We don't want my niece to stay with us

[canthandleniece]

My brother and his family are planning on moving to his wife’s home country so that his son can participate in a clinical trial for nerve regeneration.

My brother also has a daughter named Mary (15). She very much does not want to move with them. She doesn’t want to leave her friends behind, wants to continue her schooling here, and does not want to move. My brother has asked if Mary can stay with me and my family while she is in school. He has offered to pay us monthly for her food and utility usage while she is here with us and she will go stay with them during the holidays.

I’m going to be very blunt here. No one (Not me. Not my husband. Not our children) like Mary. It’s not because she’s purposely unkind. She is just incessantly annoying. She talks nonstop. Constantly asks questions. Many of which can be very invasive. She also often interrupts. Often to correct you for something you said. I swear the amount of times she’s gone “well, actually” in an afternoon is enough to drive me insane. I really don’t think she is an unkind person. It seems more like an impulse issue.

We all find it very hard to tolerate though. She is actually the reason we tend to keep family visits on the shorter side. I don’t think having her live with us full time would be a good idea as she would drive us mad, so later on I called my brother and told him it wouldn’t work out.

Brother asked why. He brought up how we have an extra bedroom and how since our son goes to the same school as her so our commute schedule wouldn’t have to change.

I at first tried to just say that I didn’t think we would be a good fit. My brother kept pushing though so I gently told him how the issues she has are very hard for my family to handle and that we couldn’t tolerate her full time.

My brother said Marys life is going to be turned upside down and I wasn’t willing to look past a few quirks and help when it would be everything to Mary to get to stay with us. He ended the call bu saying what a great aunt I was in a sarcastic voice.

The lesson she is teaching them about family is that you shouldn’t put up with things from them just because you are related.
I barely know my nieces and nephews and wouldn’t let them live with me unless their parents were dead or similar

I’d want to help. I no it would be hard.but your own teenagers or kids might be one day. And I no from experience how much family support has been vital.how much when they have stepped in,given respite it’s been saviours.and I think they’d do all they could to take ours if we needed it,even with complex needs,maybe even more so.
I no it a huge undertaking.
and I then wouldn’t want how you all obviously feel to make this girl feel rotten.if need to be on board to welcome her.
you’d need to get rules you’d need way more discussion on this.to talk through day to day life and how you will essentially parent.
it wouod be tough.but honestly thinking of my sibling right now,yeah I think I’d have to help jo matter what.I’d do everything for them.

It's not blackmail. It's just cause and effect. And no, OP SHOULDN'T put her family feeling annoyed by a cousin before what her brother's family is going through. There's no comparison.

Ffs. 15 year olds are very often annoying. And you use that to blame Mary and her parents for OP's selfishness?

this

They're being brought up to put themselves first in all circumstances. Terrible parenting.

What this 15 year old needs is a stable situation for the next couple of years. What you happen if her living situation broke down while her parents were abroad? It's sensible to consider whether her staying with you would be sustainable or if you know it's not going to work.

As I said upthread, this is a huge ask. Huge. And it strikes me that the OP’s brother has worked it all out to suit his family and presented it to the OP as a fair accompli; “here’s what you need to do”. It’s clearly something that’s been some time in the planning - why wasn’t OP involved as soon as this became something that might come about? In a “we’re thinking about this, is there any way you could help?” As it is, he’s clearly thought through all the details (down to their commutes and the spare room and the money for food etc), but hasn’t asked OP to be involved in the planning stage. At all.

I did put it in the post. She had most meals with the family, all evening meals and most weekend meals but my friend and her husband both work full time (although my friend works from home) so during holidays and at busy times the children made their own lunches (16,16, 14 yo). I think she used the house kitchen but she had her own kitchenette for snacks if she wanted them. Similar to OP the niece and my DF daughter were only about 6 months apart in age and were very different characters, they rubbed each other up the wrong way so having their own space worked. If they went out or had a movie night she was included. Just an idea!

You're aware that trials need to accept the kid first? And that thinking through details like "they go to the same school" would.take about 5 minutes?

Apologies, I’m following the replies hard to follow! The other niece was in a state boarding school some distance away so either went to a friend’s or came to stay at DF during holidays (or went home over Christmas etc). She is a year younger but much more similar in personality to DF’s family (quite loud and sporty) so was happy to bunk in wherever (with sister or cousin). I can’t imagine leaving my daughter behind but if I had to go and she wanted to stay I think she would like to have her own space at 16, even if she were staying with close family, after all it’s not her home.

You're aware that trials need to accept the kid first?

Of course. But that’s my point - this has been a long time in the (potential) planning. And the OP should have been asked at that point - not given an effective fait accompli and a snippy response when her initial reaction is “not sure this will work”.

It may well be that the reason they're going abroad is because the treatment isn't available in this country because it doesn't have a good enough chance of working, so won't get ethical approval. It may even be that there have been trials in this county which have concluded it doesn't work except in very rare cases. The UK doctor I heard talk said that some parents would be prepared to take on treatment that had very low chances of success because of the chance of that child being the 1 in 100 that made a minor improvement.

That's possible. But it's also very likely that it's something in a relatively early stage of development, but showing some promise. There are some nerve regeneration treatments for brain injury/ spinal cord injury that have shown some promise in animal studies, and are now being trialled with human beings. They are not guaranteed to work, of course; but not quackery/ already disproved, either.

Also, it is sometimes thought that being in a clinical trial can be very useful in itself to some people, because of the extensive medical supervision and testing, even if the particular treatment turns out not to be very effective, or even if they're in the control group.

A bit off-topic; but just saying that we shouldn't be too ready to assume that the clinical trial is unnecessary or worthless.

In all circumstances? Bit of an extrapolation, given that we only know about this one. Perfectly reasonable to choose to put your own immediate family’s needs first.

Needs are different to wants! The family would prefer not to have the niece stay and yes, she's hard work, but this isn't going to harm them. The OPs kids aren't even being asked to share a room.

But it's a moot point now anyway because I doubt the brother will want to leave his child with someone who has just told him they find her irritating!
Poor sod - he's got a child about to undergo treatment, a teenage dd who doesn't want to have her whole life disrupted and a sister who won't even try to put herself out a bit to help him!

a sister who won't even try to put herself out a bit to help him!

”Putting herself out a bit” would mean, to me:

• Picking the girl up from school a couple of times a week
• Having the niece to stay for a week/fortnight while she did an exam
• Having the girl stay over for the weekend to give the parents some time with the brother

…..but becoming her primary carer for an open ended period of not longer than one year? That’s not “a bit” or anything. It’s an enormous commitment and responsibility that will have an impact on her whole family.

The op says they only se each other on holidays-theyre not close and the dc doesn sound like theyd be too happy either

it sad for mary but its for her own parents to sort out

Well, moving someone in that no one wants there is likely to have more of a detrimental impact than mild irritation. It certainly is something that can cause harm to OP’s family unit. What if her husband says no, is she just supposed to move Mary in anyway? That’ll go well.

@canthandleniece, I can understand not wanting her to stay with you, BUT I find it interesting that this is your FAMILY and you've never taken the time to CORRECT her behavior! You're a grown person! She is a child! You should have taken the time to teach her better when you were around her instead of running and hiding and limiting your time at events! How horrible of you to be part of this child's "village" and turn your back on her for behavioral issues that she could be helped with! Even now, instead of just talking to her, you'd rather reject her entirely. You are a horrible aunt! Sure, she is not your child, but she IS your family! On your brother's side, why didn't one of the adults stay home with her? BOTH of the parents are not needed! Since they have TWO children, one should of stayed home! ALL the adults in this situation suck here! You're doing your niece a disservice and so are her parents! You could help her, in more ways than one, and her parents left her when only one needed to go! I hope your nephew is OK, but do better auntie!

I can understand not wanting her to stay with you, BUT I find it interesting that this is your FAMILY and you've never taken the time to CORRECT her behavior! You're a grown person! She is a child! You should have taken the time to teach her better when you were around her instead of running and hiding and limiting your time at events! How horrible of you to be part of this child's "village" and turn your back on her for behavioral issues that she could be helped with! Even now, instead of just talking to her, you'd rather reject her entirely.

I’m mystified as to why Mary’s parents seem to be absolved of any responsibility for Mary, in terms of her behaviour or her care for the next 18 months, and now it all seems to be the fault of the OP?

BUT I find it interesting that this is your FAMILY and you've never taken the time to CORRECT her behavior! You're a grown person! She is a child! You should have taken the time to teach her better when you were around her instead of running and hiding and limiting your time at events

Of course. Because Mumsnet is full of threads like this. “My DD is quite often an annoying pain, so I’m so grateful to my SIL for intervening and challenging and trying to correct her behaviour. That’s what families are for, after all……”.

People do not take kindly to others (family or not) criticising their children (even if it’s meant constructively). Can you imagine the fallout if OP had tried….?

It's really weird how you're blaming the aunt for not correcting the child's behaviour and not her parents.

She hasn't been diagnosed with anything so if we assume she's NT but spoilt/acting up/used to competing for attention with her disabled brother surely that's on her parents. Why haven't they helped her?

Can't say I've felt confident enough to correct a child I only see a few times a year.

Or if we assume perhaps there is something like ADHD coming into play her parents should realise what a massive ask this is for anyone to take on a ND child (especially one going through a stressful exam period and dare I say it turbulent teenage years).

All the people saying think of the poor child seem to have ignored the ops children who apparently don't deserve a safe and stable home.

As for teaching her own children not to help others pff. Maybe the op is teaching them the importance of boundaries. Not being one of the many people pleasers we see on here in a shitty situation because people take advantage of them.

The op asked her family. They all said no. So she'd be teaching them no doesn't mean no. Consent can be overruled.

I feel for the girl. But her issues are firmly at her parents door. She is the way she is because her parents have failed her. Either by not correcting her or not seeking additional support. Adding on to that abandoning her for over year while they prioritise her brother is only going to compound that.

He should really stay with her. Do some parenting. Make her feel as important as her brother in her own family.

Just another example of neurodivergent children being punished by family imo.

You have every right to invite or not invite who you want into your home, but you're still avoiding your niece for what is likely nuerodivergent symptoms expressing.

You should be finding a way through it with her rather than avoiding her.

No. Her parents should be finding a way through it for her.

Fucks sake

No, that’s for her parents to do.