"How the UK became one of the poorest countries in Europe"

[user1471452428]

www.theatlantic.com/newsletters/archive/2022/10/uk-economy-disaster-degrowth-brexit/671847/

Article in The Atlantic. When people post about declining living standards, they're often shouted down- but I think it's pretty clear that it is real and here to stay.

NZ is quite a useful example here. It was uninhabited until about 1300 AD when seafaring people thought to be of Taiwanese extraction landed, according to DNA. And then Europeans arrived and settled after 1808 you cant really say colonised because there were so few people to displace and those settlers took with them a common law mindset and set to to work hard to make a living.

@TheNosehasit - What on earth do you think our class system is, but a by product of the colonisation of the “English” peoples? We’ve had Romans, Angles, Saxons, Jutes, Vikings and Normans, to name but recent history. And don’t pretend Ireland always had human beings on it - we are told that we all came out of Africa, after all… so everyone is descended from colonisers and has in their turn been colonised.

Which has made NZ the country it is now. Basically Scottish outside of Auckland, hardy and hard working.

Decent political leadership too, over many decades but they have also attracted many of the brightest and the best from the UK too.

As pleased as i am to see friends do well there (inc my dad) its also a crying shame that Consultants, GP's Teachers, AHP's, Engineers that i ve known over the years are now building NZ and not the UK.

And don’t pretend Ireland always had human beings on it

I believe it had aliens since time began.

Woops! My bad.

I've just googled and the native Irish are Homo Erectus and remain so in the eyes of the British.

🤣As advanced as that?🤣 Looks like the “warrior Celts” were not actually the first settlers of Ireland. What did they do to the poor people who got there before them?

Shot them? Hung them?
Fuck knows.
We had a fight over a bull this one time.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/T%C3%A1in_B%C3%B3_C%C3%BAailnge

The fight over the bull lol.

We were simple people.

I don’t know - that sounds like a pretty complicated bull story.🤣.

You don't want to know about the cock and the bull?

Cos we can tell cock and bull stories too!

www.phrases.org.uk/meanings/cock-and-bull-story.html

Basically, she dumped her husband/partner and he bought a bull which was better than hers so they went to war over it, as you do...........

This is a better link to explain the bull lol (the husband left her for some unknown reason).

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Medb

Medb insisted that she be equal in wealth with her husband, and started the Cattle Raid of Cooley when she discovered that Ailill was one powerful stud bull richer than her. She discovered that the only rival to Ailill's bull, Finnbennach, was Donn Cúailnge, owned by Dáire mac Fiachna, a vassal of Conchobar's. She sent messengers to Dáire, offering wealth, land and sexual favours in return for the loan of the bull, and Dáire initially agreed. But when a drunken messenger declared that, if he had not agreed, the bull would have been taken by force, Dáire withdrew his consent, and Medb prepared for war.
An army was raised including contingents from all over Ireland. One was a group of Ulster exiles led by Conchobar's estranged son Cormac Cond Longas and his foster-father Fergus mac Róich, former king of Ulster and one of Medb's lovers. It is reported that it took thirty men to satisfy her, or Fergus once.[17] Medb's relationship with Fergus is alluded to in the early poem Conailla Medb míchuru ("Medb has entered evil contracts") by Luccreth moccu Chiara (c. 600); it asserts that Medb wrongly seduced Fergus into turning against Ulster "because he preferred the buttocks of a woman to his own people".[18]
Because of a divine curse on the Ulstermen, the invasion was opposed only by the teenage Ulster hero Cúchulainn, who held up the army's advance by demanding single combat at fords. Medb and Ailill offered their daughter Findabair in marriage to a series of heroes as payment for fighting Cúchulainn, but all were defeated. Nevertheless, Medb secured the bull. However, after a final battle against Conchobar's assembled army, she was forced to retreat. Donn Cúailnge was brought back to Cruachan, where it fought Ailill's bull, Finnbennach, killing him, but dying of his wounds.
Also, throughout the Táin Bó Cúailnge Medb has several encounters with Cúchulainn in which he kills either her pets or handmaidens and the place in which they were killed is then named after them, which illustrates the importance of landscape throughout the text of the Táin Bó Cúailnge. Examples of this occur when Cúchulainn "slung a stone and killed a pet stoat as it sat on Medb's shoulder by her neck, south of the ford. Hence the name Meithe Togmaill, Stoat Neck"[19] and when he kills Medb's handmaid: "He slung a stone at her from the heights of Cuincu and killed her on the flat place that bears her name, Reid Locha, Locha's Level, in Cualinge".[19] Medb's behaviour further illustrates the importance of the landscape when she goes to great lengths to permanently alter it to show her contempt for Ulster. "She preferred to cross the mountain by leaving a track that would show forever her contempt for Ulster… to make the Pass of the Cualinge Cattle".[20]

You'd need to have been there.

In any case, aside from fighting over stud bulls, the Irish never needed the British. We were well able to look after ourselves, when we evolved from the ape 10 years ago..........

What type of bullshit. Plenty of people work hard. It's the generation we live in it's not our fault if the job sector has changed is it? If its not even an option anymore what do you suggest? Modern technology has cut a lot of jobs also. Even in supermarkets all these self scans and in banks people walking round with an Ipad.

Kendodd
Was watching China Global News last night, so hardly remainer central, they were talking about the UK and none of the experts could see a positive economic future, or, a way to turn this around. A great deal of this outlook was put down to Brexit by all of the experts.

The expert quoted on the China Global News website (Professor Ding Chun) has held the position of Jean Monnet Chair at least twice in the last ten years - which turns out to be an EU-funded teaching post - that's pretty much "remainer central" in my book;

A Jean Monnet Chair is a teaching post with a specialisation in EU Studies. Based on a competitive selection process, the European Commission, through its Education, Audiovisual and Culture Executive Agency (EACEA), awards the Chair to qualified professors who teach a minimum of 90 hours per academic year on topics relevant to European integration. In addition to course development, a Jean Monnet Chair supports research on EU subjects as well as outreach and training activities. Jean Monnet Chairs are funded for a three-year period up to a maximum of €50,000.

So all of the “expertS” referred to by Kendodd were just one expert, then, and China Global News is also funded by the EU?…

So all of the “expertS” referred to by Kendodd were just one expert

Only one expert was quoted with reference to Brexit on the webpage - as far as I can remember.

But Kendodd refers to watching it, not reading it, so I don’t think an isolated quote from the website is what was being referred to?

But Kendodd refers to watching it, not reading it

She exaggerated the number of experts blaming Brexit?

He/she was very specific that all of them put “a great deal of it” down to Brexit and that there was more than one expert.

@Florenz
It's everyone's fault. People blaming the Tories and saying everything will be better under Labour are living in denial. As are those blaming Labour, as are those blaming politicians in general. No-one wants to work hard for a living, no-one wants to work in manufacturing making things that people want. People look at working in finance or the "creative" sector as being higher status than wearing overalls and carrying a lunchbox to work. It's not unique to this country but the class system which still persists here has made things worse

BritishVolt, a company hailed (by Bojo and the tories) as proof Brexit is a great idea is on the verge of administration....it has no money, its management is shite/no experience, no history or expertise in making batteries and hasn't a single order for its imaginary batteries.... oh hasn't even got a production facility...

This is absolutely nothing to do with the work ethic of the british man or woman, which when given good working conditions and decent management, have productivity levels as good as anywhere in Europe.... but we don't give them that do we?

Same with any industry we've ever had, poor management & even worse R&D..... be it cars, motorcycles, bicycles (Raleigh factory now a housing estate) the list is endless :(

People making things, going to work in overalls and lunch box??? are you stuck in the 50's?

Ime the british work bloody hard, look at health workers? on average working 6 days for 5 days pay......

Where i do agree is that this has happened under various Govt's BUT at least none previously were stupid enough to take us out of one of thr worlds wealthiest trading bloc's...

Poor Maggie must be turning in her grave over what the Tories have gone and done