To not have sympathy for my friend?

[lurkinglittleladybug]

I have an old school friend who’s been complaining about her partner taking zero interest in their children. She’s a stay at home mum and her partner works full time and is in a well paid job. He pays the bills and for anything her and the children need but she complains he’s not emotionally present with them. He doesn’t spend any time with them or help out at all with childcare.

I would normally have a low opinion of a man who can’t be arsed to spend time with his kids, and it is a shame for the children. But it’s so difficult to be sympathetic with my friend. I kind of feel like she made her own bed with this situation.

After a year of her being with her partner (at this point they had a really good relationship and lived together) , she knew he was strictly childfree and had no interest in children. So I was surprised when she announced her pregnancy but congratulated her as she was clearly happy about having a baby. She later told me that she knew her partner wouldn’t want to start a family so she just stopped taking the pill without telling him. He stays with her but becomes somewhat emotionally distant, I expect he was in shock. Friend was confident he would change his mind once their baby arrived.

After the baby is born he just takes zero interest, but she has lots of support from family. Nothing changes for a couple of years and then she announces she’s expecting her second child. I congratulate her, again I’m surprised, I had no idea they were trying. She then confides in me that she sabotaged the birth control again, this time the condoms they were using. At this point I make it clear I disapprove of her doing this. She becomes tearful saying what choice did she have and that her child needed a sibling. So I let the subject drop. Not wanting to be the asshole making my pregnant friend cry even though I think it’s a shitty thing to do.

Anyway now she has 2 children and she is complaining about how her partner has just emotionally checked out, not just with her children but also with her. He’s not interested in intimacy and is just going through the motions. It looks like their relationship is well and truly headed for the rocks this time.

I just find it so hard to be sympathetic with her, I mean what did she expect would happen? 🙄… Although obviously I’m very sad for the 2 children who face growing up with an emotionally distant dad…

Am I a terrible friend for not having sympathy for her?

I’m really struggling to stay friends with her knowing what I know, I just feel like I have lost respect for her. Although its difficult to end the friendship because we have known each other for such a long time.

I'm sorry. You feel sorry for HER???

You need your head looking at. Don't go poking holes in fucking condoms trying to trick a bloke into staying with you. Despicable.

On a side note. There's an awful lot if armchair medics on here who seem to think you can just pop to the Drs and pick up a vasectomy. You can't. Unless you pay to go private, there's restrictions and wait lists. That aside, he should have been 99.9% safe from having a child, SHE took that away. She should be reported.

Advise her to get a job and get her finances sorted out as I predict he will move on with a younger, child-free model who hasn't lied through her teeth to him.

Why younger?
Given all that's happened, he'd be way better off with a older, post-meno woman.

Also, I dislike this cliche of 'younger model'. What is this, tabloid hell, where women are not people, but just interchangeable variants of girlfriend-shaped object?

"Model" my arse. <<<chunters off to burn bra, muttering darkly >>>

Distance yourself, but have a heart to heart.

Your feelings are too strong & Not Allowed, but simultaneously, your feeling of empathy is not strong enough, so you are Bad & Wrong.

Your FRIEND did not hurt you - that was her ACTIONS. Naughty actions, running around in the wild, independent of their human!

This list is subject to revision, depending on whether you have achieved parturition, & if you are single or not.

Thank you Luckystar, for bringing such searing insight & clarity to the thread.

😂😂😂😍You're well on form today Pothos 👏

I did bother, & it made no sense. Which is why I asked the question.
You said wouldn't condone it, but you'd stay friends with her. Sure - that's not explicitly condoning it. Just tacitly.

Christ on a bike NO!

Emotionally I'm with you all the way here Whatdo,
But logistically? Imagine the consequences of any legal precedent.

Women aren't believed as readily as men are. Look as any she said/he said statistics. We can't even obtain a rape conviction when we're bleeding & covered in bruises. Who would believe a woman who steadfastly stuck by her truthful assertion that SHE was not the party responsible for contraception sabotage?

Can you imagine what the incel brigade would make of that?
Women AS A CLASS would be stigmatised & undermined even further.
We can't inadvertently punish all women for the selfish & venal actions of a few bad female players.

...or just stop sleeping with his cunt of a wife.

I don’t agree that by not casting her aside I’m condoning her actions. Taken to its logical conclusion, I’d have no friends, as they’ve all made decisions I don’t condone. I’d even not be friends with myself!

😂(Genuine laugh, not snark)

Point taken, I just find this a much more heinous action than most poor decisions & actions. I consider OP's friend to be a domestic abuser, & I don't hang out with DA perps.

Imagine the uproar on here if there was such a thing as male contraceptive pill and a male partner had stopped taking it without telling his partner. And the woman In a case would have a choice over whether to become a mother, unlike the father in this scenario.

I agree with you there. I’m not sure I would cast her aside though, it would depend on how I felt about her DC as much as anything. If her DH does go on his way then the DC are left with just her, on her own.

No, this is just fucking awful and your friend is a scumbag. Laughing that the only way to be “truly” childfree is to get an operation 😂 I’m childfree and have haver wanted kids since age 10 but don’t want to get sterilised as I have been known to do a 180 on various views, and it feels weird to get an operation to remove a function of my body IYSWIM…

I’ve been having sex for 11 years, with DH for 7, only ever used condoms and never had a single accident with one (and this is all brands, Durex, Mates, Poundland’s own). I had a friend at uni who said they “always broke” on him. Methinks some people don’t know how to use them properly and are essentially making up all of the 2% failure rate.

If I was him I would have just changed my name, got plastic surgery and left the country. Can’t think of anything worse than being lumbered with 2 kids you never wanted.

*have never

Ouch, didn't think of that. Gawd, those poor mites. Whether their parents stay together or not, it's a blighted start to life.

Interesting to read the man’s perspective in this situation… I’m sorry you experienced this though, it’s a really shitty thing to not be able to trust the person you’re in a relationship with.

To answer your question, no the husband doesn’t officially know, although I’m sure he has his suspicions after the second ‘accidental pregnancy’… I suspect if she’s told me that she will have also told her sister and her mum, they are very close.

I wouldn’t want to tell him, partly because it’s not my place to and partly because there’s 2 very innocent children who might suffer if the truth comes out and he chooses to leave. I wouldn’t want that on my conscience.

Im meeting my friend later today for coffee and to swap Christmas gifts, not sure if I will bring any of this up, might try to keep things pleasant with it being so close to Christmas and all, although will be difficult if she starts complaining about her relationship problems … I’m going to have to seriously bite my tongue if she does. Wish me luck!

Sorry typo in that last message I said husband, although they are not legally married so just partners… So not a great situation, if this relationship ends not sure how much protection she will have regarding the house etc with not being married, I think it’s all in his name …

Im meeting my friend later today for coffee and to swap Christmas gifts, not sure if I will bring any of this up, might try to keep things pleasant with it being so close to Christmas and all, although will be difficult if she starts complaining about her relationship problems … I’m going to have to seriously bite my tongue if she does. Wish me luck!

You don't need to bite your tongue OR bring it up OP.
You can take a middle option for this pre-xmas meet-up, & keep it light. So don't bring it up yourself, but if SHE does - "oh let's not talk about that now, it's our xmas meet up let's talk about fun things - what did the DC think of the tree decorations?" etc

Then you've got time to process your feelings, & decide what you want to do (if anything), next year.

OP

You say that you don't want to tell him in case he (rightfully) leaves, and then you don't want on your conscience to have broken up the family of two children.

Would you think the same in my hypothetical alternative case - of a husband having sex with his wife in her sleep - that is, assaulting her?
Would you not tell her lest she broke up with him and hence broke up the children's family?

Please examine your conscience. The right thing is the right thing even if it's hard.

I think you missed that the man is a partner not a husband @Bonheurdupasse.

The woman is in a very precarious financial position, and the implications for the children are unthinkable if he ups and leaves.

No, I don’t mean that at all. I mean the children were very much wanted by both the mum and dad and neither felt tricked or trapped by the other actually. Or they were happily childless couples.

Also, I have known couples where one doesn’t want children and the other does. They dealt with it either by compromise or by ending the relationship. One of those couples was the husband who wanted children and the wife wasn’t ready yet. Another was the woman and she went on to have a baby on her own. I can’t remember if it was through an informal anonymous donation or through IVF.

If a woman really wants to have babies then there are much better ways then tricking a man who doesn’t want children. Most women are intelligent enough, mature enough and have enough sense to find an alternative.

I honestly don’t think that I have ever come across a scenario in real life as depicted by the Op.

I have honestly only come across it as a fictional accusation made by misogynists.

I have been in previous relationships with men who have had a vasectomy before the age of 40. Who very much didn’t want children. Good for them in taking personal responsibility.

Vasectomy (unlike hysterectomy) can be reversed and fertility restored. I have also known relationships where vasectomy did not end the relationship.

However, having different views on having children can end a relationship and that is fair enough. No one is obligated to give up their hopes for their future.

Everyone has the freedom to end a relationship that isn’t going in the same direction as they want it to go. Wanting children vs not wanting children is the deal breaker for both men and women, not the vasectomy itself.

I don’t buy into the poor victim man who couldn’t protect himself against unwanted pregnancy. It is absolute bullshit!

I don’t buy into the poor victim man who couldn’t protect himself against unwanted pregnancy. It is absolute bullshit!

I think your sentence is absolute bullshit.

Vasectomy reversal often doesn’t work.

Is this true? Do women really do this?

No sympathy here. She 100% brought this on herself. He never wanted kids, she did, she shouldve left. (and no, it wasn't on him to leave as he was led to believe they were on the same page). Horrendous horrible thing to do to her children and her partner.
To those saying it's on the man, check your bloody morals!!!
To those saying get her finances in order, she shouldve considered all those implications before forcing a person to have children with her.