Zara Aleena

[JoyBeorge]

Unless I've missed it, this sentencing seemed to pass without even a mention on here. AIBU to wonder why this Man was even on the streets, freed from prison just a week before he committed such an unthinkable heinous crime against a lone female?

news.sky.com/story/zara-aleena-serial-offender-sentenced-to-minimum-of-38-years-for-brutal-murder-of-law-graduate-as-she-walked-home-12767756

Electronic tags are so poorly monitored it probably wouldn't make a difference. I worked at a factory where there was always antisocial behaviour outside at weekends. One of the yobs cut his tag off and threw it over the fence. Nobody even visited to enquire why the tag was showing on the system in a factory nowhere near his address. I called the number of the company on it who were monitoring the tag and they didn't want to know. They asked me if I could take it to a police station if I could find one. I told them to come and collect it themselves. I just binned it in the end after having it sat on my desk flashing for almost a fortnight. Complete waste of time.

I'm afraid that I'm a bit sceptical there, given that we don't often properly penalise crime on the streets either. Even if something does get to court, the sentence seldom reflects the gravity of what happened (like with parole boards, I feel that the government are leaning on the Sentencing Council to deal with a lack of spaces through shorter sentences, rather than building more prisons).

If a prisoner assaults another inmate, perhaps causing a broken nose. What happens? What is the process, what penalty might they get? How does this compare with what happens on civvy street?

Well I am not able to discuss the details but I can assure you they are dealt with. I work in a cat B men's prison.

I wasn't asking for details of a specific case, just a general idea of how these things are handled. Loss of privileges or solitary confinement I'm sure are used but what would it take for someone to end up spending longer in prison as a result of violence while on the inside? Presumably they'd need to appear before a criminal court for this (denial of parole isn't applicable to this case).

Given that the murderer who we are discussing was apparently dealt with internally on numerous occasions, without it affecting his sentence it would not be unreasonable to conclude that the existing system isn't working. Especially given that those offences just added to the numerous pile of red flags he'd already built up, anyone who looked at his complete record could see that he posed a danger to society.

Fred West's mother was prepared to testify in his defence when his sister said that he had raped and impregnated her. Something that was probably instrumental in her daughter dropping the charges. Look how that ended.

I seldom believe it when people say "I had no idea that he was capable of this". The warnings are almost always there. Often there are more red flags than a Momentum rally.

I ought to clarify there that by 'people', I'm referring to family and friends who would have known very well what he was like, but still stood by him over the years. I'm not directing it at the victims.

Just would hate, hate, to be working with some of these horrible men in prison, knowing what they had done and the misery they have caused families plus the abuse you probably have to put up with.
Hats off to anyone who works alongside these people everyday.

It’s not always so bad being involved when someone has turned their life around is very rewarding

you just have to remain professional but of course it’s challenging and testing at times

I don’t like everyone I work with but I can remain professional the support they need in a professional capacity I give

and some I am actually fond of but working with damaged people day in day out (and most are) you build strong relationships

I have to say I really enjoy working with offenders. It might sound odd to hear, but I really love my job.

Me too@Greenshake, on the whole it's enjoyable. Even the nastiest offender can make me laugh

But I struggle a bit with having a nice chat on the wings then I discover what he's in for!! I try not to know but that's near on impossible

The job is not for everyone though,I appreciate that

@JoyBeorge

Its been reported today that the Probation service is coming under criticism for releasing this sexual predator. Whilst it's welcome news it's no consolation to her family. Women still need to take care of their safety.

But you can lock up people who have already been recalled to prison for breaching the terms of their parole. Which was the case here but they just hadn’t found the time to go and get the guy who should have been in prison. He should have been in prison based on what he had already done.

The Probation Service is being made a scapegoat. Like every public service it is under funded and under resourced. Easier to blame individuals rather than accept systemic social problems.

And put a curfew on men.

Society, in which violence is overwhelmingly a crime men, almost entirely when you look at sexual violence, currently operates a model where women are held responsible for that violence.

Its women who face the cost and inconvenience of male violence, its women who are blamed and investigated when reporting violence and sexual assault by a male dominated police force which is systemically and persistently sexist and racist. And yes there are good committed police officers (many of whom end up leaving in the face of the culture) but bluntly we are looking for the good apples in barrels which are mediocre and look the other way if not actually rotting.

Perhaps if all men have to share the cost, the pain and the inconvenience of male violence there will be less "Not all Men" and "Not my Nigel" and simply shrugging "not me mate" and carrying on with life and a bit more effort to actually change their brothers' behaviours.

Belief is great but where is the evidence base that all types of offenders can be rehabilitated?

Whenever I've looked at data I'm struck by the extent to which education (both academic and social) can help, that rehabilitation can help but not for all categories of offenders.

Persistent sex offenders, violent against women seem particularly resistant and I've seen little evidence that anything works long term for paedophiles (and in some strategies the behaviour has been reinforced long term after short term apparent benefits).

So maybe we do need a different approach and strategy to classes of extreme offence which are particularly resistant to rehab and that may be, for instance. acceptance of a loss of some liberties to be allowed to function in society outside of prison walls.

I lived in a caravan on a traveller site,next door caravan was empty. One day a man arrived, kept himself to himself never spoke.

One day DS (4) found a knife outside one of our windows, (I remember posting about it here)

The next day a Nepalese woman was murdered at the footpath that run alongside the site. It was the man in the caravan next us. He had been driven from Kent by his parents due to vigilante threats for "his safety". They paid his first months rent and disappeared off into the sunset. So i wholeheartedly agree with you.

www.readingchronicle.co.uk/news/13402062.man-given-life-sentence-for-murdering-nepalese-woman-krishnamaya-mabo/

That's why I take my hat off to prisoner officers who have to see these people everyday.

Everything's on their side too. Who makes these rights up?

I'm sorry to wake up an old thread but it seems sensible to keep these together. If anyone want a new thread, please go ahead. I haven't found a newer one.

I don't understand why his sentence has been reduced. Perhaps I've misunderstood the article but it seems to be because she didn't suffer...for too long? She's dead. He killed her. He inflicted over forty wounds on her. She was beaten, stamped on and sexually assaulted...by him. This seems to be the pertinent bit

“Having correctly found that Ms Aleena must have been rendered unconscious at an early stage in the attack, the judge had lacked a sufficient evidential basis on which to be sure that there had been additional mental or physical suffering such as to justify an increase in the 30-year starting point.”

I'm speechless. It's like he's being rewarded for killing her quickly*.

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2023/11/03/zara-aleena-murderer-jordan-mcsweeney-life-sentence/

https://archive.ph/1X3Co archive link to get round the paywall

*although she was still alive when found.

@IcakethereforeIam I just came on to say the exact same thing, I just read it online and am actually in tears it's so unbelievable to me that this could happen.

Evil sex attacker who beat woman to death on her way home has life sentence cut www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/breaking-zara-aleena-killer-wins-31350671?utm_source=app

link from a different newspaper

Oh god this is unspeakable. That poor, poor woman. Her family will be broken forever.

Can any psychologist answer why the pretty certain knowledge of a lengthy prison sentence doesn't stop these men? I get that they're narcissists and have no care for human life, but why don't they care for their own liberty? To me, this is the mystery of serious violent crime.

@MorrisZapp presumably because they never think they will be caught.

Here's the article in the Guardian with some quotes from Zara's family who, it seems, are being very pragmatic.

https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2023/nov/03/man-who-murdered-zara-aleena-succeeds-in-appeal-court-bid-to-reduce-minimum-term-of-sentence

I'm sorry, I wish I could obscure his face.

As the murderer was due to be recalled to custody, it seems to me patently obviously he was set on having a woman before the bars were locked behind him. It appears the original judge also thought that, the appeal judges thought different. For some reason that reduced his sentence. Also, he didn't stop her calling for help, sexually assault and murder her, he just robbed, sexually assaulted her and murdered her which isn't as serious.

I think her family's words, quoted from the above article are so sad, brave and lovely

“Zara, a beacon of hope, a symbol of change. Her tragic murder stands as a catalyst for reshaping how society safeguards women. She serves as our guiding light, and we invite each and every one of you to stand with us in preserving her memory, supporting our campaigning efforts, and ensuring that her legacy is not forgotten.”

I did start a thread when I saw the news - the verdict is awful

https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/am_i_being_unreasonable/4934742-tw-sex-murderer-jordan-mcsweeney-5-years-for-ps41