Young men who get stuck doing nothing...

[Bunny890]

My younger brother is living at home with my parents and I know several other young men who also get 'stuck' at home - endlessly online, alienate friends, not able to even look for employment or engage with healthcare. I realise that there is a mental health element to this, but I can't help but feel frustrated - Mu

Whoops, posted too soon.

Mum has had to give up her fulfilling career to look after him. He is now becoming violent and we've had to call the police several times. We are a normal family.

How is this happening to be young men? Is it happening to girls too? Any advice?

In Japan there's a phenomenon called "hikikimori" where youngish people, mostly (though not exclusively) men, become shut-ins. They withdraw from society, refusing to leave their houses or often even their bedrooms, and spend all their waking time online, gaming, reading or pursuing some other solo hobby. In most cases they rely entirely on their parents for financial support.

The cause isn't completely understood but one theory is that intense societal and/or parental pressure leaves them feeling so overwhelmed that they "check out" and hide, so full up of shame and anxiety that they just can't face the world.

I don't see why it couldn't happen outside Japan too.

How old is he? What does he do at home? Why does your mom need to look after him?

www.bbc.com/news/magazine-23182523

Just to add, Hikikimori aren't usually violent, so that's a difference. Is the violence substance related at all.

One thing that seems to help hikikimori are "therapists" (in quotes because I'm not sure they're medically trained) who are basically paid to offer extremely low stakes platonic friendship. These people get the hikikimori used to talking again then gradually encourage them to go out.

Thank you @CoalCraft f

Thank you @CoalCraft for the information on hikkimori. I think the therapist/ friend could be really useful. We've tried everything else and he has alienated all his friends

I know so many people whose brothers are basically still children in terms of how they function at home. It seems like a recent thing and I don’t know what it’s about. A lot of them seem to do a crazy amount of gaming but I don’t know if that’s a cause or a symptom.

@Divide123Conker Thank you for the link, really interesting.
@Bunny890 Is your brother NT or ND?

Theres a huge problem with this in Japan with (mostly teens and young men) who socially withdraw and become recluses in their parents homes refusing or unable to work, school and whose whole world is on their computers mainly gaming. They call them Hikikomori.

i know two young men, one in his 30s one in his 20s are home virtually 24/7 with headsets on, gaming. Neither are violent but both suffer with anxiety, depression and one was bullied at school. The 30 year old has finally been helped to move into his own flat and the 20 year olds DM helps hers rent a flat nearby too as it was so stressful seeing him just frittering his life away unable to get him to engage with life /MH care. Both are still in their flats most of the time but one is now agreeing to therapy. I doubt either will ever work. It’s tragic. Has your DM spoken to his GP to ask for advice? i think your Mum, with no doubt the best intentions, is enabling him. It’s so sad she’s given up her career to care for him. What do you think led towards him living this way? Does he suffer with anxiety, depression or any other MH problems? In a way I think setting boundaries is needed to try break the cycle - he is going to need to get help if he’s to keep living at home because this way of living is seriously impacting both his and the family’s life and his violence not acceptable.

Do you think it might be to do with how much they are expected to do in terms of responsibility as children/teenagers? Has your brother ever been expected to do chores around the home (without reward of pocket money) or to look after his own washing, cleaning his own room etc etc? Or has he always been facilitated?

This is interesting, about the hikikomori.

I think it’s a difficult world for a lot of young men to try and launch into. Where’s your brother at in terms of education and qualifications? Any mental health or substance issues?

Has be fallen down any youtube rabbit holes? You men are very prone to be taken in by Andrew Tate types and digest a lot of dangerous information leading them to become extremely angry and disenfranchised from life.

can be prevented but not so easily cured
it’s a parental failure and once it’s at this point it’s kick out or take responsibility and care for then until you die

Lots of posts linking to Hikkikomori while I was typing my message. From the documentaries I’ve seen these young men aren’t violent but exceptionally withdrawn, not even joining their parents for meals. Just gaming and on their computers nonstop. The young man I know in his 30s is virtually nocturnal - gaming all night and in bed most of the day. His sleep is totally messed up. He is so bright, incredibly kind and thoughtful, but finds the world outside too much. He has bad anxiety. It’s very sad.

Andrew Tate and the ilk do not encourage our condone this behaviour

more likely to be NEETism coupled with nihilism

I literally have only ever come across one person like this in my entire life

How old is he? It's not that unusual for someone in their twenties to be in his position. The days of someone being able to get a steady job after leaving education and rent a home (even in a houseshare) are long gone for many. RoseslnTheHospital (Nothing really makes me happy) has a good point, what was his upbringing like? The fact he's your younger brother makes it more likely he grew up being seen as less mature and responsible than his sibling(s), which might feel normal to you in a position of power (being older brings power), and he is simply playing the role which he has been groomed to fill throughout his live - being inferior, needing support.

In essence, he was never thought of as being as good as his older sibling, and he's duly obliging.

Wow @Dotjones !
When were those halycon days cos they never reached the NE and most people.managed not to beat up their mothers!!

I think this is a really interesting question. What do you think has happened in your brother's case, OP? Did your parents treat you differently?

I don't know anyone that extreme, but I do know men, now in their late 30s, who are still living a very sheltered, childish sort of life - they can just about hold down jobs and live independently, but other than that, they're crap at self care, they can't sustain healthy relationships, they eat terribly, they can't seem to maintain nourishing friendships, they game a lot. Life seems to be passing them by, and these are people who were given very expensive private school educations, got good degrees, bright people in general. As far as my experience goes, the ones who have ended up like this are men. I don't know any women in a similar position.

I'm a gamer and have come across quite a lot of young men who have had to contribute so very little to their upkeep, it just facilitates them to be lazy and unrealistic about what is involved in life. I'm sure its not just a 'men' problem tbh but the hobbies may differ.

However I also know people who are like this because of MH issues, with becoming insular being a side effect. I think at the end of the day its quite a comforting way to live if the interactions of the real world are too much.

I know quite a lot women around my age (30s) whove done well but there brothers seem to have stagnated/sunk.

I'm not really sure why...gaming, porn, ineffectual father figures, do boys need to learn/launch in a different way and feel they aren't getting that?

A lot of boys opting out but then perhaps that's understandable given rising costs of living etc and I know in a different way many girls opt out too.

It is definitely harder to find affordable renting places, and if you haven't got the right skills then finding a job may well be hard these days. Certainly there are not the hoards of unskilled labour type jobs that many young men might have expected to be able to gain without too much effort in the past. But this young man doesn't sound like he'd be interested in a hard labouring type job even if they were easily available.

There is a focus on academic students, average ability and upwards heading off to post 18 study with a view to accessing work after that. What happens to those who don't want to access post 18 (or even post 16) education is not so clear and straightforward. It can be seen by schools and families as a failure, a lesser option.

It's a mix of things that cause it and its far more likely to be men than women who go down this route. Sometimes they may have undiagnosed social disabilities but can also be neurotypical.

Agree Andrew Tate and the like don't really feed into this as although they are disgusting misogynists, they also encourage men to be strong. In fact, many young men in this boat have found that the writings of Jordan Peterson have got then out of these insular, NEET ruts. He is not someone I am a fan of at all but he is way better than the likes of Andrew Tate and he has a way of encouraging young men to be self reliant and better themselves. Hopefully, once he is out and about a bit more, he could then find his own way.

I suppose another layer to the question, is what about the ones who’s parents aren’t able to support them? It definitely seems like there is a layer of parental enablement to the point of encouragement with many of these men. And it almost always seems to be men…