To be livid that year 11 DS thinks 4-5 hours/week homework/revision is enough for GCSEs?

[Hotdaisies22]

DS in year 11. Bright boy but has always been poor at doing homework at home despite being well set up for it at home (quiet desk space etc). Does his homework at homework club after school -Mon - Thurs max 5 hrs week (thats only time homework club room is available at his school). We're having conversations that he now needs to up his game these next few months before GCSEs and start studying /revising at home extra time. Getting massive push back and causing a lot of friction. He thinks what he does is enough and no intention of doing more "at the end of a tiring school day" (he only has a 20 min journey to school). What are other year 11s doing? (I'm trying to have conversation with his school on this but so far they've been rubbish - no reply!)

Wow! 2.5 hours on top of a full school day? That’s insane, and shows very little regard for a young persons well being. If 2.5 hours of additional work is needed to get good marks… how are those marks an accurate reflection of their ability? And at what cost?

I am really shocked reading the amount of work some of you expect your teenagers to put in… it’s GCSEs for goodness sake.

If your child wants to do something academic or competitive then yes gcse results do matter. The message they dont is extremely outdated and unhelpful.

He'll find out how he's doing when he has his mocks. They gave my SD the push she needed to take it more seriously and study more.

I think the number of hours some posters are pushing their dc to work are obscene and unlikely to be good for them.

I think it's going to be a shock for some posters if/ when their DC want to go to uni and they find out the grades required for many competitive courses. Things have changed.

But if they are having to study for 3-4 hrs a night to pass GCSEs to a good level then they are probably not cut out for those courses. The kids I know getting 8/9s across the board definitely didnt need to as they are the naturally clever kids. DS could have got 9s for all exams with a bit of work every night but he chose to do very little and got 7-9s.

For the kids at the other end sometimes scraping maths/English and not passing many others is not a bad thing as doing L2 vocational course at college in something they are passionate about then moving up that way is the best thing. Often with an extremely successful outcome.

People on MN have a bizarre outlook on life in general. Not everyone's aim is to go to Oxbridge, it also isn't always relevant for people's career choices.

If they want to do something competitive and don't put in the work then it's not for them surely! If you have to force them it's pointless.

Things have changed, and you do need good A levels to get into the competitive courses - but my youngest has a girl on her course (Marine Bio) who didn't get the A levels and got in via a Foundation Year. There's also access courses. Some young people mature later than others and for them these alternative routes can work well.

Sure, not everyone's aim is to go to Oxbridge. However even the " lower rung" unis such as LSE, UCL, Durham, Imperial, Kings are asking for very high grades at both GCSE and A levels. It's a lot more competitive than it used to be. When they get there they will meet foreign students who study double the hours the OP mentions and would simply laugh at the idea of 7 to 9 GCSEs being acceptable. They have all 9s or the international equivalent and some have 6 A levels.

If the DC want to do something vocational, fine. Not sure if they can make that choice this early.

All that said, I don't think one can force DC. My DS learnt from watching older DD mess up her A levels- lack of focus- and then be limited in her choice of uni. She regrets it.

Absolutely Dd worked very hard with no prompting from us because she has a goal and is smart. I agree if you have to force a child to revise that path is not right for them anyway.

There are programs in 6th form only for those with a certain gcse grade point average so the “gcse results don’t matter” advice is unhelpful.

Things have changed, and you do need good A levels to get into the competitive courses - but my youngest has a girl on her course (Marine Bio) who didn't get the A levels and got in via a Foundation Year. There's also access courses. Some young people mature later than others and for them these alternative routes can work well.

That's true but it costs money and I'd be very pissed off with my DD if she wasn't willing to put in some work for her (free) GCSEs and A levels and then expected me to pay (£3000 at the 6th form she hopes to go to) for an access course for her to go to Uni.

If a student needs to do the amount of homework and revision some posters are insisting on, these students are on the wrong course and should be looking at a lower level qualification. When do they have time for sport and other hobbies? When are they going out with friends? These schools are going to end up with students totally stressed out and not the well rounded individuals we need. You can’t force someone to revise

Revision is quality and not quantity.

Cmopletely agree.

It is a good thing that fewer posters aim high for their dcs. It reduces the competition for those who do. The academic schools know the drill but others can continue to live in their world where you shouldn't try too hard if you are not naturally clever (or hardworking).

Then you have threads on mn of how to be rich. Well, the easiest way for a lot of people (though not guaranteed of course because personality and luck come into play) is strong academics and a good course in a good university. These are the building blocks but they do require some effort.

Disagree. My DS took his grades in Further Maths (or whatever it is called) from 7 to 9 with quantity. Maths is all about practice anyway IMO. He needed it so he had to. His uni couldnt care less about well rounded individuals. They needed A star A star A at A levels with an A star in FM. He got it. Gave up football in A levels. Thinks it was worth it. Hasnt burnt out.

@Stevie77
Now is the time to help your child explore whether for example they prefer written notes, online resources, videos etc, explaining a concept to you, practicing answers. All of which are valid, but all of which suit different people.
Not everyone likes revision cards for example. Personally, I do need to write and colour things as my mind then pictures the 'shape' and can retrieve the answer but lots of people prefer listening to things (doesn't work for me, I listen to loads of podcasts related to my work but don't necessarily remember the content).
Get them used to spending short times focussed on a task then take a break. Make sure they have a good area to work. Try to encourage them to be organised for themself- drove me mad that my tutee would log on to the zoom without his pen and calculator for example.
Make sure they look back over work and look at where it could be improved- biggest value from tests is often reviewing them, working out where you lost marks etc.

And, maybe, find a tutor who can work with them to instil some skills now and help them understand what works for them. (I'm actually much more about that than content for example)

But you're saying it depends on what the child wants.....

We don't know what OP's DS wants, only what they want given they're paying for his education.

I do understand OP - in fact I completely empathise - its the same here. We have what is basically a lazy teen - he is starting to comprehend how important it is - just a little too late as his mocks have already started. He is capable of much more - he just can't be arsed. He wants to be arsed - but isn't.

I would say - your 'sacrifices' are irrelevant for him - you have simply done what a good parent does - puts their child's wellbeing before everything else. It won't register him - maybe ever - that he should be grateful for this - but certainly not in mid-teendom. So whilst in your mind your efforts should be linked to his attitude - it isn't and won't be. I know its exasperating when you've worked your arse off to get him into a good place - but don't put that on him.

I can't really advise - nagging doesn't work I know that - are there any revisions you can help him with? I'm a maths person so I said to DS that I'm happy to sit down for him for half an hour and go through each topic at a time - so he isn't trying to revise by himself which rarely ends well. or starts well actually. I have also offered to help with German (which I don't speak but I can test him) and History which we could have discussions about which might help facts stick in his brain.

Ours were exams at the end of the three year period. No modules and one piece of coursework. I didn't suggest doing bugger all work, just that I got 10 good grades without studying for 5 hours plus a week every week up until my GCSEs. I did study a lot over the Easter holidays. GCSEs are not difficult, like A levels are, for a bright child who is getting good grades.

Should we emulate China on everything? Their authoritarian government for example? The worker’s rights abuses?

“But they do it in xyz” is not a legitimate reason to do it here. 14 hour school days are shocking.

GCSEs are not difficult, like A levels are, for a bright child who is getting good grades.

But I don't think that applies to the OP's child.

I work in child mental health and I sat listening yesterday to a child telling my co worker that they seriously will consider killing themselves if they don’t do well in their mocks. Yes, exams are important but they are not that important.
This is not the only child I have hard this from.
The fact that OP has made huge sacrifices for private education is a choice they made as a parent and the pressure of that should not be put on their child.
We need to stop placing these huge amounts of pressure on our children, as frustrating as they can be at times, and let them grow.

I made enormous sacrifices to pay for my children's private education. Part way through I realised that for my son it was not working and wasn't worth the mental health issues.

I withdrew him, sent him to a state school, he did the minimum to get through GCSE's then went onto a Btec course he was passionate about. He is currently in his first year at a leading institution for his degree subject but last week seriously considered dropping out as he was offered a contract paying over £2k per month (He turned it down).

I agree there is no point in raising the subject of sacrifices you have made. Though often it is hard to keep mum.