The Lady Hussey racism thing

[Tiiiiiiiiiiired]

I am really conflicted about this.

If went to live in Japan (I did live there for 3 years several years ago) I would be expected to be asked about where I'm from because I don't look Japanese (and in fact I was asked many times! I didn't mind at all, it was my choice to be in Japan and I knew I didn't look japanese). If I chose to stay in that country and have children, I'd expect my children would be asked the same, and their children and that although they would be Japanese by birth, I would hope they would be happy to talk about their heritage and where they are from and not mind being asked why they don't look Japanese and what the history is. I wouldnt think it racist and wouldn't want such questions to be stopped because we only learn from others, and about others, by talking and feeling safe to ask questions.

So why in the UK does everyone have to be sooo careful with what they say? This woman has a non English name, was wearing some non western clothing, as was asked about her heritage. Why is this abuse?

We need to stop being so sensitive and allow dialogue.

Do you think someone refusing to believe where you tell them you are from and digging again and again, is acceptable?

I would have liked it if Ngozi grilled Lady Hussey on exactly who her ancestors killed/screwed over/extorted/fucked to get their place in the aristocracy :)

My mother is white and Eastern European and always being asked where she’s really from, after 40+ years of living in Sussex.

So you’re saying you would be happy with the relentless interrogation that Ms Fulani was put through (see below)? Because I don’t believe you.

twitter.com/Sistah_Space/status/1597854380115767296

Lady SH: Where are you from?
Me: Sistah Space.
SH: No, where do you come from?
Me: We’re based in Hackney.
SH: No, what part of Africa are YOU from?
Me: I don’t know, they didn’t leave any records.
SH: Well, you must know where you’re from, I spent time in France. Where are you from?
Me: Here, UK
SH: NO, but what Nationality are you?
Me: I am born here and am British.
SH: No, but where do you really come from, where do your people come from?
Me: ‘My people’, lady, what is this?
SH: Oh I can see I am going to have a challenge getting you to say where you’re from. When did you first come here?
Me: Lady! I am a British national, my parents came here in the 50s when …
SH: Oh, I knew we’d get there in the end, you’re Caribbean!
Me: No Lady, I am of African heritage, Caribbean descent and British nationality.

I think the problem is she asked the woman “where are you from?” And she said she was from the uk. This answer wasn’t acceptable apparently so she repeatedly asked (in different ways) “but where are you really from?” The implication being “you’re not really British”. Which is likely to make someone feel like they don’t really belong here.

what?! She wasn’t asked where she was originally from. And even if she had, the answer clearly would have been “Britain”.
It is not overblown at all.

Out of interest, would you think it at all odd if you were asked to provide that info? Because I think it's a really weird line of questioning if you're white and obviously racist if black

@BernadetteRostankowskiWolowitz I think you’ve misunderstood me. I think the questioning is awful and the implication that she was being “over dramatic”.

I read the transcript as LSH being genuinely interested in her heritage/ancestry but clearly this 83 year old struggled with finding the words she wanted to use.

If the first question had been “which country were you ancestors from?” she may have got a sensible non-defensive reply, but then Ngozi’ attitude was ridiculously defensive.

and LSH might even have said something like:
“you are lucky you know, us so-called white folks are a very mixed genetic pool, my great great grandfather was born in Sudan”.

Those of us with relatives in their eighties know there was no racist intent meant - it’s more an age thing, a lost in translation thing in conjunction with Ngozi being very defensive and elusive from the get-go. I see no problem with being asked where I am from when I am in different countries.

Well said.

Black people suffer racism in the UK. Lady SH will not suffer at all for her racism. She hasn't been "cancelled", she resigned because she embarrassed the royal family and their guests with her racism.

I don't understand the gymnastics around this.

She asked her where she's from - the woman answered.

If you ask me where I'm from, I shouldn't need to read out my ancestry for you to be satisfied. I'm from wherever I say I'm from, and you move along.

For the folks who think her attire invited the interest- ask her about her attire. Insisting that someone cannot be from Britain because of whatever reason is racist.

I've seen white women in African attire, but noone assumes they must be from Africa, so that doesn't wash.

CloseYourEyesAndSee

Have people from Greece been bought and sold as slaves by white people? Treated as sub-human in recent history? If a person of Greek heritage is walking down a London street at night are they stopped and searched by the police for no reason other than their Greek-like appearance?

It is totally different. Someone with white/olive skin and European hair can’t ever fully understand what those with brown skin and Afro-Carribean hair experience daily. My lovely friend has been called a Gorilla for no other reason than her appearance and encountering a racist twat. That kind of thing happens ALL the time.

You can’t compare your situation.

God, that would have been sweet.

I heard her on LBC yesterday in an interview

It didn’t quite ring true.

Shelia asked how long the questioning went on for. The response was “15 minutes”. Sheila was clearly 🤔 given what she posted on Twitter would seem to have been a couple of minutes most

Would you expect your grandchildren to have to explain too? Their grandchildren?

Or does the idea that your family has to account for their 'difference' in perpetuity not bother you? If so, you are leaning into the idea that identity and belonging are inextricable from skin colour. And there's a name for where that takes you.

It is a confusing situation. The royal would have met many black British people in her lifetime so it makes no sense that her motivation was that she couldn’t believe a black woman could be a British. Fulani was standing with two other black women and according to her the royal beelined for her.

Other non black people have come forward saying the royal also asked them where are you from but did not continue the line of questioning after they answered. One of the royals jobs is to brief the Queen Consort on the guests so she is informed as to who she is speaking to. It seems asking where are you from is part of how she does her job. Surely she would have encountered and needed to introduce many black people over her decades in the role. This one is confusing. It seems maybe it was the dress that threw her off her usual routine?

The timing is slightly curious. Fulani has been outspoken against the royal family and defended Meghan, going as far as to saw that Meghan’s in-laws we’re domestic abusers who domestically abused her. It is curious that she went to a palace event given her view of them and that this account of racism has gone public right before Meghan and Harry’s documentary is released.

it is also odd that no one has reached out to Fulani from the palace. You would think their PR team would do damage control.

it all raises a lot of questions.

I'm getting a bit bloody sick of people going "Ooh, I'm Spanish and people ask where I'm from because of my accent." as if it's the same.

There is no inherent historical feeling of "superiority" between white British people and those from Spain/Germany/Scandinavia.

The conversation is the equivalent of my Peruvian friend who was born in Chicago being told she can't be American because she "looks Mexican" (actual quote).

Asking someone SIX times a variation of ‘where are you from’ is racist.

Your elderly relatives are irrelevant. Lots of elderly people manage not to be racist.

I'd probably say 'well I was born in Osaka and my parents were born in Tokyo, but I see what you are getting at - you can see I don't look Japanese. Well, my grandparents came over here from England in the 19xx's as English Language teachers and loved it and stayed. I've never been to the UK but would like to go. Are your parents and grandparents Japanese? Anyone in your family migrate? ....' and see where the conversation goes.

Really? You'd say all that to any complete stranger that asked you? And not find it remotely odd that said stranger was asking quite intrusive questions?

How often do you get asked those questions in the UK? If never, why is your interesting not as interesting as other people's if we are only trying to promote dialogue?

I've lived in Britain my whole life. I have a white Polish colleague who's lived in several countries across Europe before settling in the UK. Personally, I find her story more interesting than mine, but for some reason, I'm sure entirely unrelated to the colour of my skin, she doesn't get asked and I do.

’Those of us with relatives in their eighties know there was no racist intent meant’

I completely disagree. I have family in their 80s and none of them would have been that racist or that rude.

Very frustrating to see how the media are already goading the readers into a "you can't say ANYTHING these days!!!" response, and even sadder to see that it's working.

I highly recommend that anyone who wants to form an opinion on this should read the transcript of the actual conversation itself, which was witnessed by one or two people. It wasn't just a case of "where are you from?", it was a drawn-out haranguing, with an unbelievably patronising and strange response when Lady H managed to harass the CEO in question into revealing where her parents were from.

CEO was, in my opinion, being very patient and trying to deflect the question to prevent an uncomfortable situation, which is more than Lady H deserved. In return, Lady H seems to imply that CEO was being deliberately obstructive and obtuse by not satisfying Lady H's bizarre and inaccurate ideas.

The Japanese did not enslave and colonise the British though. A lot of non-white British people came to Britain due to the fact that Britain colonised their countries. They were often treated as subhuman, lesser than the white masters. They had to fight for their freedom and respect. They were told, even after becoming citizens, that they were not allowed certain jobs, were refused service in shops, all kinds of othering. With that (fairly recent) history behind us, the words `where are you from' addressed to a non-white person in this country takes on a much more loaded meaning. Add to that the unwanted touching and repeated questioning, it becomes a clear case of implying that this woman, with her skin colour and her clothes, could not possibly be proper British.

So can we stop with the false equivalence with British expatriates in Japan or wherever, it's a completely different experience. This was racism, and yes we need to be bloody sensitive about racism instead of brushing it under the carpet with trivia about Japan.

I don't know much about Japanese culture but I assume if someone asked you where you are from it wouldn't be a slight because I assume you are white.

It's different when you aren't. I'm from India and some people do get very condescending talking about my background and what is worse when the same people then learn that I grew up in another northern European country their behaviour becomes markedly friendlier and more respectful, which I absolutely hate.

I'm often asked where I am from (and often ask myself) and I don't really mind..I always say I'm from India even though I'm a British national now because i believe that this is what people are actually asking about and because I think as humans we are naturally curious about each other. However if I said that I was British I would definitely expect the other person to drop it and not interrogate me till I finally "admit" that I'm ethnically from somewhere else. It's not the question itself that is racist. It's the fact that she thought it's ok to keep going on and on about it and that was entitled to the answer that she wanted to hear.

No. If you were born in Japan to non-Japanese parents you would be a Japanese national, not ethnically Japanese.

I think this debate is so tortured because in the progressive era we are being moved to a narrative that basically denies that indigenous ethnicities exist. Anyone can be British, or French or Japanese by virtue of birth. Not just a national of that country but ethnically. It is now a crime to notice that someone does not belong to the original ethnic population because it is "othering".

It's strange how it doesn't work the other way round though. What would have happened if Fulani had wanted to talk about her work for African and Caribbean communities and Lady Hussey had been similarly baffled and said "But you're British, what's your particular interest in those communities?" Would the denial of Fulani's obvious non-British heritage be just as offensive?