To not want my 80 year old mother to speak to me at 50 as if I am still a child

[Bretonbear]

My mother and I have never been particularly close but recently it has become a lot worse.

The thing I'm noticing more than anything is that now with her daughter as a 50 year old woman with her own children, she still texts me and speaks to me as if I am still her small child who she can control.

She texts me to say that however upset I am she is 'twice as upset'. She says that I need to let things go. She says she is disappointed in me. She says she is sorry for the things I THINK she did wrong.

Is this normal? Should she still talk to me like this? Why does she never accept blame? Why is she 'twice' as upset? What does that even mean?

I am so confused about all this and just want to know if at 50 my mother should be talking to me like this.

I was always belittled, mocked, sidelined; friends were not welcome, achievements were never celebrated

That rings bells with me - though I think my DP were very damaged by their own upbringing - in very difficult families.

Totally agree with you. Growing up in a abusive household with DV, I had no choice but to endure my mother's physical and psychological abuse; because I was a child. As I grew older, and had my own child, I realised just how bad my childhood had been, and how not normal it was.

Now my mother is older, she has not changed at all. No acknowledgement of her treatment of us. Still the same bitter, spiteful woman. I'm no longer in contact with her. Her old age does not give her a free pass. I do not have to put up with it.

What absolute, gaslighting, bollocks. I detest this 'miss her when she's gone' crap. I won't miss mine, at all.

I used to find the sentence 'I don't care' very useful with my mother, any time she expressed an opinion about me.

You star, well done. Thank you for writing this out. Solidarity to you too.It’s incredibly hard to get where you are. I’m just about there.

I think most of the mental battle is getting to a point you don't care or trying to stay in that mental space.

Not caring you can see humor or just ignore and do what you want anyway.

I saw a film recently - Everything Everywhere All At Once - and there's a scene where the mother clearly wants to say to her daughter I love you - what come out is your getting fat and need to eat better.

I think DH and I sometime have that happen though we catch each other or ourselves doing it - and now wonder if it happens to our parents

I do wonder for us how much is stopping ingrained/learnt behavior tumbling down the generations - for some families I think that does mean NC for others it's not as clear cut.

I fear that those commenting along the lines of "get over it" and "you're her kid" are going to be (or already are) nightmare parents themselves who prioritise dominating their children and can't relate to them as adults.
Solidarity, Bretonbear. Those of us who have to deal with cranky, miserable, domineering, bloody-minded elders know how maddening it is to be told "But she's your mother!" or "Cherish her; you'll miss her when she's gone" by people who clearly have no idea what it's like.

Completely agree @CoalTit , I imagine if those posters saying these things in response to a thread like this will be exactly like the toxic mothers described.

They can't see it but I guarantee their children will.

No coaltit they havent a clue. She told my sister a duty to the elderly. Respect is 2 way. After being humiliated at family events Im lowish contact now. Works well. 80 yr olds can be selfish

I wish Mumsnet had the equivalent of a swear box for every time "toxic" is used inappropriately.

What do you mean? Are you implying that our mothers are not toxic?

It looks as if CovertImage isn't going to reply.
I avoid referring to people as toxic, because it's a bit too general to be useful to describe an individual, but I talk about toxic relationships a lot. I. I'm very interested in how people end up behaving the way we're discussing, and keen to avoid ending up that way myself if I get to my eighties.
I use "bloody-minded", but people often confuse it with "single-minded", which impedes communication. Very frustrating. Domineering is another useful term.

I'm 41 and my parents still tell me off like I'm a child.

My Mother died in 2015. I became her carer, so unfortunately shopped with her. All my life I'd had "it's only one day" "why bother" and worse around Christmas, which I loved as an adult, because Christmas was about drunken fights as a child. I don't miss her or her behaviour. I challenged her because was I fuck going to cherish her, children should be cherished, not abusive adults. My sister tried to pull the "missing nanny" shit on my adult children, one Christmas. They pointed out that the difference was we could enjoy the day without ridicule for the effort, critism about everything and constant sarcasm and arrogance. I added that she was like a Spectre in the room, wanting to bring the day down. Like the OP it took until I was around 40 to realise how bad my childhood was. Don't tell the adult children, or worse actual children, of abusive, toxic, narcissistic etc parents that we'll miss them. It is gaslighting and minimising child abuse.
At 80, if you have to mix, then ignore what you can and challenge what you can't. The only bit that I partly agree with is not expecting better. You've got to come to terms with not having the mother that you deserved or needed. Better to do that while they are still alive. My Dad dying when I was 16 was a relief.

Should have added that sister had to agree when given examples and now doesn't verbalise to us when she looks back with rose tinted glasses.

Sympathies Ponoka its awful. My sister churns out crap of oh u know how she is. I had to take a step back I was drained from it all. Elderly can b v selfish.

My MIL is like this. She told us we weren't 'allowed' to have any more kids after DD, kicked off when we announced baby 2, kicked off when we announced we'd set a date for our wedding, kicked off when we put in an offer on our house because she hadn't viewed it yet, went mad at me and said we'd 'have words' because I got a tattoo (I was 26 at the time!!) etc etc... She does my head in 🙄

Can't wait to announce baby 3 one day 🤣🤣

If your mum is like this (my mum) are you expected to be their carer as they get older? I dread that day for years as I am the sibling that lives closer!

You can’t change how she behaves but you can change how you react. My parents were like this and the term FOG - fear obligation guilt freed me from being unable to speak up. I said to them “No, I am an adult and I will not be spoken to like that by anyone, especially someone who also says they love me.” There was a huge fallout but it was respect me or we go no contact. Sadly they could not respect me so I went no contact.

To be honest, I'm not sure why anyone asks advice on anything. "Get over it" covers all possible scenarios, OP, why are you wasting time posting?

#sarcasm

My mum is going through a similar thing to you (similar ages, slightly older than you). She’s confided in me about it as it’s ground her into the floor because of my grandma leaning on her more because of an illness and treating her poorly.

My advice to you is the same. Set firm boundaries. Firm sentiments like you speak to me like that, if you tell me what to do, I will hang up the phone and we can talk when you are ready to have a pleasant conversation. I am not going to listen to you . Let’s talk tomorrow. If they’re sulking, let them. Quickly they get the message. If their behaviour isn’t rewarded with an emotional response or a constant ear the source is cut off. If phone calls and visits are too draining either scale them back or have ‘something to get back to’ - washing needs to be taken out, someone’s at the door etc. I don’t think people realise how absolutely draining this can be. I love my grandma with all my heart and she treats me so different from my mum, but I also love my mum and I know their relationship is just not healthy. We’re talking about my grandma saying she can’t cope if my mum goes on holiday despite all of us being there for her. It’s built on guilt and emotional manipulation and since my mum has set boundaries and time frames she has seemed so much happier in herself.

It’s a work in progress and my mum still gets frustrated and still gets it bad sometimes but since she started placing value on her own feelings and time it has been so good for my mum. Wish you all the best x

My elderly DM has always been incredibly self-obsessed and the older she gets the more pronounced this becomes. Conversations with her are literally sitting and listening to her telling us all about herself, what she has done and who she has seen.

Interactions are all about her, she has zero empathy and she has got to the point over the last few years where she has started making up events and stories (all about herself) which are frankly bizarre.

I have total sympathy @Bretonbear - it’s a horrible relationship to be in and will not get any easier as she carries on aging and becoming an even more extreme and selfish version of herself…

She does it because you take it. I don't allow anyone to talk down to me no matter who they are (or whether we share DNA).

I moved out at 17 and clearly told my parents somewhere in my mid 20s that while I was their child, I was not a child and would not be spoken to like I was. I'm a grown woman with 2 degrees, a home, a husband, children, have lived in 3 countries and if they couldn't speak to me with respect then don't speak to me at all. Thry managed to figure that out very quickly.

She sounds narcissistic, she won’t change, unless it’s to get worse. The only thing you can change is how you yourself deal with it

You are not unreasonable. She sounds toxic. And has been for all of your life. Ignore all the stupid you'll miss her when she's gone type comments. You won't, why would you?

Walk away if you can, if not try your best to ignore. It's not you, it's her. Some mothers are toxic. It's sad, especially for you, but it's not your fault. Just do better yourself