People who won't leave a restaurant when their child is kicking up

[JanetSally]

I was having dinner in a restaurant the other evening. A couple at another table had a small baby with them in a buggy. The mother had just fed the baby and put him back down but he wasn't happy and started crying, the noise escalating and escalating. The parents, who had finished their meal, very slowly finished their coffee/wine before leaving the restaurant despite the fact that people were turning around and looking at them.

I was in a cafe recently with a friend when her toddler started tantrumming. I said I was nearly finished and happy to go, but my friend said no, we'd paid for our food and were entitled to stay. She just wasn't budging, so I took her child outside while she finished every bit of her cake.

Why do some people do this? It's very unfair on everyone else in the restaurant.

But surely people who can't afford fine dining are entitled to have an occasional coffee and cake in a cafe without listening to a screaming baby or tantrumming toddler at the next table?

Well the flip side of that: my friend had a really difficult colicky baby and no family support. I called over one afternoon and could see she was at the end of her tether and she hadn't eaten since the night before. So I told her to go down to the local cafe for an hour or two, get something to eat and I would mind the baby.

Another mother in the cafe was leaving her baby in the high chair roaring and crying. It went on and on and my friend's nerves just couldn't take it. She had to leave her food and come home.

I can’t vote because ywnbu with the first but the second YABU.

It reads like it was a hardship for you to help your friend out in this one instance.

I have two children and my oldest is 7 and autistic. I have taken them to restaurants since they were babies (yes even when one was a toddler and one was a baby). I always went during quiet times, restaurants were empty, and placed near a door for a quick exit. I ask for the check in advance and order things that can be wrapped up and taken away quickly. When I have gone to a restaurant alone what bothers me the most is seeing a couple or a group of people out at the same table who are all eating but what looks like the mother is going outside or walking a child around to soothe them while the rest eat their food and chat to each other so she not only doesn’t get to eat her food while it’s fresh or even warm but then by time she returns, people look for her to finish quickly when none of them helped or even offered to take over when they were done eating. She paid for a meal too, but that doesn’t seem to matter, ticks me off more when I see this on Mother’s Day.

I’ve been that mum, it sucks, and it hurts at times which is why I treasure eating alone and offer assistance to fellow parents that I know. Other moms and I take turns because most of us know what it’s like.

As a friend, it shouldn’t be an irritation to help out a friend with their child so they could finish their piece of cake. Yes, you eventually took her tot out but you used this as an example to talk about your friend. If this bothers you so, then either invite her out when she can come alone, go to hers or invite them over.

I was in a very very upmarket restaurant in London for dinner last year. A family came in with a toddler. There were no kids menus, no highchairs but the family said the child would nibble on bread and bits of their dinner.

If the child sat at the table they would have had to have had the dinner menu personally so the girl was plonked on the lap of one of the group and then passed around getting in the poor waiting staff's way as they were trying to serve. My heart sank and so did others around me. They clearly couldnt give a stuff about anyone else and it was one of the most inappropriate places I have seen a young person taken to.

The child started wriggling and then wanting to walk around the small restaurant followed by their doting Mother who clearly thought people would think it adorable. In the end the girl started wailing because she wasnt allowed to push the door into the kitchen and two separate couples spoke to the Maitre'd to complain quite rightly. One of the waitresses eventually took the child into the kitchen but honestly some people are as thick as anything. Why go to a 3 star Michelin restaurant and spoil it for others.

I 100% agree. However, I don't think it should have to be a Michelin Star restaurant for basic standards and respect for those around you to be exercised.

Even if I'm in Nando's (I don't really goto Nando's but it was the first place that popped into my head), whilst I don't expect the same ambience (as Micky Flanagan would say) as a top-end restaurant, I would still expect common courtesy and there not be screaming kids running about the place.

And your friend couldn’t muster some sympathy for a mother in the exact same position as her, just without the free childcare from a friend? Hmm

You and your friends have had an awful lot of experiences leaving meals due to crying children.

I can’t say this is a common experience for me at all.

“The general rule should be that as far as possible you don't take a baby to any public place if it's likely to disturb people by crying. Not even a Pizza Hut for lunch on a Saturday. A restaurant visit is a recreation, it's not a necessity, you don't impact other people so you can have a good time.”

There is literally someone up thread who has said you shouldn’t take a baby out dining.

Totally agree. That’s just appalling behaviour by the parents. If you can afford a 3 Michelin Star meal for the family, you can definitely afford a babysitter. I don’t know what goes through these people’s minds when they bring a baby somewhere like this? Like genuinely, what on earth are they thinking?

YABU. If I’ve paid for a meal I’m not just going to leave it.

My toddler isn’t going to learn how to behave in a restaurant if we never take her and show her how.

We don’t use screens, we take books, colouring, stickers etc. We never ignore her when she’s upset though, we deal with whatever the problem is and work through her emotions.

As a result of our being shown how to behave in public she is an absolute angel and we can happily take her to cafes, restaurants etc with no issues.

Eh I left one restaurant with a tantrumming toddler. Stop making stuff up.
And why does one mum's needs trump another's? You seem to be very selective with your compassion. My point was that crying and screaming children can also cause distress to struggling young parents trying to eat out.

You’ve never left a place earlier than you’d originally planned due to a poor ambience? Lucky you!

I live in a ‘yummy mummy’ part of London and just this morning I had to leave a coffee shop early due to a squealing toddler. Luckily I hadn’t planned to spend longer than 20 mins there, but it was still frustrating to not get as much time out of the rain as I had hoped.

(To be clear I am not saying that the parents should have stayed home.)

I wasn't irritated about helping out. I was surprised she didn't see the need to take her child out when she was throwing a complete tantrum.

Maybe some people just don’t ‘see it’? I’m not excusing it in any way, but perhaps if you’re used to the noise of a screaming toddler, you don’t realise how annoying it is to other people? Given how many times I have seen this happen (see my post above about yummy mummy area), I can’t believe there can be that many intentionally uncaring and selfish/entitled parents out there.

This.

Yes I think some parents are so used to eating against a background of wailing and crying it barely registers anymore and they don't realise that they're driving other customers mad.
That's really why managers should intervene. But then you get parents harumphing on social media and asking people to boycott the place.

Exactly. It's ridiculous to subject the greater public to one's personal parenting philosophy. Ignore them at home if you must, but manage them in public.

There is no good reason that a baby needs to be dining out, or its parents for that matter. If it can be done discreetly, fine, but if it's at the expense of others who are not being disruptive, then no. Even if traveling, get some bread & cheese or takeaway and eat in the hotel room. Better that than to disturb people who ARE behaving properly in public.

I think there has been such a deterioration of public manners -- people dress and act as though they are in their own lounge even at West End theatres and the like, let alone restaurants and cafes. It's depressing, really.

I think there has been such a deterioration of public manners -- people dress and act as though they are in their own lounge even at West End theatres and the like, let alone restaurants and cafes.

@ZeldaWillTellYourFortune There is no good reason that a baby needs to be dining out, or its parents for that matter.

What’s your good reason for ever eating out of the house and we can all assess if it’s good enough and if you’re allowed to be out in public either?

Er, ok. Well fuck the ‘general rule’ anyone can eat out anywhere they like and if misery guts like you don’t like it then don’t eat out.

And more and more places will become childfree.

exactly! Who does @ZeldaWillTellYourFortune think she is 😂 like anybody needs a reason to eat a meal in a restaurant. You sound so entitled it’s unreal. Don’t dictate to people where they can eat or where they can go. I have a baby and I wouldn’t let you tell me I have no reason to be eating out. Who needs your permission?

Your post has hit the rags

www.birminghammail.co.uk/black-country/mum-dubbed-selfish-after-friend-25522235?fbclid=IwAR2Jcq8RfUTJMt9NTWajeFyIHwaPo7hex22lKolhjS_3pxJddWbNh_x-7n4

That is crazy

For one, it's not an issue specific to babies or toddler. It's any human (or animal!) that is making a disturbance so that others can enjoy their meal or conversation because of it.

For two, it's normal to consider ourselves special when we have young kids and that if it's normality to us, it should be to others. The thing is, kids grow up and suddenly, they are not the centered of our world anymore, so yes, even when it was tolerable when we too had young children, it's much harder to tolerate when this phase is over for us and we rediscover the joy of getting together with friends and family without having to endure screaming in our ears.