What do you count as a 'professional' job?

[Llamapalma]

My DSis and I have been arguing this tonight.

What in your opinion counts as a 'professional' job?

Certain wage? Anyone who works in an office? Anyone who has to dress smart? Certain job titles?

@ThisShitsBananas same!

I would add military officers and clergy, neither of which necessarily have degrees, though many do, and are counted as professionals to sign passport photographs.

My dog trainer has done extensive training, does CPD, is a member of two professional bodies but I doubt most people would consider her in a professional occupation.

I just think anyone who is specifically trained to do something is a professional in that thing. A bit like when my husband wants to fit the laminate in the hall and I think, nah let’s get a professional to do it.

My dog trainer has done extensive training, does CPD, is a member of two professional bodies but I doubt most people would consider her in a professional occupation.

Yes but the difference is your dog walker does not need to do all of that in order to call herself a dog walker and operate as one.
With many professions you cannot operate in that role unless you are registered and you cannot be registered unless you have certain qualifications sad you cannot renew your registration without CPD

@ThisShitsBananas @TTabithaTittlemouse I third that! I'm surprised some people don't see nurses as being professionals tbh

Several or all of: professional registration required to practice, ongoing training require to maintain registration, protection of title, post 18 training and qualifications, autonomy in practice. Carries risk and responsibility for being sued.

One that gives you access to Costco individual membership.

Signed,

A sore and bitter non-member

I know but you don’t have to have them to be a police officer in the same way you have to have a nursing degree or an architectural degree, etc.

Doctor
Lawyer
Architect
Airline Pilot/Air Traffic Control
Armed Forces
Nurse
Teacher/Lecturer
Social Worker
Police
Accountant
Vet

In the same way that some TAs have degrees or are qualified teachers, but you don’t need them. Being a Teaching Assistant is not a profession.

According to ‘old’ theory, there are three professions. Medicine, law and the cloth (religion) . So call me old fashioned, but that’s how I measure ‘professionalism’ .

Totally agree that teaching assistants aren’t professionals. Just been having a look at the SOC classification, interesting stuff. It says some admin roles count but it’s quite specific regarding which roles and responsibilities count as a professional. Ie you need to be a company secretary or a registrar or some civil service level 7 jobs or advising government on policy. There was some other stuff as well but I got the impression that an office manager doesn’t count

According to ‘old’ theory, there are three professions. Medicine, law and the cloth (religion) . So call me old fashioned, but that’s how I measure ‘professionalism’

old fashioned indeed! By about 500 years

😂

So being a dentist isn’t a profession?!

howshouldibehave · Today 11:13
ThreeblackCats · Today 11:02
According to ‘old’ theory, there are three professions. Medicine, law and the cloth (religion) . So call me old fashioned, but that’s how I measure ‘professionalism’ .
😂

So being a dentist isn’t a profession?!
Being a dentist is a profession. It’s medicine!

Of course nursing is a profession. We have to have achieved an approved course of degree level study (or equivalent if like me you're old and trained before it was degree level). We are monitored by a professional body who we have to pay and have to show evidence of CPD to. If our standards are not up to scratch, we can be struck off the register.

But there is a Chartered Institute for Company Secretaries, and a set qualification. Listed companies need a qualified company secretary. It's not just the director's wife!

I think the signing passport photo list is a bit misleading - that just lists people who can easily be tracked down if the passport application needs following up. Not necessarily those in a profession.

Difference is that the vast majority of limited companies don't need a "qualified" company secretary and literally anyone can act as company secretary. So simply holding a company secretary position doesn't mean you're qualified or professional.

Love this question. I've never thought about it.

However, TA is definitely not a professional role. Sorry!

Old fashioned and completely out of date!

Yes, that's what I was trying to say. There are Chartered company secretaries who are professionals.

To me it’s a really outdated term, that sounds like it was invented by a bunch of middle class white men in order to exclude others.

It doesn’t say anything about the level of skill, qualifications required, earnings or usefulness of a job.

I always think it’s ridiculous when you need to have a form signed by a ‘professional’ to vouch for you. So the teacher I live next door to can sign it, but his PhD educated wife (who I’ve known for longer than I’ve known him) can’t sign it because her job doesn’t count as being a ‘profession’.

(And if a PhD isn’t a hardcore proper qualification I don’t know what is!)

I'd go with this.

E.g. an engineer might mainly work on site, but will need professional qualifications. Same for clinical professionals, who do not work in offices.

Jobs that require some form of professional registration/qualification or equivalent also usually involve CPD, and keeping skills up to date, so I'd say that is a factor.

I think the reason for this is based on the fact that people who hold professional accreditations are usually held to formal codes of conduct and can be stripped of their registration/job if they e.g. lie on a form. A PhD is not.

It's part of my job to analyse and understand data on the jobs university graduates go on to do so i need to have a clear understanding of what constitutes a professional job. I've been astounded by some of the replies on this thread that suggest teaching and nursing aren't professions! Of course they are!

I'm a qualified ( but not longer practicing) Careers Adviser. The fact that is considered a profession must blow the minds of some people on this thread!