School keeps asking for parents to join in in the middle of the working day?!

[artline200]

I am new to the whole school emails thing, but my son has started at a pre-school attached to a new infants school. Teaching is great, we love it. But they are asking for a lot of parent participation, which I feel quite trapped by. It will be a friendly request, such as come in at 2pm to celebrate the children’s achievements in the mini marathon. To attend I would need to take time off work to go. And if i don’t go will my son be sad that he’s one of the only kids without a parent there? It breaks my heart to think that.

The latest email, which has really wound me up, is an invitation for parents to join children at 12pm for christmas lunch. I have to pay for a lunch I don’t want, and take time off work to be there. And on top of this if my child would like to see Santa and receive a gift I need to pay £6. This isn't exactly optional as I can’t be the only mum who doesn’t join for Christmas dinner and doesn’t buy my kid a ticket to see Santa. Imagine how he would feel, for a teacher to tell him, no your mummy can;t come.

Am being I unreasonable to think that these kinds of things should be on a Saturday and legitimately be optional, rather than in the school days when many parents are working? or at least kept to a minimun and dates sent out at the start of term?! It creates such an unfair divide for children and puts so much pressure on working parents who already have to take time out for school holidays, inset days and sicknesses.

Maybe the Education Department needs to think of some imaginative strategies involving student teachers in universities and colleges, who come to school on placements. These trainees could organise the play, raffle and cake sale. I bet they are jolly useful anyway in getting some of the workload covered .

YANBU OP. Well perhaps you are about the Saturday idea, but not the rest of it. My kids went to a Catholic school and there was lots of this sort of thing - I think they thought the mums were all good little Catholic women staying at home to have babies and be home-makers, who could drop their housework with no notice to rack up at school. I complained frequently about the lack of notice and that did at least change, but the number of events increased! Problem is - you don’t want to miss out on them because they are really precious times. I don’t think it’s unreasonable to want the number limited and to have plenty of notice.

I agree with you op. I always found it odd how often parents were invited in during the day. Much more often than my mum was during the 70s/80s. Kids do get upset if other parents are there and theirs aren't. Not at secondary level, but the first half of primary they do. I saw it with my own eyes many times. Our primary did this thing at the end of class assemblies where the rest of the school filed out but the class that had done the class assembly stayed for the parents to come over and say "well done" etc. It rubbed it in even more.

I have volunteered as a school governor. We thought of imaginative strategies to cut down on visits for working parents, e.g. combining monitoring visits with committee meetings, so that the two took place on the same morning, instead of on separate days, as they used to.

But it is true: like student teachers, school governors can be very useful and could organise a fund raising cake sale and raffle and help with arrangements for staging the Christmas play.

Come to think of it, an imaginative bod might try to give a school governor a 'parentless' group of Santa-watchers, and be a bit mother/ father henish, guiding the little chicks to the big occasion in Santa's grotto, honorary godparent style, and putting in some encouragement.

Student teachers cannot be drafted in for an evening to oversee a whole year group of children put on a performance without senior supervision – the school's teachers and SLT would still have to be present, so the issue of overtime and extra budget still exists. Plus, again, you can't really expect those children – some as young as four and five – and their parents to hang around at school for three-four hours while the parents' evening is completed to then put on a show. It's a silly idea, sorry.

What the Department for Education needs to do is fund schools properly.

I always went for dgc as my dd is a teacher at a different school. However all plays/concerts etc had two performances afternoon and early evening so parents could choose. I

The kids can have activities at school without the parents. I’d have a word with the school on this matter. People work on Saturday and Sunday too so school events then would still be a problem.

I'm interested how many people suggest another relative could go. That probably only works if they are llocal and don't work ft
For us, GPS we're either elderly and didn't drive, or were elderly and did drive but lived 1 hr 20 away. Other relatives either lived over an hour away/abroad or worked ft and wouldn't want to come to a school thing on their days off.

I think schools are damned if they do and damned if they don't with this sort of thing. A school that only did anything for parents once a year in the evenings would be told they weren't trying to engage with the wider community.

Plus there will be people who can come in the day and not in the evenings - plenty of parents work shifts. Grandparents, parents working at home. People with very young babies. For some people day time is easier.

I don't see the problem - it's rare at my school that there are more than a handful of parents for anything in the day but some of those parents can't do evenings. Surely it's better to have the option?

As far as paying for Santa goes - school budgets are at the point they can barely cover staff costs, books and heating. Usually there is a hardship fund for those who can't afford it, and most things that go out from our school (trips etc) have something along the lines of contact the school office if you can't afford it so children aren't disadvantaged. The school will also know the children on pupil premium and free school meals and discreetly speak to those parents and ensure those children are subsidised by the rest. But there's no give at all in school budgets.

My prediction is it will be increasingly common for schools to close as there is no money for supply, as TA redundancies happen to make the numbers work, and as staff get sick. I also think the number of trips and additional fun experiences for the kids will reduce. Teachers are doing their best but it's a grim environment finance wise in state schools at the moment.

I'd imagine the £6 Santa is a voluntary contribution is so all kids get a gift. Those who can afford it, pay, and those who can't, don't. Much the same as voluntarily contributing to a field trip, they're always expensive because the wealthier are expected to subsidise the deprived. If there isn't enough contribution from parents who can afford to, then it's cancelled.

Genuinely curious, do teachers enjoy having parents in for all these things or is it just massive hassle?

I normally try to go to nursery/school events, but if I can't I've asked another parent to keep an eye out for my child. It makes a big difference to children to have an adult (even if not a parent) noticing them and praising their performance. My friend who went to the last performance (I was in hospital) told my DC how great they had been, sent me some photos and a video and took my DC home for tea and a playdate with her child, telling DC that she was their "mummy for the day". DC was so happy and still remembers that as being a good day, even though neither parent could be there.

You really are over thinking this. Of course lots of parents won't go and you (& your DC) need to toughen up about supporting these events. Most schools wouldn't really be able to cope anyway if every parent turned up.
I was a SAHM for many years and didn't attend every event ... most of them were pretty dreary anyway - you are honestly not missing much (I quickly learned not to go to anything that included school catering ). I preferred to support the PTA which met in the evenings & DH was a School Governor.

I always wonder about this. And the millions of dressing up days!

But parents who ask for time off to attend a play are jeopardising their earning potential by showing their employers that prioritise their children and by making things more difficult for the rest of their work team

Perhaps if more dads asked for time off, it would become more normal. It's only because it's historically mums who ask.

There will be a lot of kids whose parents can't come due to work, I'm sure. When I was at school, my mum worked as a civil servant and flexible working was not an option back then so my grandma often attended. I'm sure my mum found it a wrench not being able to come for herself but I didn't mind. Would that be an option for you OP?

Some of these comments are so entitled!

Teachers are often parents too! How are they supposed to be doing these things out of school hours when they have their own kids to look after?! Just remember THEY are missing out on all the school day events for their own kids because they are busy doing it for YOUR children! They can't (not just don't want to) take any time off during school hours!

Teachers work bloody hard long hours and shouldn't be asked to work weekends or more evenings so you don't need to ask your boss for some flexibility or time off so you can go to the school Christmas performance or whatever. Just because kids are in school it doesn't mean you are desolved of all responsibility for them.

However plenty of parents don't go. You prioritise, get to what you can, ask other parents to send you the video, ask someone to go for you. It's not the schools responsibility to accommodate all working patterns.

Personally I changed careers to something close to home with shorter more flexible hours to be able to save on all wages going on childcare and be there for more stuff, not have the stress when there's illness and can't go to school etc. Yes we don't have as much money as if I worked full time in the city, but it's a compromise we decided to make as a family.

I have acquaintances that moan about school always doing parent stuff in the school day. But they also can't comprehend that I have purposefuly taken a much lower paid job so I can. They have a big house and several foreign holidays but can't go to all the school things because of their jobs. We don't have the house the holidays etc, but I usually (but still not always) can go to the school stuff. Our choice - that's there's.

I do appreciate not everyone can change jobs, but as a parent it's just one of those things you have to plan for. When the opportunity comes up for a job with family friendly flexibility then take it if you want to get involved in stuff during the school day!

Well said!!!! At least the people moaning about not wanting to use annual leave etc for these things actually have the option to do so. The children of teachers will go through their whole school life not having a parent being able to attend events because they are teaching other people's children. They even have to miss their own child's parents evening if it falls on a date when their class/year group parents evening is scheduled. So perhaps all these people moaning about what an inconvenience things are should take a moment to appreciate what teachers actually sacrifice to ensure they are giving the posters children the education they deserve. And before anyone says if they don't like it then get another job, lots are and that's one of the reasons why Education is in the mess it's in. Asking teachers to give up yet more of their unpaid time to do these activities in the evenings or weekends would further add to the recruitment and retention crisis. Schools and teachers are at breaking point and deserve our appreciation not to be criticised at every opportunity.

I suppose I should be shocked by the almost complete absence of mention of children's FATHERS and posters' HUSBANDS on this thread, but instead it's just disappointing. @artline200 why can't you share some of the events with your DH/DC's father?

DH and I both WFH in very flexible roles so one of us if not both can usually attend things at school.
I do have 2 friends who work in other schools, 1 who is a nurse and 1 who is a dental nurse so they all regularly miss events. The parents who do go out of our group look out for the kids who don't have a parent there, take pics etc

I actually don’t mind the school day activities, and get it, they can’t organise everything for the evening. The one thing I was a bit 🙄 at my school was i enquires about joining the PTA but all their meetings are straight after school, middle of the afternoon. So basically any parents who work are excluded…

I’m going for massive hassle. They’re teachers because they enjoy teaching children. Not because they like interacting with adults!!

Would love feedback from teachers on that tho.

Your suggestion of doing these things on a Saturday did make me laugh, are you proposing teachers attend unpaid on their day off so you can attend? They have lives too!

I have 2 school age children (reception and y2) they have been at the school since nursery. They invite parents in for various things probably once or twice a month. My husband is a teacher and I work ft, my husband never attends as he cant take time off, I get to maybe 3 things a year (the big events). Our children are sad we can't attend but I tell them the reason we can't is because we work and need to pay for the nice holidays and life we have, they understand but will still look disappointed. You can't go to everything if you have a job, that's life. My husband can only get to evening events, thankfully the nativity is being performed at 6pm so we can attend.

As for requests for money etc, it's relentless, we spend £100s on school events, collections you name it. Everyday it's something else, the requests are staggering.

When mine was at school and, come to think of it, when I was at school, events did take place on a Saturday. What's more children were supposed to attend and there was trouble if they didn't, barring illness or accident. Teachers were there too, quite involved in whatever was going on; I don't know if they were all there but plenty were. Parents came along with their children. Nobody seemed to mind about it all happening on a Saturday (except perhaps me :-) when I was a child, I accepted going with my child).

Times have changed.

That’s because teachers used to well paid , their salary in real terms is 50% less than it was 50 years ago.
They need their time off.