or even just plain old making a silly decision they can't go back on, which again is very common in all different aspects of life.

the point is the OP doesn’t see why it’s rude to openly tell the person that they shouldn’t have had more kids

nobody said it's openly to the woman.

Yes but for the zillionth time I'm talking about the parents who DO NOT work, have NO cash, struggle with multiple kids yet keep having more. GO READ MY POSTS BEFORE JUMPING IN WITH THIS BOLLOX,

The woman you are talking about was someone you WORKED WITH. People have given you plenty of explanations of why it is rude to say it.

I'd love to have kids myself but I can't afford them but I wouldn't find it offensive somebody pointing out the financial realities of kids if I suddenly planned to have kids tomorrow. So why do people get offended by this?

From your OP…

But That's not saying it openly to the woman who was complaining about her being broke to bot have more kids. There is also a difference to somebody pointing out to me the financial realities of children if I decided to have 1 to telling the woman at work who claimed to be broke to bluntly stop having kids then,

There is also a difference to somebody pointing out to me the financial realities of children if I decided to have 1 to telling the woman at work who claimed to be broke to bluntly stop having kids then

Yeah there is, but the whole point of your thread is that you don’t get why it’s rude… clearly do you get why it’s rude. Glad that’s resolved!

Though actually, whilst it may not offend you, if you pointed out to this work colleague the financial implications of her having more children, it’d still be rude! Nothing wrong with lending an empathetic ear and moving on with your day. The woman may take offence, she may not. But if it’s not a close friend or someone asking for your advice, it’s rude.

You know the intimate details of this woman’s circumstances? You know exactly what she goes home to? Why her husband is unable to work? You know how she was brought up, her religious beliefs? You know what she was brought up with in terms of what family looks like? What she believes about people who are divorced or children brought up on broken homes? You know her husband never coerces her or flat out rapes her?

see, we could turn it on you. There is huge disability discrimination on this site. You can’t be that bad, you’re sat on a computer half the day on MN, why not find a job that that does the same as that? Why are you scrounging off tax payers when you can clearly work?

or is it more complex than that? Is there stuff we can’t see, going on in the background?

Because you really don’t know the situation. I couldn’t afford my fourth child but as I bled heavily throughout the pregnancy and was on tablets to control my ‘heavy periods’ and was also on the depo shot, the doctor (nor me to be fair) tested for pregnancy. (Also because I was 40 and had only 1 fallopian tube) By the time the pregnancy was discovered I was very close to the abortion cut off date. Contrary to popular belief, very few places do late term abortion and the ones that do have a waiting list. The government at that time brought in a two child rule so we couldn’t claim for extra financial support. I had a nervous breakdown, lost my budding new career and struggled so badly after the forced birth I nearly took my own life.

My little girl never needs to know that. I love her just the same as the others. Imagine telling anyone in real life the truth? Why would anyone need to know that? Just to stop the arsehole comments?

If anyone said, ‘well you shouldn’t have had her’ if I dared to say I was struggling I’m not sure I’d be responsible for my actions. You just don’t know why people are in the situations they are in OP so maybe just don’t voice ignorant opinions.

So, Your question seems to basically be “why can we not voice our thoughts at all times about people - even if it may be a true and valid point”??

Surely you are not so thick to understand why most people don’t go through life doing this, even though they’d often like to?

(Clue: because they’d likely end up with no friends and have people going out of their way to avoid them)

I think OP wants a 🏅 for not having children.

@HarrysNeighbourhood when you live rurally and need to work a car is pretty essential
Its also not essential to have 6 kids etc for most thats a want not a need

@HarrysNeighbourhood well i disagree with you
My children loved their sports they also had swimming lessons as i think its a life skill we all should have
But why should they not do a sport they love and enjoy ? Why make them miss out when they were already doing said sport and its helped one so far get quite far in life

@2ApplesShortOfABasket but you have the amount of kids you can support, so taking them to their activities
Would you have had another 3 kids on top knowing the ones you have then have to stop all they do
I my circumstances we had 2 children we could provide a basic life for really , when i say holiday we did the sun £9.50 when little etc
If we had added a third all of the sports would of had to stop , the basic holiday
The op means people that go on and have more and more when they cannot afford the ones they have
Not people who have 2 or 3 and work hard but can provide food and heat the home etc
Or people who loose a job or dh walks out so situation changes
Most people can stretch to 1 or 2 kids , having more has a bigger impact as childcare costs , larger homes , cars etc are needed
The poster said a car isn't essential , well where i live many kids couldn't get to school without a car , parents couldn't get to work
Buses are irregular , they stop at 5.30/6 pm
Anyone having kids should think about what they can offer and the more you have the more you have to consider your finances and your current children
Obviously accidents happen and if it had happened to me I would of had 3 and I guess we would of managed somehow , but we made a choice to stick with 2 and did something to make it stay that way as much as was possible
I don't think its wrong that people should think how they are going go make it work when they are actively choosing bow many kids to have

Op the thing you are wrong with is we can't always say our thoughts
But I have said before to a friend who questioned how we afforded something , that we both work and she currently is a sahm with younger kids and we were in that position then , so when she is able to get back to work them she will able to do the same and that you can't compare when at different stages in life etc

@healthadvice123

I have 5 children. We make it work!