To think Scotland should become independent?

[antelopevalley]

As life continues to get worse in the UK, it is time for Scotland to go independent. We need to build a forward-looking country that invests in its future, rather than the backward-looking country the UK has become that prioritises the rich. It is time for Scotland to separate from the UK and become that country.

Have you watched the Scottish parliament in action? Absolutely embarrassing.

The OP wants to rewild Scotland

So OP, please do touch on the economic / business interests Scotland does have, please?
Last go around was economically dependent on Oil. Think that ship has sailed. So what is our industry? Building ferries, paid for by the Scottish tax payer ? Frigates for the rest of the UK ? please, do tell .

Yes, they’re a bunch of idiots as well, but “the market” prices in the risk of idiots (see the mini-budget whirlwind), and the WM government has the stability (ish) of Whitehall behind it so they can weather more storms.

The Scottish government has neither competence in politicians nor in the civil service to support an economic strategy to support the ambitions they trumpet but don’t cost, relying instead on the magic money tree.

Who’d want to buy debt from a small, corrupt country with talent free politicians and a civil service as deep as a puddle? They’ll price in the risk and we’ll all pay the penalty for it (at least those of us who stay).

No it would APPLY to joint the EU ! Given the state of public finances in Scotland ( where , by the way , we pay higher tax than in England) I cannot imagine the EU welcoming us with open arms !
Piece of advice - don’t listen to Sturgeon .

Couldn’t have put it better myself .
People in other parts of the U.K. shouldn’t be fooled by the gimmicks like Baby Boxes ( which are very nice but not everyone needs one)

'This abundance of resources is the reason England cling to us and tell us constantly that we are too stupid, too poor, too small to succeed alone.'

The 'too wee, too poor, too stupid' bollocks has been bandied about by the SNP for years so that it's become a fact that union supporters/Westminster govt/ Tories actually said it. Which they haven't. But claim it enough and it becomes the SNP truth.

And yet it still manages to be less embarrassing than Westminster!

Don't bore us to death, all you need to do is to convince the 50% of Scots who still don't want independence to vote for it.

Do you understand that this is circular reasoning which is logically invalid?

Most people in England are in favour of Scotland staying in the UK as they believe we're stronger together as one. The UK Government has the same view.

Every part of the UK has a deficit except for the south east of England which is our economic driver. The City Of London and Greater London both make far more money every year than Scotland as a whole does. The idea Scotland subsidises England is fantasy, but not the other way round.

Similar to the way there was never a condition of the 2014 that it was 'once in a generation'? That sort of myth you mean?

For those saying: we said NO, and that's it. Shite. So many NO voters have died, so many young people are now eligible to vote and their voting intentions are 70/30 in favour of independence. The demograph has changed.

The thing that I did not agree with, and still do not agree with, is non-Scots being permitted to vote on our constitutional matters.

Figures released from the 2014 referendum indicated born-Scots voted in favour of independence, whilst those born elsewhere voted against independence e.g. English students at Scottish universities, European nationals, rUK-nationals, military personnel based in Scotland etc.

England simply cannot afford to let Scotland go, that's an obvious fact. They're willing to sell NI down the river. Why? They do not need NI's resources. Yet, there they are, desperately, desperately trying to deny democracy to Scots. Why? I know why, and so do you if you have any sort of critical thought process available to you.

Put it this way, if England was confident of resounding support to remain in this (so-called) union, they'd 'permit' the people of Scotland to exercise their democratic right to demonstrate that. They don't, though, do they?

As we say in Scotland the English establishment is 'Keeching its breeks.: 🙂

The once in a generation may not have been a condition but it was actually said.

My kids are a drain on me. Doesn’t mean I want to get rid of them. I live in the UK. I am British. I want to keep it that way.

You mean a politician said something that might not be entirely accurate?

Surely that NEVER happens?

Yes agree

Like most services in Scotland though the countryside in Scotland is being greatly mismanaged by the snp.

Yes we have all these resources but no infrastructure to support. Energy storage is non existent. National grid can’t cope.

Live rurally, get yourself on your community council and you will see all the snake oil salesmen (solar panel companies) vying for planning on prime agricultural land. All land in England has been graded and the four best categories of land are to be growing food on, not so in Scotland.
(Ref. Scottish farmer and private eye)
don’t tell me animals can be in the same field as these panels, cattle will rub and break them, pigs will root and whoever suggests sheep has never had to gather them in from a field. Windmills greatly affect birds and insects causing structural damage to the ground after 20years: concrete mounds instead of mole hills, watch out walkers!
Hydro electric is not grouped in the same category as renewables so not eligible for subsidies. Aerobic digesters yes! Growing crops for energy not food, let Africa grow the food for us(not themselves) really? This doesn’t sit well for me on many levels.

they are really pushing plantations of trees for mega rich companies and individuals to greenwash. It’s Modern day highland clearances, but as long as the masses get their week’s holiday in the highlands then everything is ok.
Rewilding by landowners; you do realise it’s another guise for us plebs to get off their land; who’s going to wild/dirty camp with the added excitement of bears and wolves.

so please don’t preach of all these natural resources are enriching Scotland because under snp management it’s getting wasted and distorted.

This is an MSP. This is an MSP. There is no one - no one whatsoever in Westminster that has as few brain cells as this SNP MSP:

twitter.com/emmasnp/status/1446225938736353282?s=46&t=dFoJ2wB6hynNpB9odbN6Eg

As a woman and the mother of a daughter, I wouldn't live in Scotland for anything. Good luck there OP. The way women's rights and their ability to define and protect themselves are being dismantled by Nicola et al, is nothing short of terrifying.

Don't be brain washed by the snp! I can assure you it would only get worse than what it already is. We cannot fund ourselves as we are now and that isn't great. The snp have not done nearly enough for us in Scotland. She's only interested in her own goals and will say anything tk try and get Scotland independent.

Also take a look at this we are already paying more tax than England that will o bill go one way with independence!

Excellent point . I wonder if the rest of the U.K. fully understand what Sturgeon and co are doing to the rights of girls and women in this country ??

@ILoveXmasChocsInNov

I'd miss you but the Scottish do seem to be more progressive, liberal and open minded so I think you deserve better.

Yeah ,the SNP are really progressive,liberal and open minded for working class young people. So much, they preside over the worse drug deaths in Europe- the majority working class young people !

The demographic of Scotland really hasn't changed very significantly since 2014. Serious change of that nature takes decades.

You don't want people from other parts of the UK and Europe living in Scotland to have a vote on constitutional change?

How ironically undemocratic of you - bigoted as well!

You seem to be under the impression that there is a right to secession in international law and politics too. There, in fact, is no such right and only two countries give citizens that right.

But it's both democratic and legal for every state to say no to secessionist demands.

Secession is not a democratic right

"Currently, among the constitutional laws of the world, only two states carry the right of secession in their constitution: Ethiopia, and the Federation of Saint Kitts and Nevis."

• My Country, Europe

“In the Federal Republic of Germany, which is a nation-state based on the constituent power of the German people, states are not ‘masters of the constitution’.

Therefore there is no room under the constitution for individual states to attempt to secede. This violates the constitutional order.”

• Ruling from the Constitutional Court of the Federal Republic of Germany.

"The Constitution is based on the indissoluble unity of the Spanish Nation, the common and indivisible homeland of all Spaniards; it recognizes and guarantees the right to self-government of the nationalities and regions of which it is composed and the solidarity among them all."

• Section Two of the Spanish Constitution

"France shall be an indivisible, secular, democratic and social Republic."

• Article One of the French Constitution

"The Republic, one and indivisible, recognizes and promotes local autonomies; implements in those services which depend on the State the fullest measure of administrative decentralization; accords the principles and methods of its legislation to the requirements of autonomy and decentralization."

• Article Five of the Italian Constitution

"It is clear that international law does not specifically grant component parts of sovereign states the legal right to secede unilaterally from their "parent" state....

The various international documents that support the existence of a people's right to self-determination also contain parallel statements supportive of the conclusion that the exercise of such a right must be sufficiently limited to prevent threats to an existing state's territorial integrity or the stability of relations between sovereign states...

A state whose government represents the whole of the people or peoples resident within its territory, on a basis of equality and without discrimination, and respects the principles of self-determination in its own internal arrangements, is entitled to the protection under international law of its territorial integrity."

• Canadian Supreme Court ruling on the issue of secession

"I pledge allegiance to the Flag of the United States of America, and to the Republic for which it stands, one Nation under God, indivisible, with liberty and justice for all."

• United States of America Pledge Of Allegiance

"The answer is clear. If there was any constitutional issue resolved by the Civil War, it is that there is no right to secede. (Hence, in the Pledge of Allegiance, ‘one Nation, indivisible.’)”

• Supreme Court Justice Antonin Scalia in 2006

“Article 52 of the Constitution is a unitarian structure, indivisible, indecomposable."

Dean of the Brazilian Supreme Court, Judge Celso de Mello

"WHEREAS the people of New South Wales, Victoria, South Australia, Queensland, and Tasmania, humbly relying on the blessing of Almighty God, have agreed to unite in one indissoluble Federal Commonwealth...."

• Preamble to the Constitution of the Commonwealth of Australia

Excellent point . I wonder if the rest of the U.K. fully understand what Sturgeon and co are doing to the rights of girls and women in this country ??

The people of Scotland don't either! It's not been picked up enough in the mainstream media. There should be a mass revolt.

My friends are/were oblivious. They are trying to quietly push this through. When I attempted to discuss this on a group for women with 30k plus members many were too scared to post due to the (thankfully) few women who piped up with the usual TERF's hate trans people nonsense.

Not a coincidence they were young and in or just out of uni where 'be kind' and 'we're inclusive' is now akin to 'let men do anything they want'.

All SNP supporters seem to care about independence and not have foresight into anything else. The Tory shit show is also helping this.

Please do. I will vote for it. I live in England. I won't be funding your free prescriptions, universities, etc. Lovely.

@DownNative - Quite