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AIBU?

Share your dilemmas and get honest opinions from other Mumsnetters.

Nativity disappointment why do teachers do it

417 replies

Bucketheadbucketbum · 07/12/2022 18:42

Want to key stage 2 nativity today. It was 1 hour long! Approx 40 kids in it. Some children had multiple lines throughout the hour, on the stage for the bulk of the time, solo songs the works. Others had just one line and spent the rest of the time sitting to the side apart from group songs where they all stood up. I understand all parts cant be equal and it must be a nightmare to try and be fair but this was shockingly poorly distrubuted. Why would you do this as a teacher? So disappointing for the children and parents unless you happen to be one of the "stars" of the show.

OP posts:
willstarttomorrow · 07/12/2022 20:20

My now 16 year old was usually in the choir had or a small part and has it had any impact on her self esteem and confidence now she is in college and studying for her A-levels? Hell no. With hindsight, despite being an outgoing, chatty and articulate little thing from early on amongst her family and friends, she hated being in the limelight during primary school. Reports were always positive, she has developed to be a contentious and motivated student. She has made friendship groups she is confident within, developed a quiet assertiveness and has a part-time job in which she is valued as a trustworthy member of the team.

All the threads about children never being the lead in school plays, star of the week (although they usually all get a turn) playground monitor etc. It is parental angst- most of the children themselves neither notice or care. As long as I turned up, she could see I was there and it confirmed that I loved her and she mattered, job done. When it was discovered she actually had a lovely singing voice in year 6 and she was asked to sing solo- it was an absolute no 😁

GuyFawkesDay · 07/12/2022 20:20

I'd love to see some of the parents on here try and sort a Nativity out with 30 Christmas hyper, yet also end of term tired kids.

My mum did it for 20 years and she had the patience of a saint, dealing with the prep school parents and their precocious offspring.

It's utterly exhausting. And not compulsory. Wouldn't surprise me if they stopped happening with all the griping.

NosieRosie · 07/12/2022 20:21

CentrifugalBumblePuppy · 07/12/2022 20:06

I think if any of us who trained as teachers (especially with drama as a specialism, like I did) currently have our eyes so rolled back into our heads at some of these comments from parents that we are mostly typing out replies using touch alone.

I get it. In a totally perfect classroom, every child will have an identically large speaking/singing/dancing role. Every child will sing and smile and laugh in all the right places. All parents would be appeased at this communist ideal where everyone is treated equally & all parents will fawn & clap at the beautiful ensemble piece rendered before them.

Unfortunately, living back in the real world, this isn’t, and can never be the case. You have to chose kids based on their abilities. Some will be stronger singers in the chorus, others have the confidence to be a narrator or lead character. Some will want to do all the fun backstage stuff (even if, as in the old days, that was just turning the CD player on & off at the right time). Others will throw themselves into helping make props or painting sheep for the bit with the shepherds. If you know your class well (and most of us do for reasons well outside the remit of bloody nativity casting) you know the rough plan of who will play what. You may have auditions, or ask the kids themselves who might be good in a part. You could workshop the whole shebang for a week before casting & the old regulars may still get the ‘premium’ roles, because that’s where their strengths lie.

Teachers will know who will work best in an ensemble chorus. They know the kids that will have the support to practice a larger role. They know who would be absolutely terrified if they were made to stand in front of hundreds of people and, if I’m honest, wet themselves in fright.

And, unfortunate as it seems, the ones with the confident PTA parents will often take the confident, larger roles not through favouritism, but because those confident people have confident children. There may be exceptions to this rule of course (and good teachers will be adept at encouraging those who have potential to excel in performing regardless of who their parent or what their background is) but it is a simple observation.

A good teacher will know which kid will make a fabulous comedy donkey, a clear speaking Angel Gabriel or a strong but silent Wise Man.

Even as a drama specialist, you know you can’t do right for doing bloody wrong. There will always be the pushy parent who’ll insist their nose picking progeny is the next Laurence Olivier. But there will also always be that one spark in a child that doesn’t have the support or money or ideal home life that you can nurture & develop, even in a school nativity, which could help that child in so many more ways than I could write here.

That’s why we do that same, thankless task, year in, year out.

Amen 🙏 Every class teacher chooses the role best suited to each pupil

piefacedClique · 07/12/2022 20:22

Because we are utter knobbers and have nothing better to do than piss you off! FFS! Another thing we can’t do bloody right!

Oblomov22 · 07/12/2022 20:22

AIBU
Unanimous yes.
No I'm not.
Hmm

FettleOfKish · 07/12/2022 20:22

In primary school I hated being involved in any capacity, so cripplingly shy I was at the time. Even being part of the off stage choir was awful.

We never had 'backstage' roles (tiny primary school with barely enough pupils for a cast and choir) but I'd have much preferred that.

Not all of us are made to be on stage.

SweetSakura · 07/12/2022 20:22

"I think kids in state schools are so often lacking in confidence because the opportunities for public speaking aren’t available to them."

Agree. And its why I encouraged all my children to do lamda. I come across so many adults who won't do public speaking. Only one of mine is actually talented but all four children did lamda for at least a few years so they could gain that experience.

ancientgran · 07/12/2022 20:23

Blueeyedgirl21 · 07/12/2022 20:04

@Tinseltosser 😫 that’s crap to be honest. One year in infants my nephew who is sort of a quirky , nerdy type who was sort of born with what we call affectionately an ‘awkward turtle’ streak for nativities and plays and the like, but is still a lovely boy who just wants to be included, was made to dress in a girls costume because the teacher thought it would be funny to teach him a bit of a lesson for not being the most forthcoming at joining in. He was so embarrassed - the costume was pink sequins with a hall - the teacher said they had no idea and thought he should ‘go out of his comfort zone’ just mean IMO

I've got 4 adult children, 4 GC currently at school, I've seen some shit over the years but that is downright evil. God knows what she's done to that child's MH. Did the parents know what was happening? I would have had a word with the teacher before the performance. Yes very mean.

At one of my GC's school play they did have a couple of boys dressed up as girls and vice versa but it was children who enjoyed the joke and they were 11.

PixellatedPixie · 07/12/2022 20:23

When my two were very young their school did a play called Wriggly Nativity that actually had an excellent distribution of roles and lines. There were a few solo singing lines but every child got to speak and sing in a small group and then sing altogether as a year group.

ancientgran · 07/12/2022 20:25

FettleOfKish · 07/12/2022 20:22

In primary school I hated being involved in any capacity, so cripplingly shy I was at the time. Even being part of the off stage choir was awful.

We never had 'backstage' roles (tiny primary school with barely enough pupils for a cast and choir) but I'd have much preferred that.

Not all of us are made to be on stage.

Schools should allow children to opt out if they really don't want to be involved but I don't think that is what the OP is talking about. Some of us have sat through 7 years of primary school plays with the same children taking the lead every year and other children who ask for a part, desperately want a part being left out over and over again.

Italiandreams · 07/12/2022 20:26

I’m a teacher, have been doing it 18 years. You can’t please everybody of course, but some place’s definitely make more of an effort to include all those who wish to be included than others. Depends if you see it’s main purpose as being an all singing all dancing production, or a chance to give children a chance to shine, build resilience and confidence, develop performance skills etc

Helpplease888 · 07/12/2022 20:27

arethereanyleftatall · 07/12/2022 19:34

Jesus Christ on a cracker.

Give up now teachers! Well, I know you are, and mostly, it's nothing to do with the pay, it's this shit.

They cannot win!! Already on mumsnet this year, we've had someone complaining about every possible thing the teachers could have done for the nativity...too many lines. Not enough lines. Too early. Too late. Siblings making noise. No siblings. Not enough like the nativity. Too like the nativity. Can't get the costume. Pfb has to wear scuzzy costume from last year.

Stop. Complaining. About. Everything. Before. There's. No. Teachers. Left.

If only!

Peasepuddingbloodycold · 07/12/2022 20:27

Exactly. It's not that hard!

There is an obvious answer, OP, for next year's being brilliant.

ancientgran · 07/12/2022 20:30

willstarttomorrow · 07/12/2022 20:20

My now 16 year old was usually in the choir had or a small part and has it had any impact on her self esteem and confidence now she is in college and studying for her A-levels? Hell no. With hindsight, despite being an outgoing, chatty and articulate little thing from early on amongst her family and friends, she hated being in the limelight during primary school. Reports were always positive, she has developed to be a contentious and motivated student. She has made friendship groups she is confident within, developed a quiet assertiveness and has a part-time job in which she is valued as a trustworthy member of the team.

All the threads about children never being the lead in school plays, star of the week (although they usually all get a turn) playground monitor etc. It is parental angst- most of the children themselves neither notice or care. As long as I turned up, she could see I was there and it confirmed that I loved her and she mattered, job done. When it was discovered she actually had a lovely singing voice in year 6 and she was asked to sing solo- it was an absolute no 😁

Well that sample of one proves the case doesn't it. Those of us who have had a child come home upset because they didn't get a part yet again are what? Delusional, imagining it or .......

Goldenbear · 07/12/2022 20:30

If you are an infant school teacher, you sure do have to have the kind of cbeebies presenter enthusiasm and patience. I don't think parents' expectations of seeing their very young children engaged and positive in the Nativity is a big ask. I mean after year 2, end of infant school, the Nativity wasn't longer performed for us. My DD went to a school where the music teacher was amazing and managed to appreciate this.

GuyFawkesDay · 07/12/2022 20:32

Delusional, imagining it or .......
Maybe bring a bit precious?

Teach your child to manage disappointing news. And that it doesn't define them or matter what part they have.

Put some parenting yards in.

Pumperthepumper · 07/12/2022 20:34

Goldenbear · 07/12/2022 20:30

If you are an infant school teacher, you sure do have to have the kind of cbeebies presenter enthusiasm and patience. I don't think parents' expectations of seeing their very young children engaged and positive in the Nativity is a big ask. I mean after year 2, end of infant school, the Nativity wasn't longer performed for us. My DD went to a school where the music teacher was amazing and managed to appreciate this.

So should we be teaching for the kids or for the parents’ expectations?

ReadyForPumpkins · 07/12/2022 20:34

Get use to this. He’s in KS2 and old enough to know not everyone is a star. A normal show won’t have equal parts for everyone. It will be the same if he’s in ballet or drama. Soon you will be auditioning for sports team and you might not get in either. In year 7, they have to audition for the play and most don’t even get a part. If you do, most likely it’s a small one that you complain about.

ForestofD · 07/12/2022 20:34

My youngest had one line. In her opinion, that was one line too many 😀

She certainly didn't want to be any more included. Not all children want to be front and centre.

glasshole · 07/12/2022 20:34

In primary school I was a step in reception, then an Angel in middle infant. Got a 2 line role in to infant. Every single year in juniors I was a narrator. Not because I wanted to be, but because I was the only kid in the class that could stand in a section of bud state and rescuer line after line without pausing, crying, wetting myself or running away. By the final year I recited around 1/3 off the script. I didn't WANT to do any of it. I've just never been scared about speaking in front of people.

Honestly, 90% of adults would be terrified/ unable to do karaoke in front of their queen friends and family members. Do petite really think it's that different for kids? It's not. Most don't WANT to do it and lose sleep over letting their parents/teachers down.

CakeRabbit · 07/12/2022 20:36

When I read threads about teachers I'm driven to dark thoughts. Parents seem to hate us so much.

GertrudePerkinsPaperyThing · 07/12/2022 20:36

SleepingStandingUp · 07/12/2022 19:53

Ours is split yr1-3 and Yr 4-6. The 1-3 is about 90 kids in theory. 5 stars with one lead star, three Kings, three shepherd's, 4 sheep with one solo song sheep, a cat with a solo, a landlord who didn't speak, Mary and Joseph who didn't speak, some general villagers, half a dozen narrators. The kids left over had the choice of going in the choir (had one extra song only they sang) and the others wee the chorus so sanh 5 songs. It wasn't equal but it felt fair. DS was in the chorus. It can be done if they pick a play with extras or lots of songs

This is clever I think - having Mary and Joseph and some other great sounding parts not speak. So kids who aren’t great speakers can be proud of their part without having to do anything scary.

RosaGallica · 07/12/2022 20:37

Tinseltosser · 07/12/2022 19:39

That sounds lovely and definitely would be preferable to the borefest we had to sit through today with just under a third getting to actually dress up/talk/sing/move around the stage.

Fantastic for the children/parents who got to participate, but a misery for the rest of us sat there for nearly an hour.

Not sure why saying this is being taken as an attack on teachers though?

All of ours looked very cute😊 and got their chance! I’m really surprised some people (parents and apparently school staff) seem to think nativity is a queens command performance!

FettleOfKish · 07/12/2022 20:37

I see your point @ancientgran but my response was really of the back of the OP's comment 'but the young ones love to feel involved' - not necessarily true.

cptartapp · 07/12/2022 20:37

DS1 got the starring role in reception. He was on stage for the vast majority of the time and was confident and un-phased. Even people around us said what a good part he played not knowing he was our son.
When his time came, DS2 was a washing line.

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