Not forcing my daughter to share her bedroom or stop going out to eat?

[tamarvin]

Right now my sister, her husband, and their three kids (14f, 10m, 5m) are staying with me and my family temporarily while they are waiting on council housing. I have two kids (13f and 11m).

So I have four bedrooms in my house. The first is my own. The second one is my daughters bedroom. The third is my son's bedroom. The last bedroom is the guest room where my sister and her husband are sleeping.

From the first night they were here my son has wanted his 10 year old cousin to sleep in his room. Those two get along very well and enjoy each others company. So we set up my 14 year old niece and my 5 year old nephew in the lounge downstairs. My 5 year old nephew is apparently having a lot of anxiety problem so most of the time he sleeps in the guestroom with his parents.

My niece is unhappy with this arrangement because she feel likes she gets no privacy (downstairs is open plan). To solve this my sister wants me to force my daughter to share her bedroom with my niece. My daughter however is not as close with my niece as the boys are with each other. My daughter and niece have very different personalities. My niece can be loud and intimidating and my daughter on the other hand is very soft spoken. Having so many other people in the house has already been making her feel stressed and overwhelmed. All three boys being younger and energetic can make things feel chaotic. I don't want to force her to give up her only private area to retreat to for peace and quiet.

I told my sister that we can try to add a privacy curtain to a corner of the lounge for her daughter. My sister said that wouldn't help at all because anyone could just barge in. She says that a teenage girl should be able to have access to a lockable room especially in a house full of mostly boys. She doesn't see any issue with the girls sharing even though I told her my concerns. She thinks it would be a good opportunity for them to bond.

Another issue we've run into involved a weekly dinner I do with my kids. So far we've had no issues with regular dinner as we all contribute to the groceries and all the adults take turn cooking. I however would get my takeaway for my kids once a week. I let my them take turns each week to choose what they want. It's a treat at the end of the week that they both look forward too. My sister and her husband have a tight budget so they cannot afford to buy takeaway regularly. While I am a better off financially paying for everyone every week is not feasible as it is already expensive and it would cost double.

I thought that eating takeaway in front of them at home would be cruel though. I've had a little discussion about it with my kids and told them that while my sister and her family are staying with us we would be having our weekly dinner out instead of doing takeaway and eating at home. I thought this was a fair compromise.

My sister did not agree. She says it's obvious that we are going out to eat good food since we leave before dinner and when we come back home we don't eat anything. While my kids won't brag about going out to eat they will answer honestly when my niece or nephews ask where we went. They then end up feeling bad and my sister says they wouldn't feel bad if I just said no to my kids and that it wouldn't hurt my kids to not go out as often. I will also add that on a selfish note I don't want to stop taking them out to eat because its the only time I get to have with just the three of us alone now.

@ZeroFuchsGiven Why make judgements when you do not know the situation? You have no idea if the living room is large enough for the parents to sleep in. Presumably OP does not want furniture moved out. So there may be one sofa that DD is sleeping on and an armchair and TV. It may not be possible physically for two adults to sleep in the living room. It is not possible in my living room without moving furniture out.

I'm sure they are very embarrassed. And there has been nothi g to suggest they are sat on the ads whinging and wining and not trying thete best to find homes,jobs adequate safety.
We don't no why they are homeless.
The op housed them knowing all their story.why?I presume because he knows they are good people,he loves them and they aren't at fault so deserve care and space and time.

And just because they are blessed to have such a dbdoesn't mean they aren't human too.and see how shit this situ is.and yes having a moan at the wrong person.

I am pretty sure the living area in an open plan 4 bed house will be big enough to fit 2 adults.

pmsl

Offer her a tent in the garden.
I wouldn’t have offered to have them stay in the first place tbh - you sound very kind, and they are taking advantage.

What a demanding person she sounds.

She thinks her dd should have a lockable room? Well there’s an easy solution to that - give her the guest bedroom and sister and dh can sleep in lounge with nephew.

Your house is severely overcrowded now and she is responsible for that. She should put up and shut up or fuck off.

Sure enough. You're right. I hadn't scrolled back far enough to find the more bizarre part of the thread!

@ZeroFuchsGiven Unless it is a very expensive house, open plan is usually chosen when building a house as it makes small rooms look okay. I have seen plenty of new homes that are 4 bedroom and pretty small.

so this is where her parents need to step up. The OP has been accommodating enough, if it’s not working then her parents need to make alternative arrangements. If everyone else in the house has rooms then there should be no reason they can’t go to their rooms giving her space. Or, as my XH and I did with his DD, we had a 1 bed flat, when she stayed she could use our room, the niece can use her parents room to change, study and even go to bed early if she wants. Sometimes we’d wake DSD up and move her back into the lounge, other times we’d leave her and sleep in the lounge ourselves. There are plenty of ways her parents can make this better for her without making her cousin give up her room. She needs to understand this is neither her or her cousins fault but beggars can’t be choosers and whether her and her parents like it or not, they are the beggars in this situation and be greatful their family opened their home to them in the first place.

Tell your CF sister to find somewhere else and prioritise your own kids. They have a lot to deal with and taking away your daughter's safe space is not good parenting. Seriously, kick them out.

If all of your maybes were the case I think that is even more reason why OP’s sister should be grateful for his help, and take responsibility by giving up her room for her daughter. I agree that the current situation with her teenager is unacceptable.
What OP has offered may not be the perfect solution but it seems much better than the whole family being crammed into one room in shared accommodation.
That could easily be the sister’s reality if OP had decided not to offer to help because he couldn’t provide separate rooms for them all.

The lockable room sounds bizarre but I do think the girl should have a private space, with door that shuts, even if it means sharing with her younger brother.

And I'm guessing you don't have the first bit of understanding about being a widow with grieving kids. Sister is a CF as she has been given a roof over her families head and whist not ideal, it is clearly better than another option, or they would have taken it.

Fine. Just watch the teenager go off the rails then.

Either way, it’s not ok to expect a 14 year old girl to sleep in an open plan living area for a year.

It's not ideal, no - but compared to bed and breakfast on the council's dime, it's Nirvana, I can promise you!

I agree with others that if the niece's mother is concerned about her DD's privacy, it is up to her and her husband to swap rooms with her.

It sounds as if the relatives were grateful enough to accept the free accommodation and they must have known about the limitations as to space — but perhaps they had nefarious designs on muscling in on their host’s personal space from the beginning!
OP as others have said, this arrangement cannot work unless you are clear about the boundaries asap. Perhaps sit down and write bullet notes about the points on which you will not budge. If they cannot agree then they need to move out.
Beggars can’t be choosers and emergency accommodation provided by the council is often just a single room.
A year is a long time in the lives of your DC — don’t give them cause to feel you put their needs after those of people you have no obligation to support

This, definitely!

And you're being a very kind brother 😊

And yes, going away at Christmas might be good for all of you...

There are two teenagers here, and OP is obligated to meet the needs of his own daughter.
OPs sister and her husband are responsible for the needs of their daughter.

OP is trying to help his sister with that but it can’t be at the expense of his own child.

Two unhappy teenagers don’t cancel each other out.

What exactly do you think would happen to the OP’s teenage daughter if she was forced to give up her only safe space in her own home? OP has already said she is distressed with the five extra people in her house. Honestly, how do you think that would go?

He needs to put his own child’s feelings first.

You keep saying he shouldn’t have offered if he didn’t have a bedroom for her. Do you know what temp accommodation looks like? Most likely all five family members would be sharing one room and bathroom and kitchen facilities with strangers. The OP’s sister obviously thought her brother was the best option, she doesn’t get to complain about it now. The OP has been more than generous.

I am saying the OP should never have offered to put up a family when he can't meet the children's basic needs. It was unrealistic
The OP isn't being unrealistic. They've kindly offered long term accomodation. It just isn't the configuration that the relatives would prefer.

If it's so awful and unrealistic then OP's relatives are welcome to see what they're provided for the council, but it's not going to meet their expectations given how cheeky they're being about their existing offer.

TheClogLady
That's my experience from hearing about similar situations.

It's all nice to say people backing the OP haven't the first clue about being homeless and getting into whataboutery regarding what the sister's family might or might not be eligible for, but all that does is highlight what a lot of posters are saying: having nice accomodation in a relative's home, even if less than ideal, is a damn sight better than what a family of 5 would get from a lot of councils.

The idea OP should let his sister take over his house, reconfigure sleeping arrangements to suit her preferences and should also stop having a nice meal or takeaway with his own DC is mind blowing.

You are being MORE than accommodating, giving them a place to live. I can't believe your sister is complaining about her daughter temporarily in the living, and expecting you to give up time with your kids. Can't she just enjoy the house to herself with her family on the evenings you're gone? Yanbu, op. Your sister needs to realise how much you're already doing for them.

You are being extremely generous.

Do not change your daughter's sleeping arrangements or your regular dinners out.

I think your sister needs a polite but firm reminder that you've offered to help them and are happy to do so, but you are entitled to make the decisions regarding your children and your home. It's up to them whether they accept that help.

Frame it as that they have the living room and spare room for sleeping space. Elder son can stay with yours. They can divide the two rooms as they see fit but your room and your daughter's room are not up for negotiation. I agree with PPs that they should let the girl have some privacy or alternate with her, say weekly.

You and your kids have a weekly routine of getting a takeaway. You've changed that to a meal out so as not to rub it in their DCs faces. This is your time alone with your children. It won't be changing. It isn't your concern whether she does the same with hers.

Let her know you won't be having the same conversations again.

I know it sounds a tough conversation and she's no doubt been through difficulties but I think you need to shut this pushiness down for everyone's sake. No, it might not feel fair to her kids, but you're putting a roof over their heads and presumably treating them kindly. It isn't up to you to either finance treats, or disrupt your own children's lives further.

So they are all staying in your house and presumably paying you nothing for this and while they do that they are telling you what you should do with your children? Tell your sister if she wants privacy for her daughter and for them not to be exposed to seeing people enjoying a meal out then she can take them to live somewhere else.
please don’t make your daughter share a room!
They won’t get a council house in a year. Where will they go then? I’d ask them to leave now and say you’ve made a mistake.
i think it’s really unfair on your children to make them have 5 extra people in their house. I would have found that’s very unsettling at that age. Poor kids.

I went on a home visit to a family with two children on emergency accommodation. . Except they'd been there for ten months, so it had pretty much turned into semi permanent housing.

The accommodation was one room in a manky part of a fairly grim town. The only cooking facility was a single electric ring, and there was a tiny hand basin. The bathroom facilities were shared with other occupants of the similar rooms in the house. That was it for two adults and two children.

So yes, I think the sister needs to get real.

I can't believe you agreed for an extra 5 people to stay at your home for a YEAR. That is not short term! Short term would be a month or so in this situation as you do not have enough room for them. Your sister is being so ungrateful - you have provided a roof over their heads for 4 months and they are complaining. Your poor DC having to deal with all this extra upheaval. You need to tell your sister it is not working out and kick them out. A year is too long and your poor DD is already struggling with this. Put your own DC first. You have housed them for 4 months, you have done more than enough.