School keeps asking for parents to join in in the middle of the working day?!

[artline200]

I am new to the whole school emails thing, but my son has started at a pre-school attached to a new infants school. Teaching is great, we love it. But they are asking for a lot of parent participation, which I feel quite trapped by. It will be a friendly request, such as come in at 2pm to celebrate the children’s achievements in the mini marathon. To attend I would need to take time off work to go. And if i don’t go will my son be sad that he’s one of the only kids without a parent there? It breaks my heart to think that.

The latest email, which has really wound me up, is an invitation for parents to join children at 12pm for christmas lunch. I have to pay for a lunch I don’t want, and take time off work to be there. And on top of this if my child would like to see Santa and receive a gift I need to pay £6. This isn't exactly optional as I can’t be the only mum who doesn’t join for Christmas dinner and doesn’t buy my kid a ticket to see Santa. Imagine how he would feel, for a teacher to tell him, no your mummy can;t come.

Am being I unreasonable to think that these kinds of things should be on a Saturday and legitimately be optional, rather than in the school days when many parents are working? or at least kept to a minimun and dates sent out at the start of term?! It creates such an unfair divide for children and puts so much pressure on working parents who already have to take time out for school holidays, inset days and sicknesses.

Freeing the teacher up for what? I'm not sure you have a realistic view of what primary teaching is like. Setting up for an art lesson is usually the TAs job which would be done during break time or while the teacher gives the class their instructions. Teachers spend all day teaching for the most part- the primary curriculum is rammed full and it's virtually impossible to fit the required curriculum into the working week.

Fair enough, teachers know what goes on in school, more than I do. We&ve come off the point, somewhat, of the OP about school plays and wonderful events, taking place in the middle of the day. Clearly it would be better to have plenty of notice given for these.

One does read about HLTA's taking classes. This is a structural change of the last 25 years or so, and it must result in teachers having non-contact time.

If teachers are very hard-pressed, it would seem a good idea to get the training colleges for new teachers to ask them to go into school to observe and assist. I'm sure the students don't spend all their time actually teaching, they must sometimes be there in the classroom helping out, doing some of the work to facilitate the lessons. Equally, people who are considering teaching, often seek a volunteering placement. Yes, supervision of a general oversight kind is required, but not micro-managing, I wouldn't have thought, if they are DBS checked, and, after all, parents of younger kids, volunteer in school, hearing them read.

Our school does lots of these types of things, either DH or I go to as many as we can (more often me as my work is more flexible, actually it’s more of a hassle if they fall on my non working days as I have two younger children and can’t usually take them in, understandably). I’d say there are maybe a quarter to a third of parents there at the ones I’ve been to at most- sometimes there will just be 4 or 5 parents out of a class of almost 30. I think it’s good schools do this, and the fact they do quite a few means hopefully you can make a few of them. (Appreciate some people can’t make any at all, but then is the alternative to not do it at all? Seems a shame to me).

If teachers are very hard-pressed 😂😂😂

You really do have no idea. And I say that kindly, because I can see you are desperately trying to find a solution but the reality is, chronic underfunding by the Govt means schools and teachers are on their knees and there is no wriggle room any more, in time or money.

New teachers DO go into schools from training colleges. My OH is mentoring a student in his class right now – it's a six-week placement that ends soon. His job in that time has been to teach her to teach, which he must do on top of all his other work. Yes, she can help around the classroom setting stuff up, but she needs to be supervised under what the Govt expects of these placement schemes, so it does end up being micro management. Fortunately she's a great student but he's also had terrible ones that require so much support. And yes, teachers should have non-contact time outside of their PPA time, but ask any and they'll confirm they rarely get it.

And any parent who goes into school to help out on a weekly basis to assist kids 1-1 with reading will have to be DBS checked.

I'm learning a lot. It sounds truly terrible in schools, with just unrealistic/ impossible demands being placed on teachers.

I guess there just is no solution.

Diverseopinions One solution would be for concerned parties like yourself to petition the Govt to fund schools better. Instead, we have parents complaining that schools aren't good enough but passing the blame to teachers as though they're in control of how much money schools get. It's no wonder so many are leaving the profession now and there's a recruitment crisis. My OH and I are grateful our DC are secondary age and nearly done with their school education – if I had a child starting Reception now I would be really worried about how much more education can go downhill in this country. The fact that my teacher OH thinks that speaks volumes.

So now there's 30 parents crammed into the classroom looking at their kids work books, where are the kids? If the kids are getting ready for the play, who's supervising them? If it's the teachers who's talking to the parents? And how long do you think it would take 2 teachers to deal with 30 parents all vying for attention?

The reason these ideas aren't in use isn't because no one is as clever as you, it's because they're untenable.

And we look at their books at parents evening so that's what you do whilst you wait your turn, which is efficient and stops people getting grumpy.

Perhaps it's time to retrain as a teacher and show them how it's done

I don't expect teachers have much say over whether Santa is hired at a fee, or concerts scheduled. That is management, no doubt.

Being a school governor was good though, and made a difference, as there were never enough people who volunteered.

My children are older now but I was always delighted to get these invitations from the schools they attended. Some I could attend and I went to them, some I couldn’t as I was working and others I just didn’t attend for other reasons. I always felt it was an opportunity be included if you could be there but there was no obligation whatsoever. Some parents will be at every event, some at none but most will attend a few when they can.
My children were pleased if I showed up (usually 😂) but didn’t bat an eyelid if I didn’t.
You will relax into it all and realise there is no pressure.

I'm on the PTA at our school and trust me, your child won't be the only on without a parent. We also make sure all the kids see Santa whether they have paid or not too. It isn't feasible to do stuff at the weekend, we all have lives too and many of us work weekends so sadly there's always some that will miss out. Pick and choose the things you're happy to take time off for, sadly this is all part of being a working parent

You can’t always be there, lots won’t. If you know some other parents going you can ask them to say a special hello, or take pics - that made my kids happier if we couldn’t be there.

I found the daytime requests got fewer as they got older, they like to do a lot of settling in stuff to start with.

As an EYFS teacher, I see both sides. I am gutted for the kids whose parents don't show but I'm also gutted for my own child because I can't get there.
We do try and do things just after they come in or just before hometime but we do have children who attend wrap around care. Evening shows are put on for the Y6 performance but that is unrealistic for EYFS 😭

Am being I unreasonable to think that these kinds of things should be on a Saturday and legitimately be optional, rather than in the school days when many parents are working?

But weekdays is when the TEACHERS are working!!!!

...and more importantly, when all the kids are at school.

I think it's far more important that all the kids get to take part in the event, than have many of them miss it (because their families have weekend commitments that mean that their parents can't get them there - or just CBA to) just so that a few working parents can watch.

Would you not be able to ask the teacher to take little one to see santa in school if you are unable to go? I'm sure you won't be the only one who can't be there, I have been in this situation so I sympathise with you, usually the staff will sit with the children and step in to accompany the ones who's parents can't be there especially the younger the children are

Agreed.
I always feel 1 event with parents per year is enough. I get you can't have evening events as nursery staff don't work at night.
The marathon will be nice but joining them for Xmas lunch is not necessary and unfair for those whose parents can't attend.

..and more importantly, when all the kids are at school.

True.

But my point here was that it gets forgotten that teachers already work at weekends on prep, marking and what have you and that supervising kids etc is on top of that and social life etc. And of course, teachers have children of their own who maybe deserve some parent time too??

Before anyone mentions it, yes, I know all about school holidays but then I also know about many teachers who spend chunks of school holidays working on "stuff" for the next term etc etc etc!

The nature of working when one has children is that sometimes something has to give, and if that means missing certain things at school because of work commitments, then so be it. It is part of learning about work life for the child!! Teachers miss things at their own children's schools all the time!!

no pressure to attend or drop everything

Can your parents go, or your partners parents go. So they get to see there grand child and your child has someone there.? I asked my mum, to attend some things I couldn't attend.
But it is annoying, when schools want money, when it's near the of the month and you are skint, they will have yet another, dress up as x and pay us. Or it's some bake sale
Paying to see santa is a bit rich, they should do that for free. Or not at all.

Look, I'm a teacher myself. I know this stuff, and frankly none on number is likely to forget this because they're already fed up of us moaning.

So how about we centre the kids here instead of making it all about us? Because their participation is the most important bit about school time events. Not whether all the parents can come. And the weekend suggestions are about that too. And many kids can't come to weekend things at school.

none on number

No-one on mumsnet, ffs. Why don't I check before pressing submit?

I always miss these type of events, I’m there for the big ones like the nativity and sports day etc. sadly that is reality nowadays for loads of parents. My kids are getting older now and understand, but I appreciate the guilt is hard. As others have said, you won’t be alone.

What I was saying was not "all about us"! I think the kids are centred in the bigger picture that they can participate on weekdays at school, and they can also learn about the reality of working life etc etc, parents can't always be there etc etc

And "centring the kids" very quickly becomes "teachers should/could/must ..." Frankly if people are "fed up with the moaning" they need to listen to the points being made because it's not moaning, it is perspective reality for teachers and people need reminding!

I'm talking as a Headteacher who ensures very clearly that the teacher perspective including all the extras they do with the children right at the centre is very much made a part of parent's awareness. We also make a point of acknowledging the difficulties for parents who can't make some events and talk about that with them.

As others have said, you won't be the only parent not attending, you just have to explain to DC that you will be at work. Schools do things like this in the working day because that's when they're open - they are aware that not all parents and caregivers can attend but they still have to offer for those who can. I don't agree with the £6 for Santa thing. When I worked at a primary school we'd buy gifts for all of the children (out of our own pockets) and Santa would give them out at the Christmas party - that way nobody missed out.