Are people that want zero immigration racist?

[equalstime]

People that moan about migrants coming to this county - taking our jobs - taking our houses - draining the medical system - not settling in the first country they reach for asylum- they're racist right?

There will always be an element of migration and when you take account of UK born people that leave and non Uk people that enter our country, the net figure is no doubt reasonable. They are often willing to work and contribute to our society and economy - so why the hostility?

Why not accept as a country that we have en element of migration and embrace that, if not because your views are racist?

When you came on your student visa you would have known it was for a limited time. I imagine most international students plan to take their qualifications home and use them to find work there.

Your residency is because your husband is a UK citizen. Likewise he could move as a spouse to your country if you wished. It sounds as if you're suggesting every foreign graduate should have the right to remain here?

Also don’t want anymore of our disappearing green space turned into bloody flats! They are constantly building horrible tall tower blocks to accommodate the ever growing population and it just makes the whole place look like concrete city and very depressing. Not that their building anymore schools hospitals etc to accommodate all these extra people.

@Seymour5 I stated that I was on a Youth Mobility Scheme visa, which is not a Student Visa (I had been on this prior to the YMS). But surely I'm not the only person who was living abroad when my personal situation changed?

I'm not saying that every foreign graduate should have the right to remain. I'm saying that the monetary threshold for Spousal visas is too high, and that people should be able to come in on work visas for "less skilled" professions than doctors. The fact that there is a teacher shortage and teachers are not deemed as "skilled" is ridiculous.

You don’t have to be racist to want zero immigration, but it helps.

Based purely on the title of your thread OP, no, I don't think people who want zero immigration are racist as their idea of zero immigration isn't based on race.

Presumably they want no immigrants irrespective of their race and where they come from.

This. It's not racist to not want that. I would like a system like Australia's. That's how I feel it would work better for the country.

When people cite overpopulation, services at breaking point etc. do those people call for population control? If not, I suspect racism.

You can be concerned about immigration without being racist. There are massive costs to mass immigration. Fiscally and socially. My DH is from an immigrant family, my Sil is from south east Asia. Im not a proponent of zero immigration. But, I’m worried about the level of immigration. When I look at my street the majority of people living on it have arrived in the UK in the last five years. There is no integration and massive cultural differences.

At my kids nursery there are only five families out of a whole year they were second generation immigrants and we were the only English family. The rest were recently arrived families with little or no english. The nursery we’re spending so much time trying to communicate with the families and offering drop in support sessions, benefit clinics, holiday support and food parcels. All these people were accessing NHS services, housing benefit, child benefit, childcare for 2 year olds while not working. They have not paid into the system. I’m sure their husbands cash in hand building companies and the scrap collections we have growing in front gardens are not taxable assets. Before anyone asks - yes I know what they do as they collect filthy scrap and pile it up and have work vans full of building stuff. People get fed up when they see the system being played.
Maybe of you live in a affluent area mass immigration might seem like a good thing. But if you live in a crappy area with loads of social housing it does feel like a piss take. I’m told there’s no money for my kids to have support for their autism after paying tax since I was 18 but a person just arrived gets housing, health care, extra childcare hours…

Not read the whole thread but a big part of it IMO is cultural differences.

Muslims, for instance, have a higher birth rate than white British so this feeds into the rhetoric that they're 'taking over'/'using up all the resources', which is a bit of an exaggeration given that they're still a minority of the population. However, a lot of people seem to have an issue that in quite a few of our major urban areas caucasians are now the minority of under 20s.

Other elements publicised by the media don't really help, like the surveys which found that 50% of Muslims think homosexuality should be an imprisonable crime and the large scale sexual assaults by perpetrators who 'had dark skin and northern African appearance' or 'spoke broken English'.

I think one of the big catalysts in recent years was the 2016 NYE assaults in Germany. 1200 women being sexually assaulted/raped in one night, by men who were largely immigrants, is going to be like a red rag to a bull for the xenophobic and many other people who may have been on the fence.

There have been 3.9 million registrations for GP services since 2017 by people recently arrived in the UK. The majority of these registrations have been in the South East. We have lost 1500 GP’s since then. People saying that immigration has no impact on access to health care are delusional.

I don't think that screaming a knee jerk 'racism' or even 'xenophobia' helps us have the right conversation as a society. It shuts down everyone except those who claim to hold the moral high ground.

Free speech and open debate are really important. So I see those as using black and white, accusatory one- word terms as more dangerous to our society than those they are accusing.

In the UK the "replacement rate" for the workforce is 150,000 workers per year. That's the difference between the number of people retiring and the number of young people entering the workforce having finished their education.

In the years preceding the EU referendum immigration was more than net 300,000 per year. The government seemed powerless to slow it down. Remember Cameron's pledge to cut immigration to the "tens of thousands"? Then, when he was PM, the numbers went up.

We need immigration but we also need public consent for immigration and you don't win this by calling those who are not convinced "racist" or "xenopohobic".

halfsiesonapotnoodle · Yesterday 22:37

I doubt it's anything to do with actual race but more to do with the fact we are a tiny island, whose population has grown massively since the 50s and is actually causing many services to be at breaking point. We have too many people.

This.

Today, I am making a pie for lunch,
It will feed four of us nicely.
If my parents come, I can stretch it and none of us will be hungry.
If the whole street come, we will get barely more than a crumb and we will be hungry.

@Galaktoboureko Muslims, for instance, have a higher birth rate than white British so this feeds into the rhetoric that they're 'taking over'/'using up all the resources', which is a bit of an exaggeration given that they're still a minority of the population

I would agree with that partially. - particlarly 'using up all the resources',
Given the propensity for some Muslim groups to advocate cousin/cousin marriages, we have a situation where the children of these parents are over-represented on paediatric wards in ethnic areas, due to birth defects.

www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leeds-23183102

www.cbc.ca/news/health/birth-defects-risk-for-married-cousins-estimated-in-uk-1.1356317

www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/home-news/london-borough-child-deaths-redbridge-parents-related-cousins-pakistani-families-council-report-a7741146.html

www.opindia.com/2022/02/pakistan-faces-a-high-risk-of-genetic-disorders-caused-by-inbreeding/

This is a huge drain on neonatal resources.

In in Kent, there have been a lot more than 22,000 channel migrants this year, it s in the 30.,000 now. They are all having to be housed somewhere, obviously most arent allowed to work. Costing millions per week to the taxpayer. The greater proportion are now found to be from Albania and are considered economic migrants. I can forsee big trouble at some time in the future due to the state of the housing market, cost of living etc, lack of services . People say well we should be building more houses, we are doing so in the SE, too many, with no infrastructure, and they are being built for the inhabitants of this country, we are not going to be building houses for illegal immigrants.
With regard to racism, if we were having thousands of white people crossing the channel in dinghys it would still be unacceptable

Strictly speaking, in terms of services, we have too many old white people. Around 20% of the UK population are white people aged 60+, people who are less likely to be providing services and increasingly likely to be using them.

Disgusting comment, my over 60, white relative has just died so that's one less for you to worry about.

This isn't related really, but my aunt moved to Australia so I guess she's classed as an immigrant in Australia? I could be totally wrong I am not clued up in the slightest, but there was strict rules that her family had to follow and be able to live up to in order to move there for instance, a certain amount of savings and job opportunities lined up. I don't know the ins and outs but I do know it wasn't easy.

Does anyone think that would work for our country? I think we should allow a certain amount of immigrants without conditions as I can only imagine how it must feel having to flee a country.

I can't comment any opinions as I don't know enough facts really. But the immigration subject does interest me because of the state of our countries economy currently.

So are posters saying we should cull all the old white people who have worked and raised families and paid tax. These old white people we need rid off to help balance the books for service provision, will we spare the ones that still work, volunteer and provide family support or are they too expendable so we can take in more people from other countries?

@gonutkin yes she's an immigrant. As I am in NZ. White western middle class people sometimes call themselves the ridiculous euphemism 'expats'.

I had to demonstrate a certain level of income (well above the national average), post grad degree and 10 years of experience in my field along with a clean bill of health to be given a visa. It still takes around 8 years to be considered a citizen. Any misdoing will have your visa cancelled and 'expatriated'. You also have to be under a certain age. 46 or something random.

We waited an extra 6 months for a decision because we had slightly high blood pressure... it's damn difficult to get into NZ and Aus yet this is barely questioned as being racist

I always call myself an immigrant in the hope of normalising the phrase.

@Mycatsgoldtooth totally agree. Maybe we should just have a mass cull of the over 60s to make space for immigration. Disgusting attitudes.

@Ilovemycatalot fully agree

You have to separate the different types for an honest conversation.

Economic migration via legal route, coming into the country with an expectation you will contribute and be an asset. - most don't disagree with this, it happens in most countries and benefits all involved.

Asylum, fleeing a dangerous situation, arriving here by any means and immediately applying for asylum with a view to integrate into this country, for your own safety, and for the benefit of our country - a moral duty to help? We have to assume this is always genuine even though sometimes it isn't, and we have to trust the immigration service to weed non-genuine ones out and send them back.

Illegal migration - coming on boats and disappearing into communities undocumented - highly dangerous, not acceptable, they must be caught and deported.

People overstaying visas - again illegal and they must be sent back unless they claim asylum.

It's mainly group three people have an issue with and rightly so. We have a legal system we all presumably respect that relies on each of us being officially documented and thus accountable for our crimes. That's incompatible with advocating for undocumented people living among us and obviously not paying taxes and posing a potential danger to our citizens.

I guess a lot of views are formed from where people live,it's all very well sitting in your nice four bedroom detached house in a middle class area ,with ample school places for your children in either private schools or nice leafy high achieving schools ,and you can afford private health care etc ,not think high levels of immigration are a problem
It's an entirely different scenario living in a deprived area ,with a high level of immigration, with an all ready over stretched health service , with schools bursting at the seems ,and not enough decent housing it might cloud your view somewhat.

👏👏👏👏👏

If there was no problem with white immigrants, we wouldn't have had Brexit.