To think sending your child to nursery, ill is selfish

[Anon778833]

If my toddler is ill, I do not send her into nursery - it’s as simple as that. If I have to not go into work, that’s just how it is.

There has been an outbreak of slapped cheek at my daughter’s nursery which she caught and now I also have caught too. And it’s a really horrible virus. My poor dd hasn’t eaten for nearly a week. And she is STILL spiking temperature.

Nursery sent out a message to say that thanks to people bringing ill children to nursery, they now have staff shortages. And that people must not bring ill kids to nursery.

I thought this was common sense.

Besides the selfishness of it all, it is beyond me how a parent can send their sick child anywhere. I'd want to look after them myself and make sure they're as comfortable as possible.

Illnesses do take time to manifest though, so kids will catch illnesses at nursery even with the best of intentions.

Well it probably won’t surprise you but nursery staff don’t get sick pay either so when we catch something from your sick child we have to take time of unpaid. Not great for us either especially as we are on shit pay already and can not afford it. Oh and when the calpol wears of you will get a call to collect your sick child anyway and any sickness normally means they are not allowed in for 48 hours after so parents really don’t gain anything by still sending them in.

@TescoCustomerService you are disgusting.

Well said.

Not really, when a poster on this thread had this happen to her, 😔

My nursery doesn't actually try to send children home for every illness. If children get a slight temperature at nursery they tend to give it an hour or so to see if it comes down (unless they're presenting as very unwell). Their policy on (e.g.) hand foot and mouth is to send them in if they seem well enough in line with NHS advice. So when my DS had hand foot and mouth I kept him off for 4 days as he was uncomfortable and under the weather and then sent him in even though the spots hadn't completely healed. If I had kept him off until the last spot had disappeared I would have had to take three weeks off and then another two weeks when he got it again despite him being his normal self after the first week or so. He probably was somewhat infectious but then hand foot and mouth is infectious before symptoms appear in any case and most toddlers will get it at some point.

I keep DS off when I think he's unwell enough that he wouldn't enjoy nursery or for D&V etc. and probably took 15 days off for him in his first year at nursery but I don't keep him at home for every cold or minor illness. He has a seemingly perpetual cold from September through to April and I don't think that's uncommon.

In regards to covid I doubt many parents of nursery age children now know whether or not they have it because in my experience very few are now testing their toddlers. Covid usually presents as a cold for this age group (if it has symptoms at all) so I've no idea if I've sent my DS in with it recently. I suspect a few of the children at DS's nursery have covid at any one time.

Obviously she isn't talking about their opening hours. She's talking about the discounted, additional partly funded extra 15 hours to make it up to 30 hours that is means tested.

Their policies will state this.

Oh and everyone gets the 15 hours, that's universal. So OP, one would think, know this because anybody with internet access can discover it in 10 seconds. HTH.

Loads of parents mask their children's fevers by dosing them with Calpol before drop off. So even if nursery staff were to take temperatures at the door (which we did when Covid first hit) the child would appear well. It's only when the effects of Calpol wear off that you realise the child is ill.
Obviously yoou then call the parents but usually too late by then, they've already infected children and staff.

I really don’t understand the comments where people are saying, ‘well we have to work to keep a roof over our heads’ or ‘I can’t just take days off work for X reason.’ Well sorry, if your child is ill why do you think it’s okay to take them to nursery/school and possibly spread it to other people.

Not just that, but so many kids with fevers and other illnesses (not just a common cold), need actual rest and time to recover. If your job doesn’t accommodate that then unfortunately that’s not the nursery or schools fault…

We just had an outbreak that saw several members of staff off. If it hadn't been that so many children were also off we would have had to close a room. Despite asking parents to keep children off until they were not showing a temperature they would be sent home and be back still obviously unwell the next day.

Ultimately it means more parents have to take time off work because more children become unwell. If too many staff catch it the option of us opening might not even be there so parents would have to be off or find alternate care. All because parents won't keep them home til they are through the infectious phase.

We are there to educate not provide a nursing service for unwell children. Our ratio means the children can't have one to one care. A nursery is noisy and busy and not where sick children want to be. We will call for children to go home but by that time their friends have been infected too.

What a silly thing to say! Of course your child is your responsibility. The harsh reality is thought that for parents that work, when a child is ill, it can put you in a very difficult position. Kids get sick alot...especially at nursery age. Employers cannot always be understanding. That will be why some kids are at nursery when you think they should be at home.

You’re right, OP, it’s wrong and ultimately the knock on effect affects everyone. However your lack of empathy with those who are working zero hour contracts, working for minimum wage paid by the hour rather than a salary, who have multiple children and are off so regularly it becomes problematic regardless of the job, of those in jobs where others are reliant on them turning up ( anything with a waiting list in the NHS..). Are single parenting with no support etc etc etc is problematic. Not everyone feels able to just stay home.

What do you mean lack of empathy? What do you suggest is a solution? Nursery provisions aren’t designed to be a drop off sick bay for children with high temperatures and vomiting bugs. And people trying to argue that it’s ok to do that should be ashamed of themselves. I am paid by the hour myself and if I have to take time off I lose commission.

Those of us who work at nurseries are also working NMW paid by the hour, and the grand majority of my colleagues have multiple children. And due to ratios etc there is also a huge huge amount of pressure on us not to take sick days for our children.

And more to the point it isn’t part of our job to care for sick children.

This is why it bugs me on mumsnet when I see threads innocently asking why it’s so hard for nurseries to get staff. You’re paid more to work at Tesco and don’t need to contend with the attitude of total entitlement that it’s your job to care for other people’s sick children at risk to your own health.

It’s sometimes hard to make a judgement call.
I’ve kept my 3yo home today as she is snotty and was coughing in the night. She’s absolutely fine in herself though and is running about, dancing and singing. She probably would have been fine to go in today and tbh if it was a day I worked I would have sent her in, and to the childminder later.

where is the line? All common illnesses are contagious and are part and parcel of life. It’s unfortunate that some people are more susceptible to complications (myself included) but we can’t lockdown for every sniffle

Thing is, if they are shielded from catching anything at nursery, they will only catch bugs when they HAVE to mix with others at school age. We can't keep everyone apart forever. That would only weaken everyones immune systems. I'd rather they get the bugs out of the way earlier on than when they are missing out on their formal school education.

@Tumbleweed101

We are there to educate not provide a nursing service for unwell children.

Absolutely this! Well said!

Depends. If it’s a cold and the child feels ok, I’d send them in. Slapped cheek, chicken pox any thing like that no I wouldn’t… we can’t all afford to take time off every time kids have a coke or sniffle… I would never work!

This is it.

There are of course always a very small number of parents deliberately sending in sick children, hoping the morning's calpol will tide them over, hoping they'll perk up, hoping they won't actually vomit again even though they've definitely not had their 48 hours so will still be sharing germs either way - and perhaps also knowing that if they can just get through til lunchtime before the nursery calls, the logistics of keeping their child at home for the rest of the day will be easier.
In some cases it'll be absolute financial desperation, in many cases it'll be insecurity re employment, and presumably yes in some cases it'll be fucked up parents.

But in most cases it's not about breaking the rules, it's about what happens in the grey area. Whether to send a snotty tired child in or not. Whether it's just a cold or not. I've kept a child at home before assuming she'd mostly nap on the sofa while I worked as she seemed so exhausted and groggy, but actually by 9am she was right as rain and would have had a great day at school. They bounce back very quickly and they become unwell from nowhere very quickly. Pre-rash slapped cheek is absolutely in this category - it might present as a nasty fever or a mild cold, and they're contagious (with occasionally tragic consequences) either way.

The fact that the nursery are sending letters home is 'proof' of very little. Institutional childcare is unfortunately a recipe for germ-sharing even if everyone did religiously keep their child at home at the first sign of a fever and for 48 hours after D&V.

Working parenthood can be very precarious. The overwhelming majority are trying their best.

My child's primary school seems to be having an attendance drive and there's a sign outside listing the things you should keep them off with and the things you don't need to keep them off with. Slapped cheek is on the list of things you should send them in with - I was pretty shocked by that!

I'd say the nursery are sending an inflammatory message out to their customers because how can they possibly know that this was caused by parents sending in sick children knowingly. Slapped cheek along with many other childhood diseases are contagious before symptoms appear and many children won't present with obvious symptoms. I would be concerned about my child attending a setting creating this kind of antagonism between People. Temperature and vomiting keep children home. Snot and coughing goes on for months with many children, if this offends some parents then I think sending your child to a group setting isn't for you and it's up to you to decide what level of risk you're willing to take.

I used to gauge whether my child was well enough for nursery by their behaviour. So if they had a cough or cold but were still eating, smiling, playing then they went. If they were not eating and constantly wanted held I wouldn't send them because nursery wouldn't be able to meet their needs. It would mean I would take one day off with them and dh the other (I worked part time). It's a lot harder if you work full time, are a single mum, in a low paid job. My dh's work policy is great when it comes to dependents leave and kids being ill, mine is atrocious. I am expected to go to work in a pharmacy even if I test positive for covid unless I am very ill.