Tories are NOT on the side of women

[RoomOfRequirement]

I know the defence of Tories here often is 'at least they know what a woman is' - and they do.

But they use that knowledge of what a woman is to make our lives worse. Over 100 Tory MPs voted against a buffer zone on abortion clinics. They know we're adult human females, who can get pregnant, and they vote to allow us to be harassed because of that.

I'm also GC, and do not believe you can change sex. Gender - sure, I don't care how anyone wants to present or what they want to be called and am happy to oblige - but some things are separated on the basis of sex and should remain that way regardless of presentation.

That said, Tories are not on the side of women, and you need to he aware of that before voting for them based on this 1 issue.

I do not understand the GC argument at all, because everything they hate e.g. men in womens prisons, is happening under TORY RULE.

I totally agree with you about the Tory rule, but this does tend to hint that you don't mind the idea of men in women's prisons in which case I strongly disagree with you there.

Thats quite a leap your made there, are your ankles ok?

I just hope that all women who will vote labour will make their feelings known about Self ID rather than just put up with it 'because it's better than Tory.'

People have mentioned poverty being worse under the Tory government than under Labour. AFAIK is Labour came into power they can't reverse the economic mess that we are in over night. What will be worse when woman becomes meaningless is there will be no statistics that are meaningful on the impact of policies on women. Because women will be a gender identity not a sex. If we can't demonstrate the harm done to women as a sex class because there are no statistics we can't fight for provisions specifically for women. We know that women do the bulk of the unpaid care work in the country. I can't imagine that those who identify as women are the same demographic, so all of a sudden women are not as poor as before & don't need as many resources.

Same for health care.

I'm not a Tory voter but I'm damned if the meaning of women is changed to the benefit of men without a fight. The Labour Party don't WANT women to fight, they will be asked to leave the membership and worse than that it's even potentially a hate crime.

I understand why women want to vote Labour but I can't understand why any woman would take this lying down. It's too important.

THIS THIS THIS.

You don't just have to roll over - you can vote labour and still campaign to your local MP etc that you are against self ID, and for single sex spaces.

That's like letting the wolf through the door and then begging him not to eat you.
Labour need to speak up now. Say they recognise biological sex is real and that they actively support women's sex based rights. Actual women. If they won't do that now, then there's not a chance in hell that they'll so that after they're in power. Things might be really shit now. But there's always room to go further with that.

Thats quite a leap your made there, are your ankles ok?

My, aren't you witty!

Do you think that men should be in women's prisons?

Broadly. no.

A fully transitioned trans woman? Yes.

I know Braverman was way out of line but I do think the word " wokerati" resonates with many as, quite rightly, most people see sex as a biological fact and don't have patience for the hand wringing around biological fact.

That's like letting the wolf through the door and then begging him not to eat you.
Labour need to speak up now. Say they recognise biological sex is real and that they actively support women's sex based rights. Actual women. If they won't do that now, then there's not a chance in hell that they'll so that after they're in power. Things might be really shit now. But there's always room to go further with that.

I agree which is why I cannot vote Labour in spite of the fact I have previously held a membership.

My post was really an appeal to those who are going to vote Labour regardless.

What do you mean by "fully transitioned"?

A transwoman who has had hormone replacement therapy and sex reassignment surgery.

Not a pervert who decides to wear a nighty and call himself Diane while he wanks in the bushes outside a train station.

If SDP were a viable option I would vote for them.

But they are not.

Full top and bottom, you mean?

Sorry, I don't mean to sound interrogative. But it's impossible to know what people mean these days.

Thoughtful feedback indeed.

If it boils down to a choice of labour and Tory, and voting for other parties strengthens labours chance of getting in, then I will have no choice but to vote Tory in order to keep labour out.

I understand why women want to vote Labour but I can't understand why any woman would take this lying down. It's too important.

But who is saying that is happening. They are lobbying their local MPs they are trying to force change.
You can view that the country as a whole will be better off without a Tory government steering it and believing a labour government would do better and still believe that we need to keep challenging and pushing for womens right, to not only remain, but to be improved.

The argument that does not stack up is the pitting of labour vs Tory with regards to womens rights.

I don't see people saying don't vote labour, vote green (for example) because ............

If all viable parties are not protecting women rights then what is the answer come GE time. I know when it comes to a GE I will be looking at who's at the helm, manifestos and previous performance.

If it boils down to a choice of labour and Tory, and voting for other parties strengthens labours chance of getting in, then I will have no choice but to vote Tory in order to keep labour out

That is not a surprise. But each to their own, but don't do it under the guise of doing it for woman's rights as it BS that the Tories represent that. Under their government men are getting into our jails, men are getting into our spaces and men are invading our rights. Tories are allowing this to happen.

Thoughtful feedback indeed.

It wasn't meant to be, I was simply highlighting it wasn't answering the question.

It was answering the question. Just not to your liking. There isn't any credible parties that are likely to get in. If the SDP had a chance I would vote for them. I agree mainly with their values. If it becomes a toss up between labour and Tory, it will have to be Tory to keep labour out.

What about you? Who will you be voting for? Labour?

It was answering the question. Just not to your liking

No I asked who you would vote for if there was a GE, you answered with someone who was not even an option, I merely pointed that out.

What about you? Who will you be voting for? Labour?

If it was a GE tomorrow yes I would vote labour.
I am disgusted and angry at the way the Tories have treated "their" public of late. I am disgusted at aspects of the way they handled covid, I am disgusted at their responses to people struggling during this crisis, I am disgusted and embarrassed at how they have conducted themselves with the swapping of leaders and how unstable the party is, I am disgusted that they are still allowing men in our spaces, men in our jails and the disregard for women they show. The disregard they show for joe public, they have been vile.
They may not have changed any laws on paper, but they are showing us they have no intention of protecting us, they have had long enough to do so. So they have had their crack of the whip and failed....massively !!!! Time to ship out now before they are allowed to further destroy this country.

In 2 years time, I will review everyone's position and stance. I'm not a staunt voter of either. I see who I think will perform best for our country as a whole, inclusive of everyone, regardless of which party that is.

Yet despite all that, labour are still far worse. They're not going to make any economic difference. Debts need to be paid whoever is in power. If things seem bad now, and they are bad, it can get far far worse. Especially as labour don't even recognise over half the population. And the impact of that would be appalling.

It pretty much shows there will always be a fight between the two big parties. Voting for anything else is pointless sadly, it will just split the vote and make it pretty much meaningless. Both parties will do whatever it takes to get in. Personally I'd like them both to fuck off and stay fucked off.

In the meantime, welcome to a lot more shit. Forever.

Crazy sort of nonsense believing that a party isn’t on the side of women because of legislation about abortion clinics. Maybe they’re on the side of unborn children? Or maybe just on the side of public freedom? As the Tories have had three women as leaders and Labour have had none then I would’ve thought they are more on the side of women than the other party

None of those 3 female leaders (does the last even count?) we in any way feminists. And tories have had much longer in power, therefore more opportunities to change leaders and choose women.

Tories make women poorer faster than men, that's for certain.

Nope, she is saying that you need to understand the reasoning behind MP votes rather than painting them with a suitable assumption and framing that as fact.

Some of the MPs who voted against buffer zones have also voted against restrictions on abortion and reproductive rights and also voted against Patel's restrictions on protest.

Others are just serial opponents of reproductive rights - those MPs exist in all the main parties.

Ironically, the libertarian free speech fundamentalists have voted more consistently on that "fringe" issue which encompasses the legislative protections for 51% of the population plus minors than many of the supposedly progressive supporters of abortion rights.

Funny that when women's rights fit neatly with men's convenience to have a shag with relative impunity they are supported but when they get in the way of men they are a problem.

But Labour didn't create this massive financial shit show? The tory party did. Every one of their decisions and policies created it. And as per the mini budget and planned spending cuts, we can see they dont plan on getting large fat cats to help repay the bill, they want the poor to. Do you really think Labour can be worse than that?

YANBU but the ignorant on here won’t have it