To be utterly fed up of what UK workplace culture has become?

[ExpectationManagementCharm]

I'm a middle manager in a large UK firm. I am not a new manager; and I'm not young, late 30s. I am generally perceived to be at the "laid back"/supportive end of the management spectrum (but I'll fight tooth and nail for one of my team if I think they're being asked unreasonable stuff/being treated unfairly).
However, I'm tearing my hair out at being at the "crunch point" of upper level expectations to get on and deliver stuff vs. how my more junior employees expect to work these days. I'm so exhausted and getting no support from anyone. I can no longer see if it's just my workplace or the norm.

Example1: Junior staff expecting to not dial into team meetings beacuse of trivial reasons - some of which are downright unprofessional (i have my weekly run with a PT booked then- but this is within normal work office hours e.g. 2pm on a Thursday). While my HR policy states that I need to be "flexible" for personal reasons, which means I then need to follow up separately with that person each time. Result - less work for employee, HR is happy, senior management say no problem, more work for me.

Example 2: Junior staff (especially our newly graduated colleagues) expecting to be able to get out of (reasonable) work deadlines by using the word "anxiety" all the time. "I couldn't deliver a client item/I was feeling anxious" (meaning I had to pull an all nighter to get it finished to meet our deadline). I try and escalate to HR - but I need to be "understanding". Result - employee's piss poor performance slides, HR are happy, senior management say no problem (because client delivery didn't suffer), I get to work an all nighter to cover the gap.

These are multiple examples, across lots of team members over the last ~ 5 years, but it's definitely got worse over the last year or so. The concept of "my word is my oath"/reliablility seems to have completely gone out of the window.

Yet my employer's HR team just turn it back on me as a team manager to manage, leading to more work, which means I just have another thing to do.

I'm currently pursuing performance improvement plans with 2 of my team at the moment, whose hiring i was not involved in, and i'm going mad trying to fit in what HR expect (to follow the process) alongside juggling my own actual workload. I'm not just a people manager, yet HR seem to think i have free time to spend doing delicate, intensive people management activity, despite my already crushing workload.

Does anyone else recongnise this or is it time to look for a new employer?

FWIW, i love my team (in general) but the recent piss taking has really taken its toll - I feel like no one at work has my back at all.

I'd be telling anyone who's not interested in working for the salary that they are given to go hand in their notice and you'll find people who are interested in working.
And earning a decent wage.
You need to toughen up and stop covering their butt's. If they don't do the work and they let the client down they face the consequences for that.
No more covering for them.
Your health is going to suffer.. If you don't do something

I work in HR and if I was supporting you I’d have talked through some of the issues and helped work through some suggestions as to how to address the specifics. Eg - if your companies policy is that flexible, it’s great, but it’s not usually a case of flexibility at the expense of performance, so depending on the policy/culture of the workplace, I’d have said to anyone who couldn’t make the meeting to ensure they got an update from a colleague - not you - or as someone else has said take minutes so anyone can see what’s happened. If you really need everyone’s input at the meeting then I think it would be a case of asking if the PT session can be moved and setting out why, if it can’t then I’d maybe move the meeting. Treat people like adults and expect them to behave like adults (ie give and take).

On the mental health/deadlines issue, I’d have said be supportive but make it clear that you expect your team to communicate with you as soon as possible if they’re going to miss a deadline or if they feel overwhelmed/need support, so that you can address it more effectively. Mental health isn’t the get-out that people seem to think it is, you can and should make reasonable adjustments (and treat people like adults) but they still need to be performing or you have to follow the formal procedures.

I do feel for you as it’s a balance and sometimes different people need different approaches.. Get to know your team and how they like to work, or you could create a team charter that you can all sign up to, just to help set expectations.

"Example1: Junior staff expecting to not dial into team meetings beacuse of trivial reasons - some of which are downright unprofessional (i have my weekly run with a PT booked then- but this is within normal work office hours e.g. 2pm on a Thursday). While my HR policy states that I need to be "flexible" for personal reasons, which means I then need to follow up separately with that person each time. Result - less work for employee, HR is happy, senior management say no problem, more work for me."

This is a disciplinary issue and should be dealt with as such. Employees don't get to pursue personal interests during working hours - that they are being paid for!

I have experienced this recently and it is annoying. The person I had isn't actually managed by me but works on projects I manage. I escalated it to their management, said I allocated jobs that were easy (Google X for 20 mins and come up with a list) and it wasn't being done after months of chasing. No work being done whatsoever. Manager talks to the person and the person claims that they feel bullied so we had to back off and let them just get away with not working. It's infuriating!

As for students - well. Let’s just say that my primary aged child is more capable of self directing her own learning than the current cohort. There is a stark difference between the mature students who are 27+ and the 18-24 year olds.

It sounds like it all causes you stress and anxiety, play them at their own game.

One of the issues is that they don't learn to be resilient.
One of mine has anxiety (diagnosed by the doctor after observation etc, manifests as either sickness-genuinely vomiting, or migraines). When it hits her, it can be totally flooring.
But "I've got anxiety" has meant that she has used it as a get out clause. I am sure sometimes it was normal nerves and, at times, something she found difficult, or even something she didn't fancy doing.

The upshot is that she has very rarely had to carry something through that she finds hard or doesn't want to do.
When I tried to help her get through things she would then find someone else to get her out of it, and I'd find that she was sitting on the side and watching or similar. Even things like her mocks at school. The older she's got the better at avoiding stuff she's got. When she was small she was very determined to do everything. She's now more inclined to say "I can't" then try.

Now, I have gradually come to realise that I have very similar levels of anxiety on similar things.
But it very rarely got me off, and I learnt how to cope. I now know what I can cope with and when to bow out at an early level. Dd hasn't had the chance to learn that. She thinks that if she feels the least bit worried then she doesn't do it. But the less she does something, the more worried she gets about it, so the less she will try. It's a very difficult cycle to break.

On the odd times she has tried something she finds difficult and continued, it gives her a huge sense of achievement and she is then normally fine to do it again. But persuading her to try is so hard. She thinks that she is very independent, but she isn't really.

I worry so much about her.

Three words - let it fail.

A manager I worked with had terrible problems engaging and keeping staff. Yes they were all young men, and all flakey as heck.

Not turning up ‘for personal reasons’ (undisclosed), calling in sick (or not turning up) when they had to attend meeting, leaving in the dot of 5 even when there were deadlines, saying they didn’t want to do particular projects because they were too hard, running to the MD every two minutes (one because another ember of staff had called him ‘bully’ instead of ‘William’ and he thought it was ‘being too familiar’, or being asked to (take their turn and) make the tea… They were hard work.

He finally managed to hire and keep a good team - all young down-to-earth women.

My life became very, very small before I was referred to CMHT, correctly Dx with CPTSD/ADHD/ASD, correctly medicated and had access to long term therapy.

I had one final traumatic event that sent me spiralling, to the point that my HR wouldn’t come down below 140, I was shaking, sweating, for hours on end, several times a day. I couldn’t sleep or eat and my weight dropped to 7 stone. As a result I became agoraphobic for a year, and it took me another year to fully recover.

Lockdowns were Hell for me because it reminded me of that very dark time in my life.

Some of what caused anxiety was due to undiagnosed Autism relayed sensory issues. I have tools and work around for those now. Some of it was genuine terror of bumping into my abusers (my ex and one of my parents) - I moved far away, changed my name. Some of it was a severe MH issue that I had no control over.

I snapped and figured I was going to be drenched in sweat, shaky and have a pounding heart whether I was at home or whether I was at work/shopping/whatever so I may as well do whatever the fuck I want anyway, as the end result was the same.

But if it's their work & she is their manager, then surly it's her work too? It must be her ultimate responsibility that the work is delivered & for her to manage the team to make sure it is.

I don't know what timelines you are working too, but maybe the anxiety sufferer needs more regular check-ins to spot issues sooner & make sure they aren't getting so far behind that it requires an all nighter from you to deliver, & that the work can be spread out elsewhere, and earlier, should it need to be. Maybe you need to consider requesting if you can hire an additional staff member on the team so you can delegate a bit more of your workload?

Because you are picking up there world load they are not bothered you need to push back set deadlines if they don't meet it or have not done it bring them in. Booking a PT session in the middle of a working day is not acceptable if team meeting are mandatory I would tell him although you understand that's when he's booked his pt session team meetings are mandatory you will expect him to dial in at the next one. People management can be difficult and I always found if I gave an inch they'd take a mile, it's okay to be laid back but some staff you cant be laid back with as they take advantage. I think you may need to start pushing back. Be firm but fair and set an example and don't do there work for them

Also, if it is a fully flexible environment then the fact that the PT was at 2pm shouldn't matter. She's allowed to be flexible with her working hours & the PT was booked first, regardless of if you don't think it's a good enough reason. If a meeting is going to be compulsory all staff, then perhaps check in advance a time when everyone will be free? I understand your frustration because that's a different environment than I work in - but if they have applied for a job with fully flexible hours, that's what they should get.

The older generations should have brought them up better.

1. Don't expect to be liked or you will always be on to a loser.
2. If staff are not performing they need to be on performance review. You need to get this in first. If you just try to take a tougher line you may be accused of bullying.
3. Get everything in writing, what tasks are and regular feedback on tasks.
4. Set a policy on attending meetings, theycan have some input into agreed time but they can't opt out afterwards.
5. You need to get to written warning stage as soon as HR will allow it.
6. If someone is going to claim mental health issues then they need to provide medical evidence. Staff should be asked to declare any medical issues, not just bring it up later as an excuse. ie,y ou didn't fill in the form so why is there a problem now?
7. If you can get one person fired this should encourager less autres.

I blame the parents ! Said only half in jest... Schools deal all the time with students whose parents want them excused from things due to their anxiety etc. They (students) learn that this gets them out of things they don’t want to do. It’s so sad. But we’re not helping them by trying to protect them from perceived stressful situations.

This is what I keep saying. The older generations keep banging on about how brilliant it was back in the day, but they've brought up these supposedly useless youngsters. So how terrific were their parenting techniques?

And it wasn't brilliant back in the day. Loads of shit 80s and 90s parenting. Smacking, shouting, authoritarianism. Millennials and Gen Z are snowflakes? You're lucky they're not fucking psychopaths hellbent on revenge. Or maybe we just knew this would actually annoy you more...

So let’s hope if the OP decides to make a management decision to let the slackers fail rather than cover for them in order for them to learn responsibility, HR don’t decide to criticise her management style, or use terms such as ‘unsupportive manager’ 🙄

Think I'd give more work to the slackers on the version of I don't have tine because I'm dealing with HR issues. Managers should manage rather than do the job, if u have 2 roles it might be time to look elsewhere.

I would call a team meeting and say i have noticed lately some team meetings have been missed. To be clear the team meeting is compulsory to attend unless you are on annual leave or sick. Lunch should be taken for 1 hr between 12and2pm and anything outside of these times must be agreed with me in advance. With regards to deadlines being missed. Meet the deadline yourself the first time for first offending employees but for others sit down with each one now in 121 meetings and say you want to understand the element that made them anxious so can help support them better in future. Ask your HR if there is an employee helpline to help with personal issues eg. Anxiety. Our company has one with AXA PPP healthcare and it is free for staff. If they continue down the anxiety path suggest they seek medical help. If they are genuinely suffering with Anxiety this is the right advice and if they blagging then it will deter them from using this reason. Be sweet as sugar with them. Firm, caring but mostly consistent. I have anxiety myself and i was not upset with HR and my boss for offering this help. Book every employee on a time management online course, there are maby free ones. Also as a final point keep records of everything and every missed meeting or deadline follow up in an email. All of these things will show you mean business but hopefully also get you some improvements. Good luck hun

My gut reaction would end in "off". I thought I was a lousy employee and only fit for part time work. Perhaps I'm not that bad!

Strong words? Just inform them they have to make hours up as a run is not work

Yep gone are the days when we just got on with stuff, where anxiety was normal.
I'm not saying people genuinely don't feel more anxiety today, I think they do, they're just not resilient enough to deal with it. Ergo, we (and by that I mean collectively the age group that has had or parents a young adult child) have brought up a load of people who lack resilience and expect little of themselves.

I think workplaces need to develop programmes to address this - that is HRs role - but unless we spell it out as a training need, it stays with middle managers to sort...

Good luck OP, I hear and feel your pain x

You "work" in HR, then?

So do I... Actively partnering with managers is key. We're not just policy bureacrats or fence-sitting diplomats - we're there to help management with the harder things. And we ultimately act for the employer/senior leaders/in their interests.

OP I can totally relate and in my last workplace we stopped our graduates scheme for this very reason. I was a manager and it was a full time job managing the actual tears because I’d point out a spelling mistake on the website they made, the constant anxiety, having to explain why they can’t have a ‘duvet day’ and how one random ‘mental health day’ isn’t classed as sickness when they’ve spent it going to a concert, etc etc. They wanted high wages but didn’t want to do the work all those on the lowest salaries do, like organising a meeting room and sorting water jugs for board meetings. They wanted to use their creativity - but only on their terms. They are happy to assert their boundaries, but give absolutely no thought to what that means for someone else’s boundaries.

And when people say every generation is like that - sorry, no. I’m your age and when I was a graduate we worked bloody hard, we did the bottom feeder jobs because it showed dedication and ability to muck in and we just got on with it and complained in the pub after. It’s exhausting and I’d never do a scheme like that again.