To wonder what you advised your failing children to do for careers?

[lennypenny]

If your child was failing in school due to not being very academic or simply just average; what did you advise them to do for their futures (not including trades)?

Any stories of how they still managed to build a successful life for themselves or are they in low paid, unfulfilling work?

To start at an administrative grade at a good, reputable company and work hard. Career progression will follow.

My husband, who did poorly at school and is now doing very well for himself, would say that having a strong work ethic and being able to talk to people are probably the most important things.

Our son is 1 and we have been thinking a lot about how we will deal with this situation in the future if he also ends up not being very academic. For me, my main worry is that he will end up like my husband who has major insecurities about being “thick” or not smart enough which have entirely stemmed from school and his family. I think it drives his success in a lot of ways as he feels he has something to prove but if I could take away those feelings of not being good enough, I would in a heartbeat.

Conversely, my BIL is academically very smart. Masters, PHD, part of MENSA. Job wise, he is currently unemployed as he doesn’t want to take a job below his educational standards (yes, he is a bit of a knob) but ultimately it comes down to the fact that he doesn’t come across as being likeable or hardworking and no employer wants to deal with that, no matter how smart you are.

Another vote for an apprenticeship. And they aren’t just for being a plumber or carpenter these days. Lots of traditional “office jobs” now offer apprenticeships including accountancy, project management, quantity surveying etc.

Just Google the type of job he is thinking of and add apprenticeship on the end. You’ll be surprised.

My industry is construction consultancy. We have a thriving apprenticeship scheme, industry leading. 18yr olds walk in straight from college into working 4 days a week and studying at uni 1 day a week. They earn a decent wage, get office experience and a degree paid for by the company. Theres something about earning money and being surrounded by professional working people that motivates these guys and girls into achieving amazing things.

I worked in a call centre doing telemarketing and cust service from 17 while doing A-levels.

Became a team leader at 20
Moved to another call centre as team leader at 22
Applied for Floor manager role at 24
Moved into a variety of different management roles including; Training team, Business Support Management, customer experience.
Moved into IT Management
Specialised into IT Governance
Then a variety of Governance, risk and compliance management roles
Became Director IT Security, Risk & Compliance at 38.

I work in Saas, software as a service. You’re always in the massive pressure but it’s no worse than a solicitor trying to push through house sales or a surgeon who needs to meet quoters of patients to get through in a month.

I work for myself now but back in the day we were tied to our desk from eight until eight, I sense mobile phones working from home etc I would say I probably do about 20 hours a week of work the rest of the time I’m just answering emails and phone calls as required from the comfort of the lounge is it David Lloyd whilst the kids play. But it has taken 20 years to build a network that allows that.
everyone has to start somewhere though and basic salaries are very decent it’s not commission only these days. My basic is over £50 grand and I will double that in commission.

OP - I think you are right that A level maths (at secondary school) will likely be too hard if he struggles with gcse. The door would always be open to do it as an adult if he found he needed it and got more confidence in it.

I don’t think he has to give up on accountancy if he doesn’t have a level maths though - I think there are some entry level AAT qualifications that he can do - eg book-keeping (look it up online). So he can build up from there? I know someone who did an accountancy apprenticeship with one of the big 4 accountancy firms (no uni degree).

Level 3 apprenticeship in accountancy or business admin, work their way up…

A level Maths is definitely not needed!!!!

My job is careers guidance for young people and I talk to employers/apprenticeship providers and HE/FE settings every day.

You sound like me. I can get on with thi gs straight away and be good. But if its something g that is a struggle in the beginning I don't have to skills to 'learn'.

I found this out when I began doing my driving lesson. I got frustrated that I couldn't get it and thought how the hell does such a vast array of people drive?

But I kept on and it got easier. I'm finally learning skills that I would've learnt at school if I wasn't ao academic.

Of course he can become an accountant without a A Level in Maths, it’s just a different path through apprenticeship. You start at level 2/gcse equivalent to become an accounts assistant and then work your way up through the levels to degree level.

Do you definitely need a level maths to be an accountant/analyst? I did a level accounting (last century 😊) but not maths and could have gone on to do accounting quals if I'd wanted...

Both my cousins, neither very academic, didn’t go to uni. One was arrested driving recklessly, drink driving, other just kind of drifted along. Both ended up going to a trade type school, one hair, one automotive. Both own their own successful businesses now and have since they were about 30. The drunk driving one was diagnosed as bipolar, hence issues with impulse control. The other married then divorced but pretty amicably. No idea of their actual finances but I think both have the means to be doing well, so they may overspend like anyone, but basically set themselves up great for a successful life.

my brother and were both very academic, Oxbridge, graduate degrees etc. both in stable marriages and very solid financially but also family covered uni fees and offered huge help to buy houses etc. If we hadn’t had that family help, I think cousins would probably be better off financially too.

This is exactly my experience.
One of my old school friends (the least academic one) left school at 16 and took a job as an office junior.

My snobbish mother sneered at her lack of ambition, but she's laughing on the other side of her face now! Old school friend is now on the board of executives, earning well into six figures.

Another of my school mates left school at 16 to do an apprentice Hair & Beauty course. She's been working in LA for nearly 3 decades now, living a life that the rest of us can only dream of.

Meanwhile, us sensible ones who stuck in, went to university, and took no risks - we're the ones (to varying degrees) trying to make ends meet.

I tried to explain this thinking to my own DC1, now 24. He wasn't particularly academic, got "middling" grades at school - I tried to encourage him to think of other career alternatives outside of going to university.
But, he was absolutely adamant he wanted the "university experience", since all his friends were going.
So, he got himself on to a Sports Management course at an ex-poly, racked up nearly £40K worth of debt, and is now working FT in the pub he worked in while doing his Uni course.

He tells me now that he wishes he'd gone for a trade or an apprenticeship, and I've bit my tongue because I don't want to say 'I told you so'.

Apprenticeship in accounting. Bioinformatics is very up and coming if into computer programming.

I was academic at school but have worked all my life in jobs with varying degrees of shittiness, and sadly not likely to change. So many other factors at play 🤷

I always say to my DC, the most important thing is to be happy. One of them is very academic and driven and is doing well in her career. The other one not so much and works in 'low paid, unfulfilling job', but is the happier and less stressed of the 2

I hear you.
I graduated with a First in Economics from Glasgow University in 2003, and I'm now a Health Care Assistant in a Hospice.
Life post-graduation was unutterably hellish, and I am so glad for where I've ended up.

Oh that is a relief. Thank you!

Why does he need to do A level Math? Trust me, if he wants to be an Accountant, join a Firm as an apprentice. Get paid to do his ACCA and or AAT exams. Sorted. He does not need A level Math

My son is severely dyslexic. School was a nightmare for him. He hated it. He was told numerous times that if he did not get any GCSE’s he would never work. He never got any GCSE’s and he has never been out of work. He earns good money. The only advise I gave him was to attend school as it was the law and that he would find his way. He did and I am proud of him. His sister is a teacher (who I am also proud of) and they both earn around the same money.

At 24 perhaps he thinks he’s ‘too late’ or ‘missed the boat’. Encourage him to catch the next boat going the way he wants.

Im 40. Went to uni to please my family (first one to go). In reality I didn’t have a clue what I wanted to study or where and went for the sake of ticking a box.

Im a stay home parent and I’m genuinely thrilled to not know what to do next. Because everything is an option. So tell him to go try. He won’t be the youngest junior and his uni and work experience will count somewhere on the path.

School just measures very limited types of intelligence. There are many different types of intelligence as outlined here …. psychology-spot.com/types-of-intelligence/

results also depend on effort and interest. Many find that school doesn’t rock their boat and only find motivation to study when doing something they love.

take your child to a careers advisor in your local college and let them explore possibilities and strengths. They will have lots of questionnaires, links to training and courses, strengths finders

Is Set 1 the top or bottom set at your son's school?

In all the schools I've taught in, Set 1 has been the top set, so I'm just trying to understand whether your DS is struggling to get the very top grades or struggling to pass at all.

My
mother steered me and I really wish she hadn’t, she had a very limited understanding of what was out there and I felt under pressure to do something traditional

I don’t understand the outrage. OP explained that they meant academically. OP, your DS can’t be failing if he’s in set 1 maths?

I agree in seeking out an apprenticeship route for accounting, if that’s what he’s interested in.

Some of the most successful people I went to school with, really struggled academically.

There are usually careers fairs showcasing apprenticeship opportunities.
🤞

Both friends of mine on six figure salaries didn't make university. One set up his own plumbing company and employs 40+.

The other owns a company specialising in nursing home new builds. Both are very successful.

Both left education without debt.

My university friends are middling in salary. Getting by comfortably but by no means wealthy.

Something that he will enjoy, and pays a salary that he'll be comfortable. That's all anyone needs.