To not have sympathy for my friend?

[lurkinglittleladybug]

I have an old school friend who’s been complaining about her partner taking zero interest in their children. She’s a stay at home mum and her partner works full time and is in a well paid job. He pays the bills and for anything her and the children need but she complains he’s not emotionally present with them. He doesn’t spend any time with them or help out at all with childcare.

I would normally have a low opinion of a man who can’t be arsed to spend time with his kids, and it is a shame for the children. But it’s so difficult to be sympathetic with my friend. I kind of feel like she made her own bed with this situation.

After a year of her being with her partner (at this point they had a really good relationship and lived together) , she knew he was strictly childfree and had no interest in children. So I was surprised when she announced her pregnancy but congratulated her as she was clearly happy about having a baby. She later told me that she knew her partner wouldn’t want to start a family so she just stopped taking the pill without telling him. He stays with her but becomes somewhat emotionally distant, I expect he was in shock. Friend was confident he would change his mind once their baby arrived.

After the baby is born he just takes zero interest, but she has lots of support from family. Nothing changes for a couple of years and then she announces she’s expecting her second child. I congratulate her, again I’m surprised, I had no idea they were trying. She then confides in me that she sabotaged the birth control again, this time the condoms they were using. At this point I make it clear I disapprove of her doing this. She becomes tearful saying what choice did she have and that her child needed a sibling. So I let the subject drop. Not wanting to be the asshole making my pregnant friend cry even though I think it’s a shitty thing to do.

Anyway now she has 2 children and she is complaining about how her partner has just emotionally checked out, not just with her children but also with her. He’s not interested in intimacy and is just going through the motions. It looks like their relationship is well and truly headed for the rocks this time.

I just find it so hard to be sympathetic with her, I mean what did she expect would happen? 🙄… Although obviously I’m very sad for the 2 children who face growing up with an emotionally distant dad…

Am I a terrible friend for not having sympathy for her?

I’m really struggling to stay friends with her knowing what I know, I just feel like I have lost respect for her. Although its difficult to end the friendship because we have known each other for such a long time.

FFS. I think some posters live in fairyland where everything is the man's fault. Nothing to do with the woman sabotaging the contraception they'd agreed on at all! Obviously he should have known that she'd deliberately deceive him and got a vasectomy instead. 🙄Or never have sex if he didn't want children. Because sex is purely for procreation right?

Obviously not the only one 🙄
00.26

This.

What the friend did was horrific. He clearly didn't let her take care of contraception after the pill "failed" as they were using condoms that she sabotaged. The poor man obviously trusted her. Men shouldn't be told "If you don't want your partner to get pregnant, have an operation." That's ridiculous.

I would struggle to be friends with her after she tricked him into fatherhood the first time.

And of course you can post about it on Mumsnet. What's wrong with that. Only the DF would notice it's about her and quite frankly, that's the very least she deserves.

I feel very sorry for the children and I also feel sorry for him.

So if this was a guy who wanted kids and he sabotaged the contraception, swapping his wife's contraceptive pills for placebos and then making holes in condoms; completely deceiving her to achieve what he wanted, people would blame her for continuing to have sex?

Okaaaaay. ........

I would struggle being her friend. I am actually shocked she admitted it.

I feel sorry for her partner and her kids.

I don't understand posters who are calling you names and blame her partner. She stayed in a relationship with someone who was clear about not wanting kids and then trapped him by sabotaging their contraception.

Vasectomy is not always a solution. My husband has 4 children, 2 with his ex and 2 with me. After my second I asked him to have one as I was definitely done! Even at 46 years old with 4 children the GP was hesitant to perform the operation (he was even asked if our baby daughter died would he not prefer the option to have more children). I don't think this guy would have been able to walk into the GP, request a Vasectomy and just get it done like that.
OP's friend has done a terrible thing, that man's life will never be the same.
He did the right thing after the first 'accident' and took responsibility for contraception which she then compromised to create the second 'accident'.
If I were OPs friend I would have took that secret to the grave with me, if only because I would realise the position I would be putting my friend in. It shouldn't be OPs secret to keep.

That seems a bit unfair. He was using a condom that got sabotaged which frankly should be a crime.

I imagine he wouldn't have consented to sex if he'd been told the whole story about the contraception

Ah good. It is a crime.

Encourage her to go to the police.

I'm not saying the man is at fault, but condoms & pill, and two accidental pregnancies?? Not the smartest.
Woman is stupid for having a second if he wasn't interested in the first.
Feel sorry for the poor kids.
Don't blame you for not wanting to be friends, sounds really messed up, although some people make mistakes that they regret later. Maybe just have a break and see how you feel

What @daretodenim and @Sunbird24 said.
I actually feel a bit sick that she's done that and those poor children who have to grow up that way.
I couldn't even look at her again never mind stay friends.

I'm genuinely ashamed for some posters on here who are suggesting this is the man's fault.

Thread after thread, well he should have used a condom if he didn't want children....man has condoms sabotaged and unwillingly becomes a parent, well he should have had a vasectomy....

no, would should have happened is the woman shouldn't have been such an utter cunt. Abhorrent behaviour.

Absolutely disgusting comments on here.

Poor children.

I can't believe about 50% are blaming the poor man. Fucking mumsnet is hating men more and more!

If a man had done that to a woman as PPs have confirmed, he could have been charged with rape and jailed.

I absolutely couldn't not be friends with a woman like that. Her poor kids.

Well said @NameChagaiiiin

Do condoms not count as him sorting contraception out then?

I think there are some terrible comments on here. He probably believed the first was an accident and thought condoms were a good solution. There shouldn’t be any victim blaming and he is the victim in this along with the DC.

I don’t think I would be able to stay friends with someone who is really a rapist and if he ever asked why I would tell him.

They were in a committed relationship and if she said she was using contraception he should be able to trust that. Yes the contraception can fail but there is a big difference between a genuine accident and sabotaging it deliberately. A couple shouldn’t need to keep condoms locked up to stop them being tampered with. If a woman posted that her husband had tampered with their condoms we would be telling her to LTB and go to the police.

He was in a trusting adult relationship and got ambushed.
He was committed to a lifelong commitment against his will intentionally by the person he trusted (absolutely the equivalent of stealthing, that sex was not consensual as he was not in possession of the facts) .
Accepting accidents happen he has supported the result.
Despite it not going well the first time (father does not magically find himself deeply interested in the fatherhood he didn't want, which she stupidly hoped for) and him upping the contraception, she does it again. 😱
He continues to provide but is now eyeball deep in a life he didn't want so has checked out.
She has created 2 children both of whom will never know what it is to feel truly wanted and loved by their dad. A lifetime of an emotional void and God knows what that will do to their lives/mental health long term. 😭

She has the gall to whinge about it. 😲

In my entire life I have never met a woman who tricked a man into impregnating her by lying about being on the pill or sabotaging condoms.

you mean you’ve never met a woman who told you they’d done this.

And re the man having a vasectomy - yes, but if he’d done that the marriage would have been over, given how much she wanted a baby. And if the woman had posted on here that her partner had had a vasectomy without her consent she would get lots of sympathy on here and told to LTB anyway.

Well if he removed the condom midway through sex, that would be stealthing. And that is legally
rape under UK law, however there's only ever been one successful prosecution. So yeah. Not sure why it’s not the same when the sexes are flipped.

This!

If a man sabotaged a condom it's called rape.

But because it was a woman, it's his fault. I see this all the time on here and it's awful.

Her despicable choice to do what she did. He never wanted kids. He was honest about that. She made her bed, so to speak. If she's unhappy, she can leave.

Is the woman involved married to the man? If not she is leaving herself in a vulnerable place. Many men are not that keen on children, if he is still supporting them she is in a better place than many others

As a childfree by choice person myself, my sympathy for your friend is zero.

It is horrible for kids having an emotionally absent parent. What your friend did to set this all in motion was horrible.

I really feel so sorry for those children.

Someone once suggested I do this, so I'm not sure how unusual/uncommon it actually is 😕

Whilst I think what your friend did, particularly with the condoms, was verging on psycho, I still feel for her. The desire to have a child can be so strong and it's not always easy to just go meet someone new. She's obviously a bit messed up, and can see how it might be tempting to 'accidentally 'skip a pill or two to be honest if you were desperate for a child. Not something i would do, but as my partner wanted children ive never been in this position. People do have children accidentally and it ends up working out, so i can see why she was hoping for the best. Doing it twice though is particularly hard to understand and the condoms thing seems worse to me somehow.