Just Stop Oil's daily protests

[CatsAreAlwaysCute]

Is anyone else concerned about where these daily protests will lead us?

The public are clearly getting more and more irritated by their antics. It's only a matter of time before one of the protestors are seriously injured.

I'm also worried that the government will ban certain types of protest as a result?

@LemonSwan The single most productive thing we can actually do is changes to agriculture to ensure permanent pastures and continuous ground covers.

Doesn't permanent pastures go against the general the general flow that meat and dairy are the arch enemies of sustainability?

Desertification and soil erosion is important but burning fossil fuels is responsible for roughly 3/4 of GHG emissions. We need to stop burning fossil fuels.

Yes your right. It’s the antithesis of current popular belief. Doesn’t make current thinking untrue. We can only react to what we have in this moment and most meat/diary isn’t that sustainable. Doesn’t mean gold standard meat and diary isn’t a huge part of the solution.

It doesn’t matter if there zero or 10x current carbon/ green house gases if we destroy the worlds greatest land cover category twice a year. It’s a huge sink which gets fucked. If you look at maps/ graphs of the worlds heat through the year you will see the spikes. It’s unreal. But the solution is simple. It will give you some hope. They have been working on this and making good progress in cop26 as they do get this is one of the main issues.

Its win win all round as this method reverses desertification, improves soil health, reduces water usage, chemical usage, improves biodiversity, support pollinators, farmer yields. In essence it’s creating a more resilient ecosystem.

Temperature is changing. We can’t stop that now even if we can potentially slow it but the effects won’t be instant. By ensuring our ecosystem is as healthy and resilient as it can be is the best chance we can give to flora and fauna to get through this. We can do that incredibly quickly. Grasslands are so fast to establish and repair.

And sure it’s not perfect; Some flora and fauna won’t make it, but without soil or pollinators no ones making it.

If you have Netflix there’s a documentary called kiss the ground which might run you through an intro about it all.

It’s actually really annoying how the monomania around carbon emissions means that legitimate problems are put on the backburner, so to speak.

I feel this way about urban air pollution to be honest, it’s really something that could be solved with the tools already at hand

Protests should be restricted to certain designated areas and be agreed with the police in advance.

The right of someone to protest is not greater than the right of the majority not to give a shit. If a cause is genuine, engage with people to get their agreement.

Climate protestors are incredibly selfish, not simply through their disruptive actions, but their whole end goal. They want a certain type of future for them and their children. But there's no rational argument for why they think their "right" to this specific type of future in 30 or 100 years is more "correct" than other people wanting the present to not be held to ransom for this future.

The earth will be fine. Climate change may cause the extinction of humanity in the next few thousand years. That's just nature following its course, a dominant species expands by exploiting the resources it has available until, eventually, those resources are no longer available and the species declines. We'll die out, other species will come along and replace us. Humans aren't "special" in that way.

@BerriesOnTop I feel this way about urban air pollution to be honest, it’s really something that could be solved with the tools already at hand

Absolutely, the start-stop technology that turns an engine off and then on again when stationary has been around for well over twenty years, this would cover almost every vehicle on the road today and a blanket requirement would ensure no competitive disadvantage.

40,000 people die each year in the UK from diseases linked to particulate emissions.

If only someone would think to solve the thing that causes constant biosphere collapse stories.

No, not like that. Without curbing consumption, silly.

Pity that's not where the aerosolised death comes from.

I'm sure moving to heavy electric vehicles will solve for this. And this being the car company's bottom line.

@Liebig I assume you've read the actual report not the utter crap spewed out by the Guardian?

This was a study into particulate emissions at the roadside - it compared maximum particulate suspension in the air to the tail pipe particulate emissions of the vehicles. Thanks to environmental legislation tail pipe emission are incredibly low. The particulate emissions included tyre and brake dust but also aggregate dust they are cumulative and disturbed by passing traffic, it was naturally much worse on hot rather than cold days.

As in my post you quote 40,000 people die each year in the UK from diseases linked to particulate emissions. But completely misleading articles like this totally detract from debate and from the science.

If only 🤣

We will get there in the end. Once the soil says no they have no choice so I am not panicked. The only question will be whether nyc, Shanghai and Jakarta will be underwater by then.

Anyway to another day of ignoring the elephant in the room while people argue about the horse and cart.

See everyone in 2070 👋

@Dotjones agree Climate protestors are incredibly selfish, not simply through their disruptive actions, but their whole end goal. They want a certain type of future for them and their children. But there's no rational argument for why they think their "right" to this specific type of future in 30 or 100 years is more "correct" than other people wanting the present to not be held to ransom for this future

absolutely, caught the tail end of a JSO woman on This Morning I think it was being asked about the whole ambulance blocking, typically didn't want to talk about that/never happens and just became very shrieky about 'my children, me me' wouldn't answer re the problems they're causing and refused to answer most questions on the interview as they weren't the 'right ones' she wanted!

The planet will eventually right itself once humans die out. We need to do the honourable thing and go extinct, slow and painful as it may be. Given a few thousand years earth will be flourishing again. It's the only decent thing to do.

Op - most people do not drive to work London, not everyone is affected by road protests

*in London

Not everyone uses the tube; plenty use buses.

Humans won’t die out because of warming. It will be far more likely we die out in the next Ice Age (Google Snowball Earth for fun)

The earth goes through crazy mass extinction events regularly, flourishing again is just an odd way to put it.

The only question will be whether nyc, Shanghai and Jakarta will be underwater by then

You know we have technology to mitigate that, don’t you? The Dutch know all about it 😂

The Dutch are amazing Berries! Your not wrong

It's irrelevant, because as I've pointed out on these forums before time and again, nothing is going to change with human nature as it is and with an obsession on technological gimmicks or focusing on CO2. Climate change activists, for the most part, can't see the forest for the trees; they're like a doctor treating someone bleeding out by transfusing more blood, rather than address the sucking chest wound.

If we care about particulate emissions, we should ban all cruise liners today. Right now. Fuck that industry.

Know what doesn't produce tyre and tailpipe emissions in cities? Street cars and light rail. But no, we have to go with the two tonne of lithium ion powered steel cages to take little Timmy down the road to school. That's green, for both the planet and our bottom line, the automakers say.

I'd be more concerned about microplastics anyway, and, well, good luck getting rid of them. If you think male fertility issues are bad now...

COP(E) 27 is another charade of rich people flying private jets to tell us they really, really, for really reals time definitely need to absolutely do something, soon, about the thing they keep ignoring because the solutions are "dismantle industrial civilisation". They're either too stupid to appreciate this (and they could be, most are lending their ears to economists after all), or they actually know and can't let the mask slip, but will give helpful hints like "you will own nothing and be happy". I'm looking at you, WEF.

The USA will need to spend $400bn. in the next 20 years on coastal defences.

lol, sure, we'll just build walls around everything. Do it in Minecraft all the time. Let's ask the Dutch.

Or, and hear me out, those places will be abandoned. Like Miami and the goobers buying real estate there still.

Interested in what you think the solution is Liebig? Or are you saying it’s too far gone and all in vain.

There isn't one.

Also...

😭 better make the most of it then. To civilisation as we knew it

Though real talk, I'm not saying do nothing. I'm just saying that swallowing greenwashing propaganda and ritually worshipping the altar of technology or human ingenuity is misguided. It got us into this mess, how can it possibly get us out?

Use less, travel less, have fewer kids (population bomb? More like where are all the workers now), and just generally be less consumer focused and less dickish to one another. It's going to become the norm anyway as energy becomes vastly less available and much more expensive, so just consider yourself as getting ahead of the curve for when you have to do this. Like being on Mastodon before the big Twitter rout occurs.

But the other option is just go balls to the wall mental and max out the credit card as is your god given right as Americans consumers and let the politicians and eggheads solve your problems. Only filthy hippies want things like fresh water, uncontaminated soil and food, and clean air to breathe.

What has nature done for us anyway?

I think we have a similar view. I am probably more optimistic than you that human ingenuity can solve this problem; or less ingenuity and more a return to previous wisdom about the natural balance we can find with the earth and it’s ecosystems. I do think we will have to do this quite soon if we wish to continue eating food so holding onto some hope there that ‘needs must’ forces the situation.

Share your pessimism about society getting blind sighted and latching on to certain directions with no thought to the rest of the equation. There’s so much that gets wrapped up in these things. For example is it more sustainable for us to turn the heating off and return to living in furs. Probably. Would that pass the eco cabal ethics committee 🤣 Well no.

I think I am going straight down the middle; a bit of ‘fuck it’ making the most and a bit of use less. I haven’t had an abroad holiday in 4 years. Am I going to Madeira next year - hell yes; and if I can afford to take my little one skiing in Europe at some point over the next decade then I absolutely will with no guilt whatsoever. It’s probably my best childhood memory and I hope I can give him that same opportunity to stand at the top of a mountain and look over the world and it’s beauty and breathe fresh mountain air even if for just a week.

I feel I contribute positively in my day job. I certainly am doing more than someone sitting on a motorway sign with a placard. Do I feel guilty about an occasional holiday when celebs fly transatlantic 20 times a year to extol virtues on us all - not really. Perhaps we should earn points to use like a club card. Useful Action +10, Virtue Speech - 50?

That’s me minus 50 then 🤣

@LemonSwan I'm onboard with all of this.