DH and aligning in-laws

[jhfs8979]

You read a lot on MN about sons not bothering about their aging parents and I seem to be married to one. DH's parents are elderly, his father is bed bound and his mother had a breakdown and has been in a mental hospital for the last six months. DH's sister lives with his parents and is caring for the dad while holding down a full time job. Initially when MIL went into hospital DH would go over for a day or two per week to help out the sister but then it stopped being practical and he has now only been once every month/ every other month. He has only visited his mother in hospital once back in the summer and hasnt bothered since.We live in the same city as them though it does take over an hour and half each way to get to them from our place.

I know it's his family and I leave him to it. But it feels rather heartless and very uncaring. He would say that he loves me and the kids etc and we are definitely 50/50 when it comes to raising them. It just feels like he's basically abandoned his family and it has sort of impacted on how I see him. I just feels weird reconciling this image of him as a caring family man to us who has simultaneously given up on his parents and effectively sister when they are all really struggling. Not sure what the AIBU is here - but perhaps it's whether or not I am unreasonable to feel that his attitude has impacted on my image of him, I guess.

I am not actually sure DH wants his parents in a home. He says it's up to his sister. Mentions that his dad doesnt want to go and neither does his sister. He is definitely relying on her taking care of FIL. And kind of expects his mother to pick up where she left of once back from the hospital, this is totally unrealistic as apparently his mother is barely walking now. In the case of his sister, she seems to feel overwhelmed and sort of soldiering on like her mother. DH would actually be completely fine if the whole inheritance goes to her.

But why is your mums lack of boundaries your uncles fault? If they abused her let them rot.

It seems the sister won't be helped so maybe your husband wants to wash his hands of it all. It sounds very messy.

Your PIL should free SIL to live her own life. I hope I don't put that on my adult DC in the prime of their lives. Dreadful letting her do that because FIL 'doesn't want' to go into a home. I would think a lot less of them prioritising themselves at her expense indefinitely.
Was SIL the favoured one growing up?

@MrsDanversGlidesAgain indeed though some people feel deeply the priority of their own needs to the exclusion of anyone else. You might have felt deeply the rightness of your treatment of the second Mrs De Winter but that wouldn't necessarily have made that bad behaviour right.

The support she needed wasn’t with physical care, it was decision making. And I said I suspect abuse however it has never been confirmed by anyone, they just say they didn’t have great childhoods. My uncle was still visiting but would go in for a few minutes then disappear for months after giving my Mum a list of jobs to do.

@cptartapp SIL was definitely not the favoured child. But she's younger and basically never left home. The current set up is hard. FIL refuses to go into a home, MIL is out of the picture for the last six months and cant have a say. SIL is finding it extraordinarily hard but cant see another way because she's grown up with it. Quietly I think everyone is waiting for MIL to return and get back to it. But she wont be able to - not anymore. It is hard and very emotional. But FIL didnt ask to be disable, MIl didnt ask for her lot in life either.

My parents are in the same city as us, we usually see them every other week. DH is actually really nice with them. So it's seems odd that it's only with his folks that he is like that. However, I dont think his parents were bad parents or anything. They were nice in a way that was usual for their class and generation. No, they didnt teach him how to ski, he couldnt always bring friends home because of the dad but they took them on holiday, the kids had hobbies, a nice enough home, went to a standard school. Apart from his dad becoming disable, there was no other trauma and whilst his mum probably didnt support DH enough through that - she had a husband to look after, SIL who was still little at the time and I guess his mum just assumed he'd be alright.

this would disturb me and I think I would lose some respect for DH over this. I would ask him if this bothered him. What would he want to happen to him if he was sick in hospital and I was unable to visit? How would he like his kids to treat him?

I would take the kids to hospital once per week or once per fortnight to see MiL (if she was able to interact with them and if they were allowed on the ward). I’d also try and visit FiL with them. I would want to teach my kids that it is a good thing to visit relatives to cheer them up if they are ill or lonely. In the right situation Care homes can be a positive thing - if there is help for the day to day physical care, sometimes relatives and friends can have more energy to put into the social side of things - chatting, looking at photos etc.

This is totally all relative to the relationship they have abd how close they are abd what was done in the past.

For example my in-laws are currently still fit and they do a fair amount of childcare for SIL (my husbands sister) and almost nothing for us because we live a lot further away. I'm clearly expecting my SIL to take more of a leading role in the care when they are older. My husband can't keep going home to care for them when they are older in the same way that they just couldn't come over every time we need someone to watch our kids. They do this for SIL and I think she gets my thoughts on this.

@jhfs8979 not much of advice but you could reach out to your SIL and offer to do something nice for her? Even ordering food / groceries online (if you can afford to) if you can’t go to her. Any small gesture that shows her she has someone else she might be able to count on. Not necessarily for day to day but anything at all that provides her some relief ?

Yep, I've offered that once the kids are on holidays, DH can go and stay with PIL and SIL can come and stay at our house for a week to give her a break. Not sure if DH mentioned it to her not. I know she wouldnt want to impose etc

I have not seen a man do hands-on care. Almost always, it seems to be the women. What I have seen of men doing care is they basically visit for a short period, then after they leave, they give a verbal assessment of the quality of care provided by the other family caregivers, and usually give the sisters or other women caregivers a lot of instructions. They seem to consider that to be a form of "helping." Then they disappear for months or a year or more, content in the knowledge they've done their part. So your husband's unwillingness to provide care may or may not be down to his parents' failures when they took care of him as a child, or maybe it's just that he's a man and men can always come up with a rationale for not providing care.

I think there is a difference between having a boring or blah childhood, vs having a childhood with neglect or abuse. It's hard to say if your husband is being fair here: ski trips and guiding your child to the best universities or professional path isn't a marker of your fitness as a parent.

On the other hand, your husband's father would rather see his wife make herself sick caring for him, and would rather see his daughter spend her best years caring for him, than go into a home. I'm sure there are many elderly people who do the same, but I think it's a bit selfish. Your husband can certainly nudge his sister to tell his dad she can't care for him any more, so that he is left with no other choice but to go into a home, but I think his father's refusal to do so (unless forced) puts a pretty big guilt-trip on his daughter. It's going to be hard for your husband to work around that, and he probably knows it. It sounds like your husband has essentially taken the position that his sister should save herself, and if she chooses not to, it's not your husband's job to put himself in the same bad position as his sister just because she has chosen to enable her father's needy choices.

As to his mother: he should visit his mother in hospital.

I think it's trembly difficult and a very complex dynamic and you seeing him as cold and heartless is unfair.

What I'm hearing from his 'side' is that his mother was entirely focused on FIL's care from when DH was fairly young. She may have been emotionally fixed on that and not his needs. He is their child so adequate physical care and hobbies doesn't really cut it. He clearly found his very difficult and left as soon as he could. But always felt out of place and untethered as is really common with children who haven't had a good attachment to parents. He talks about this in terms of skiing and university but what he may actually be saying is that no one cared and parented and looked after him in the way that would have made him confident and happy. He still feels the lack of it.

He got out, made himself, is successful. However, addressing their care needs makes him avoidant because he has to then remember their lack of care of him. He's avoiding thinking about it, looking at it because it's painful.

His sister on the other hand went the other way and has a codependent, overly attached relationship, modelling mum's behaviour. Some of which is definitely about sex-roles and as a feminist that gets my back up. But I don't think your DH is just being a typical sexist bloke here.

All of the above might be bollocks but I'd lay money it's not. He needs support, love and space to process stuff. Probably someone trained to listen.

By now, FIL has late stage Parkinsons with bouts of dementia. I am not sure that he is able to make any such decisions. He's not been mentally fit for years now, so it's not like he's happy for this or that, as much as being unable to think what he wants/needs. Thats one of the reasons SIL cant leave him on his own, FIL forgets where he is and gets really frightened. He cant wander off because he is now bedbound but it's pretty traumatic to watch (according to DH).

I have no idea whether DH thinks they should go into a home. Not sure he's thought that far. He says SIL cant cope but that no one wants to go into a home. No idea how he squares that one other than washing his hands of it

@jhfs8979 I feel similar about my dh His parents are elderly and mostly housebound and have carers and other suppport coming in. They are warm, fed and get visits from cleaner, physio, befriender etc. But each visit lasts an hour and his parents are lonely and bored. Especially at weekends.

dh thinks that he and his siblings should have a rota meaning he would visit once a month. Other siblings are all going twice a month and I think it is becoming obvious that dh isn't doing an equal share. NB other siblings are still working and dh is retired so he theoretically has more time, but in practice has filled his life with projeccts and hobbies.

I totally understand that there's not much joy or excitment in the visits - mild dementia and hearing loss (theirs not his!) make conversation almost impossible so visits consist of helping out with various tasks and watching the TV. dh does pull his weight when he's there - cooking, cleaning up, doing various household tasks, gardening etc. I go whenever I can.

It doesn't help that PILs live 2 hours drive away, so every trip involves 4 hours car journey, but it's pretty much similar for the other siblings.

Other siblings also phone almost daily (their choice), send letters and cards and are just a lot more 'involved'. One sibling organises the carers' support / social care, another deals with the finances. One helps her Mum with clothes, hair washing, looking after her nails etc.

I feel like I have to prompt dh to call and remind him abut visits - he's reluctant to plan much in advance and I feel like I'm nagging him. I do feel that I've lost some respect for him and I see him in a different light. He had a very good childhood and loves his parents but he is putting his selfish interests first. I know that when at some point things change (we expect a crisis at any time), he will do everything he can to provide practical support and has spoken about moving in with them (for a limited period) if either were on their own for a while.

I try not to say anything, his relationship with his parents and siblings is his responsibility, but I feel it also affects my relationship with them too.

Sorry OP, I've not provided any solutions.

For those suggesting shelterd housing, care homes, nursing homes - we (that being the wider family) are finding it almost impossible to get that kind of support.

I assume you bringing a fictional story into this is a misplaced attempt at humour. And why shouldn't people prioritise their own needs if it's to protect themselves?

@MrsTerryPratchett I think you are spot on. However, DH was 16/17 when his dad got sick. His sister was only 9 so I get that MIL though DH would be ok. He was almost an adult and yes, he didnt get much guidance and support from then on but I can understand how you'd think a 16 year old would be ok enough in comparison to a very ill person or a 9 year old. Thats not to say that I love my MIL. We are complete opposites but now that I have kids, I can see how she would have been completely floured with it all. But his mum was there throughout his childhood and really did try her best. I thin that FIL was mainly busy at work when the kids were little.

It's just that now they are really in trouble and I guess I feel like DH does owe them especially as we're not that far away.

I think what irks is that both MIL and SIL have basically always tried their best and Dh just hasnt and seems to think that just because he's got a job and kids, he's busy enough.

@jhfs8979 thats sweet of you. Do you not talk to her directly ? How old is your SIL, if you don’t mind my asking ? It must be quite hard for her over the holidays to shoulder everything on her own?

Im not sure sil is doing best shes doing what she learnt from her mum...
Her losing her life cos she can't leave fil is not good...
You say youd be upset if your dc were like this ... id be devastated if my dd was living her life like this .. wheres her chance to have her own kids/family if shes still at home...??

Maybe get your dh to help his sister escape and have her own future....how old is she?? If she wants kids she could be losing out...

Maybe mil should be discharged into a home.... if dh not bothered about inheritance maybe he could be suggesting that to his sister...
And help her find one....for both/each if fil got parkjnsons/dementia has he still got capacity..

You cant make him look after his parents but you could suggesthe supports his sister....

@Lost2010 she is 30 so never got a chance to live her life really. We dont talk much which is a shame but she is lovely and the kids love hanging out with her.

@averythinline in practice, SIL is currently only managing the day to day life i.e. basic care of FIL, sorting out all the carers, infections and hospital appointments plus her very full on and full time job. She doesnt have capacity to look for homes or even sorting out paperwork etc. But DH says he hasnt go time either especially as neither of them are interested.

And it's not like I would want my kids to look after me at home. But DH doesnt even think about visiting his mum in a hospital - that I would expect my kids to do especially if they all lived in the same city as us. I would probably also expect them to at least help with some of the admin and paperwork that both MIL and FIL can no longer managed and SIL is too busy to sort out

Blood doesn’t create a debt— this is spot on about my family too.

@jhfs8979 all the more for you to reach out to her even if just a shoulder to lean on now and again. You sound like a caring person and even the smallest of gesture would be appreciated by your SIL.

It’s not a question of ‘wanting’ to go into a home, it’s a question of keeping his parents safe and not destroying his sister’s life by expecting her to do all the care. I think he’s being very selfish. I didn’t want my mum (who also had Parkinson’s with dementia) to go into a home, but she wasn’t safe at home any more (falls, wandering out of the house at night).

I agree with the previous posters who have said that it’s a typically male thing to assume that someone else will do the caring.