Are people that want zero immigration racist?

[equalstime]

People that moan about migrants coming to this county - taking our jobs - taking our houses - draining the medical system - not settling in the first country they reach for asylum- they're racist right?

There will always be an element of migration and when you take account of UK born people that leave and non Uk people that enter our country, the net figure is no doubt reasonable. They are often willing to work and contribute to our society and economy - so why the hostility?

Why not accept as a country that we have en element of migration and embrace that, if not because your views are racist?

I quoted from the bbc. Please feel free to google I have you the year and the name of the study.

However, the majority of the concerns I have raised are about the effect on culture. I am not too bothered about the ecconomics. If we invested in people already here, had affordable education training and housing we would not have to invest in the human neoliberal Ponzi scheme.

For those who are pro mass immigration do you think 300k net year on year will have no negative effect culturally on the social cohesion. How much immigration would be too much? A million a year? I’d like to know what people’s actual ideas of sustainable immigration are?

I am not a brexit voter. I think it was destabilising. But, if the country had dealt with immigration in a way that pleased most voters- Controlled, regulated etc then I don’t think brexit would have happened.

news.files.bbci.co.uk/include/newsspec/pdfs/bbc-briefing-immigration-newsspec-26148-v1.pdf

Pg 126 onwards for anyone interested. Some interesting stuff here about acceptance culturally of immigration. The U.K. top of the list of countries polled about positive attitudes towards. Immigration. So hardly the unwelcoming place it’s been made out to be on this thread.

@Mycatsgoldtooth thank you for linking.
The report clearly recognises the value of Immigration to GB Society and the Economy.

You said upthread that this report identified a deficit of 4.6B annually due to Immigration. That figure refers to money Immigrants send back to their home countries (presumably to help their families) AFTER paying taxes, etc so instead of spending it in GB. Thus helping poor countries.
NOWHERE does it say that Immigrants cost more in public services than they contribute. Therefore they are NET contributors as the report also states on average they pay more than they take out, in fact on average they use less public services like the NHS.
Facts posted by your good self.
Thank you for proving my point.

Therefore anyone posting here stating that Immigration is causing problems with Public Services needs to give their head a big wobble. NO. They pay more into it than they use and thanks to them a lot of natives are not paying more.

If you need to blame someone go blame the useless Tories and not Immigration.

So you think an extra 300 people a year is putting no strain on public services. As I’ve said you need to make 38k annually to be a net contributor in terms of adding more then you are taking. That’s a high wage. I’m not sure all 300k are on this. We are not a rich country, we have massive debt. We can not look after the people already here. As mass immigration has happened the gdp of the country has fallen. How can this be when they are contributing so much.

How many people would you ideally see move to the U.K.? Should there be any limit. I’m interested to know.

@Mycatsgoldtooth Full disclosure
I’m an immigrant, by chance rather than design, as I married a Brit 31 years ago. Never intended to stay in GB, but stay I did because at the time I was happy and it made sense and for 40 years I did and that’s nearly all my working life.

We have grown up British born kids.
I’m writing from my house in Spain.
I’m a High Rate tax payer and have never taken a penny from the state, even though I’m many years shy of the shabby Estate pension age I already qualify with 38 years+ NI contributions. I even have private health care so when I’m back in GB in my own place I don’t need to rely on GP surgeries.
I feel most sorry for my kids who live there and I’m trying to persuade them to up sticks even though it’s their home country and their choice as young adults. I just don’t see a future for them there until people stop being so bloody stupid, and start voting responsibly instead of swallowing right wing propaganda.

I got so FED UP with the sheer audacity of brexiteers assuming I’m some kind of scrounger by virtue of my faint foreign accent that I have basically Given Up on GB. My heart broke when I realised half the population I came across in daily life had this low opinion of anyone foreign born.
I don’t have to put up with that shite so now the Spanish economy benefits from my taxes.

My solution would be go cap in hand to the EU and restore free trade and FOM but unfortunately on vastly less advantageous terms (like Norway) and get the economy moving again and highly skilled Europeans moving again to help with cultural cohesion and yes, give young Brits opportunities to study and work in Europe too.
Impose controls just like the rest of Europe has always done: The EU was never a “free for all” so people can look for a job but need to pay for healthcare the first year at least till they’re employed and contributing with their NI/taxes. No free social housing to anyone not working and contributing.

GB was really raking it in in prestige and economic growth as part of the EU.
Vote for a more socially conscious Govt that will invest in public services.

I do hope people realise Brexit was such a crazy foolish thing that at least restoring free trade will reverse the worst damage yet to come.
The immigration numbers from Europe would balance themselves quite fast as it’s the law of supply and demand. When there’s no work a lot of the young people simply leave.
Hell, even the long term ones with British passports like me have, so there’s nothing to fear.

1. The vast majority of EU workers are young so not a strain on public services
2. Culturally similar so less problems with language and integration into society
3. They contribute more than they take out
4. The ones that stay and settle for good will make a lasting contribution to society
5. There’s a shortage of workers in GB: unless you force all the working age natives (and they number millions) to get off their arses and work you need the workforce to tend to the old, the sick, to contribute to Science, and yes to even pick crops from the fields…

The Asylum/Refugees question is separate and should be comprehensively addressed with offering safe routes to claim in collaboration with the UN and Europe.

No

Like many who feel there has been too much immigration I voted Remain.

Volver,m the current Tories are very socialist, high spending, high immigration middle of the road party. Those of us who want less immigration have no main party for which to vote as both Labour and the Tories want and have achieved the highest immigration levels of British history ever including the latest figures 1m a year immigration (about 500k I believe net immigration figure).

For me it has never been about money. I would rather be worse off and have fewer people here. We have 18m more people in the Uk than when I was born and are very crowded.

I meant the millions of working age Brits currently not working and living off benefits, to get off their arses if you don’t want further immigration.
Apologies for not making that clearer.

Well yes.

Is the only direction to get more populous? Because how do people square that with climate change issues.

I think we’re in for a rough time and ideas around border control may well shift further as a result

@Xenia I understand
I do remember GB in the 80’s.

Its a problem with population numbers globally. Stop having babies??

According to last years Census for England and Wales in the last 10 years the population grew from 51million to 59 million (in round numbers) and accounting for deaths most of that population growth is births at over 6 million.
2 million is the net immigration over 10 years (2011 to 2021) so not sure where the 1 million in the last year you quote comes from but look:

If you don’t want immigration you’ll soon end up with a large portion of the population too old and not enough young working so if that’s the concern: limit all immigration and see how it goes??
I don’t know where the money will come from to support the ageing population but it’ll be an interesting experiment.

I think some posters are confusing immigrants with refugees/ asylum. I can tell you that the first is very difficult and expensive.

@Volver ah you’re an elite person with lots of money that does not live in the U.K who is a bit put out that the country voted brexit and you took it personally. All the while I’m in a poor area, on a street with lots of multiple occupancy housing, lots of crime and antisocial behaviour caused by the people living here who have arrived in the last five years. I work with deprived communities with a budget that now has to stretch to encompass the massive immigration into my area in the last five years.

You put no figure but it seems infinity immigrants is ok but.. doesn’t really effect you does it. You can move to Spain, I’m English so if this country suffers then it’s my life and my children’s that are worse off. You can just pay for yours to come to live with you out of the chaos. Classic, none English people, with no investment in our way of life or future thinking they have more rights to say who lives in this country then native born people.

@Lentilweaver seejng my brother and sil jump through hoops, pay 7k in solicitors fees and other things for her to move here really opened my eyes to the playing of the system that goes on and the amount of people coming into the country with no checks, no ability to support themselves etc. Seems a joke that some people are vetted and some people not.

@Mycatsgoldtooth Elite person?!!
you’re having a laugh aren’t you.

The ONLY reason I left GB was Brexit, do you think someone who’s built their whole life for 40 years in a country ups sticks lightly?
I’ve worked hard all my life and thought my contribution was valued till I heard the xenophobic BS, till I started seeing how people behaved differently when they heard a foreign accent, when I heard of the xenophobic attacks on Europeans and it literally Broke my Heart.
The place I called Home viewed people like me as Aliens, scroungers.

That’s the only reason I left. Maybe I would have retired to Spain later in life, after stopping work like many of your compatriots do, but my decision was made as I didn’t want to live my life being viewed suspiciously by random strangers.

A little bit of my heart is always in GB, as my husband’s dear family are there, my children and many many good friends who don’t share the appalling views I’ve read here on Immigration that lack all basis on FACTS.

And I am also a (dual) British National though I do realise that to some native born like you I will never be a “true Brit”.
Thank you again for proving my point.

Yes this is my argument

Can't we be honest and say that many of them need financial support

Yes why haven't we done this in the first place

@Volver but as you said you are a high rate tax payer who has left the U.K to retire early abroad. Quite elite compared to most people on low wages and no chance of a life in the sun. You don’t live here, you’re not invested in the future here. Like it or not you don’t really get a say as you’re not living daily with the effects of mass immigration and you encourage your kids to leave too. My point was that I don’t have that option, as I am not duel nationality so have a necessary investment in this country as it’s the only home I have. Not that I’m a ‘true Brit’. But, I am a native English person and I do think that gives me a right to care about this country more then someone who does not reside here and encourages their offspring to leave. Rat from a sinking ship comes to mind…

Wow. I’m an A&E doctor. Three of us out of twenty are white British. Without immigration this country would be fucked. Of course it’s racist.

But those are 'good immigrants'. With skills. Not bus drivers or care workers or Deliveroo workers. And they have 'assimilated'.

Less immigration would mean less demand for housing which would make houses cheaper, not more expensive.

@Mycatsgoldtooth i haven’t retired yet.
As far as I see it if people will hold fascist views on immigrants a lot of those who were making a useful contribution will not put up with it and leave.
I’m not alone, hundreds of thousands did too after seeing how they were viewed.

And I AM invested in GB. My kids live and work there: it’s their home country, they have British surnames, they grew up there and their father is as you like to put it “native born”. I want them to stay in their homeland IF they have a future. By your own admission there doesn’t seem to be a future for British people.

Honestly you’re blaming the wrong people for the mess a once great, thriving, inclusive country is in.

Thats not true though. The government keeps house prices high by design. They don't want cheaper housing.

I’m dual national. I can’t say it crossed my mind to leave due to Brexit. Maybe where you live has an impact. It’s diverse here and hasn’t changed from that.

@MarshaBradyo yes I lived in an area that voted 75% Leave.