To be utterly fed up of what UK workplace culture has become?

[ExpectationManagementCharm]

I'm a middle manager in a large UK firm. I am not a new manager; and I'm not young, late 30s. I am generally perceived to be at the "laid back"/supportive end of the management spectrum (but I'll fight tooth and nail for one of my team if I think they're being asked unreasonable stuff/being treated unfairly).
However, I'm tearing my hair out at being at the "crunch point" of upper level expectations to get on and deliver stuff vs. how my more junior employees expect to work these days. I'm so exhausted and getting no support from anyone. I can no longer see if it's just my workplace or the norm.

Example1: Junior staff expecting to not dial into team meetings beacuse of trivial reasons - some of which are downright unprofessional (i have my weekly run with a PT booked then- but this is within normal work office hours e.g. 2pm on a Thursday). While my HR policy states that I need to be "flexible" for personal reasons, which means I then need to follow up separately with that person each time. Result - less work for employee, HR is happy, senior management say no problem, more work for me.

Example 2: Junior staff (especially our newly graduated colleagues) expecting to be able to get out of (reasonable) work deadlines by using the word "anxiety" all the time. "I couldn't deliver a client item/I was feeling anxious" (meaning I had to pull an all nighter to get it finished to meet our deadline). I try and escalate to HR - but I need to be "understanding". Result - employee's piss poor performance slides, HR are happy, senior management say no problem (because client delivery didn't suffer), I get to work an all nighter to cover the gap.

These are multiple examples, across lots of team members over the last ~ 5 years, but it's definitely got worse over the last year or so. The concept of "my word is my oath"/reliablility seems to have completely gone out of the window.

Yet my employer's HR team just turn it back on me as a team manager to manage, leading to more work, which means I just have another thing to do.

I'm currently pursuing performance improvement plans with 2 of my team at the moment, whose hiring i was not involved in, and i'm going mad trying to fit in what HR expect (to follow the process) alongside juggling my own actual workload. I'm not just a people manager, yet HR seem to think i have free time to spend doing delicate, intensive people management activity, despite my already crushing workload.

Does anyone else recongnise this or is it time to look for a new employer?

FWIW, i love my team (in general) but the recent piss taking has really taken its toll - I feel like no one at work has my back at all.

Lunch should be taken for 1 hr between 12and2pm and anything outside of these times must be agreed with me in advance.

If they are on flexible working contracts you simply cannot do this. You'd be laughed at if you tried this in my office.

If they're constantly needing help due to anxiety or other issues refer to HR saying that they need Occupational Health support as they are having difficulties performing their normal work.

Don't be the nice lady, you're paid to manage the team and get the work done. Check your procedures and if the problem continues manage them out of the team.

Boomers always complained about Millenials - they raised them.

Gen Xers complain about Zoomers - they raised them

Generation Snowflake. Bet they'd be more bloody anxious if out of a job!
YANBU.

@MXVIT
100% though not sure it can be a generation that is labled I think just people in general as so entitled these days
OP sounds like my old place I was senior level operations manager 21 staff and I had my job to do and performance manage its tough, some expect it to be handed to them on a plate some used health as to why they couldn't and some just thought they were better than the work straight from college/uni
All you can do is performance manage them out but it's tough took me 6mth of evidence for one and a folder so thick just so I had the proof I wasn't just bullying them out
I took a complete career change 4 years ago and have not looked back at all plus starting a fresh means no people leadership the final straw was on my team I had 21 individuals my colleague of which there were 4 had max 8 each and I had to help pick up some of their duties of shifts impacting on my time with my staff and doung my job which noone picked up for me

I think you totally misread what was being said here. The poster had to pull an overnighter because they had their work plus the junior’s. This work was part of the junior’s daily routine that they couldn’t fulfill cos they were ‘anxious’. Probably due to missing the latest episode of Stranger Things on Netflix or something.

As HR I echo pp in that you can’t expect HR to do it for you but you equally shouldn’t be accepting this. Excuses about going for a run??!
there is definitely an “entitlement” thing going on with the early 20-somethings in my workplace, expecting to be on the highest salaries with little experience etc.

I can’t believe this thread is full of people slagging off their own children. It’s such a generalisation.

Wehave 3 Millenials and one Gen Z. All Millenials in good jobs that they get in with. But they won’t stand for any management ‘crap’ like bullying or nepotism. Is this a bad thing?

The Gen Z is still at school. But she works hard.

Ive read that these 2 generations have seen their parents work stressful jobs with not enough time to care for dc properly. And they don’t want that for themselves. Which is good. l don’t think they are snowflakes (how l hate that word) they just have a different view on life to the corporate 9-5. I find it quite refreshing.

One if our Millenials makes a really good living working for himself. He doesn’t want ‘corporate crap’ or people telling him what to do. Another one is a university lecturer. He is less than complimentary about his managers.

Maybe they want different stuff to the current set up? Maybe the corporate world needs to change if these people are to be employed?

Not all like that though. Yes when I started working there were some colleagues whe were hard work. But I have managed teams since the late 90s and it’s getting more common to have to be ‘mummy’ to new entrants to the workplace, some of who are absolutely convinced of their right to walk a job and not do the crappy little tasks (that we all have to do anyway).

A friend with almost 20 years experience in a very technical job (she has so much skill and experience) had a new colleague (no hands on experience, little work experience) complaining loudly that they weren’t being paid the same. New colleague also refused to work late (they are working on projects) and complained that some of the job was ‘boring’ and ‘too hard’ .

maybe the culture of ‘degrees for everyone’ and student debt isn’t helping.

Well said! Couldn't agree more.

I think it's more expected than ever there you will pick up work slack in your own time which I point blank refuse to do. Your team need to be reminded of their working hours and that arranging a pt meeting during the day is unacceptable and a piss take. For those who are anxious them they need to work on it so either extra support to or check ins to make sure they are working to deadline or they get put on a performance plan. I don't think managers can be best mates with their teams, you have to be able to call them out on their laziness. I'd send a strongly worded email that you expect 100% attendance for the next team meeting. Once at the meeting or on the call ypu address this behaviour and say that team meetings cannot be missed so they arrange their work diaries around this. Remind them that during working hours they are paid to work and that it's unacceptable to not be meeting deadlines. I'd make sure you are absolutely confident when it comes to hr policies so you can challenge any pushback.

This thread makes me feel like I’m back at work in the NHS. Flaky staff and flakey management. So much slack given for undiagnosed MH, health issues despite having in-house OH service. ‘I’ll talk to my union rep’…Bloody nightmare. So glad I’ve retired.

Surely it depends what your flexible working policy is. I think that’s very generous to allow staff to choose an hour’s lunch break somewhere in those 2 hours. That IS flexible. You can basically start your lunch at any point you want between 12 and 1 and STILL get a full hour. Sounds great if you ask me. I’ve had one job like that in the past and it was considered a perk. You can’t have staff taking their “lunch break” at 10.30, or 3pm. There has to be times of the day when it is assumed that staff will be available and working, unless they have taken annual leave.

same with start and finish times, staff should be expected to be starting and finishing between certain hours, not given free rein.

No wonder this country is going to the dogs. If you want fully flexible working then you should just work for yourself.

Sorry that was to @TomTraubertsBlues

Surely it depends on the flexibly contract.

my employer has core hours - 10 - 12 and 2 -4. You can be flexible around that and even build up hours to take days off.

but you have to be available and working10- 12 and 2-4. I think that is reasonable. How else would you schedule meetings and even know you have cover?

I think we are definitely in a period where the employee holds the power. That will change as unemployment rises as a result of the recession.

A colleague and I ended up organising the awayday at no notice because our bright young thing had anxiety and couldn’t cope and had to take a few mental health days. So we found out the day before that she hadn’t actually booked the venue or the lunch, so we had to do some fast footwork.

Same bright young thing emailed me at 5 on a Thursday saying “I’ve decided to take tomorrow off and have a long weekend. This means I won’t make tomorrow’s deadline with this project, but I’m sure you can pick up from where I’ve left off. Have a lovely weekend!” And was uncontactable, not answering work phone or personal phone. She’s still there, although another department are enjoying her now, as HR felt I was being harsh, given her (undocumented) mental health problems.

Interestingly we don’t get this issue from our school leaver apprentices, who are grafters, keen to learn and reliable.

@MrsSchadenfreude

So are the school leavers aged 16/17 and the bright young thing a Uni graduate?

Im just trying to work out if Uni is the right choice for my son or an apprenticeship.

Worth saying he isn’t sure it’s his decision of course but he’s open to guidance.

The little shit head at organisation is currently making me look bad as he has littered the work we've given him with errors that he hasn't even bothered to correct.

Despite that he writes a cheery "hey hope youve had a great week so far" at the start of every incompetent fucking email. I could punch him in the face at this point as his shoddy work is causing so much stress to me and senior managememt have picked up on the errors in the work.

I am hopefully meeting his senior next week and any advice on what to tell her whilst trying to stay calm would be much appreciated.

I think we are definitely in a period where the employee holds the power. That will change as unemployment rises as a result of the recession

Im not sure how it will rise when we don’t have enough workers now tbh.

Yes but there lies the problem. As an experienced middle manager I couldn't make decisions I wanted to because HR wouldn't let me. If I wanted someone on disciplinary, I couldn't because I had to be more tolerant.
If I wanted to performance manage I couldn't because I needed to be more flexible.
HR made the rules but left middle managers to try and navigate managing a workforce with their hands tied behind their backs

I left.

@Workbabysleeprepeat, I'm not sure how to not repost everything you said, so please excuse me for that. I just wanted to say thank you for posting that MH conditions cannot be self-diagnosed. I have diagnosed bipolar II and clinical depression and I have fought VERY hard for recognition of MH sufferers in the workplace throughout my 35 years in the workplace. The current overuse of the word "anxiety", particularly when it's used as an excuse, is a massive bug bear of mine because it damages real MH sufferers, businesses and generally undoes all the good that people have done for educating others on MH conditions and how people cope with them. I would give anything not to have my two conditions, to not have to take the seriously brain numbing meds I take just to have a reasonably normal life and hold down a job. That people would wish to have a MH condition just for the attention or use it for an excuse is astounding to me! Not to mention offensive. Your advice to accept nothing other than a doctor's written diagnosis is music to my ears. I'm Gen X and I'm being driven to distraction by these Gen Z buggers too!

@SmokeyToo

I disagree. You can have a mental health condition without being “officially diagnosed” by a psychiatrist, which by the way is open for debate as it’s really not an exact science. I take your point regarding people using it for an excuse , but people absolutely can be living with quite severe depression and anxiety without ever having stepped foot in a doctors surgery to discuss it. Additionally there are people in society who hear voices and have not disclosed this info to their doctors. Doesn’t make their experience any less real than yours.

Some people are actively against medication and manage their MH in a whole myriad of ways that does not include medication. Meds are only one way of treating a condition and they are not at the top of a some hierarchical system whereby if you don’t take them you don’t suffer.