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AIBU?

And now Italy

138 replies

Pampapuddlepoose · 26/09/2022 15:43

Italy has just voted in it's most right wing prime minister since Muesli.

IANBU - This whole thing is starting to look scarily like the build up to WW2
AIBU - Stop worrying and go and do something useful.

I'm going to stop reading/watching the news. It's scaring me and I can't fk anything about if anyway. I'm not trying to scaremongering, I'd just like some other opinions.

OP posts:
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Am I being unreasonable?

465 votes. Final results.

POLL
You are being unreasonable
57%
You are NOT being unreasonable
43%
Melassa · 26/09/2022 18:43

Scianel · 26/09/2022 17:14

I'm not massively surprised. They had a shit old pandemic and Draghi was hugely unpopular.

Draghi was hugely popular and it wasn’t him in power during the pandemic, it was Conte.

Many people didn’t bother voting as the little bickering politicians brought down the government and the only credible person in parliament. All the rest are complete clowns and people are fed up with them so have abstained from voting. The ones who did vote in droves were the older demographic and “angry young men” like DP’s friend’s son whose rebellion phase involves becoming a rabid racist.

I was out much of the day yesterday and there were very few people at the polling booths. It was one of the lowest turnouts in years.

Meloni is a serial liar who adjusts her
lie based on the audience. Much like Boris I suppose. One silver lining is that fuckface Salvini’s party got trounced. We’ll see how long this lasts, Meloni is a skilled liar but not capable of running an engine, let alone a country. I suppose it depends on who is in the wings subsidising her and advising her. Hate and bigotry has deep pockets, as we’ve seen elsewhere.

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KalaniM · 26/09/2022 18:44

Actually do quite like muesli, but have stopped eating it because far too many raisins. Overnight oats with defrosted fruits of the forest gets my vote.

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Crunchingleaf · 26/09/2022 18:47

Geneva12 · 26/09/2022 18:03

Yes. And after they have listened then the left need to take on board what people are saying and not call them racist, bigot, thick and stupid for having an opinion that is not the same as them.

Also I have always been left leaning, however I would be just as against having a far left government as a far right government. Either extreme is not a good place for the majority of citizens.
Representing the best interests of those in your constituency seems to alien to majority of politicians in many countries.

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Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 18:52

Draghi was a technocratic leader placed there by the EU to keep the right wing wolves at bay. It could never last, as he was not actually elected. He was a human sticking plaster.

I am not in the least bit surprised by this result, Italians have been desperate to leave for years. I never forget going to Florence after brexit, and trying to get used to the idea and all the waiters and taxi drivers congratulating me! As if I personally had dragged us out of the EU on my own. The same happened in the Netherlands, France and Sweden over the years in different forms. My polish friends have since joined the sentiment.

They said the UK always leads the way, and brexit was no different!

It was truly the most surreal of conversations, and coming back here it was white hot heat of anger from the 48% that voted to remain, and yet in Europe so many were delighted.

Italy will leave now. They have been lining up the lira for years now, and I remember there was always a plan, so I guess we might see it now.

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Alexandra2001 · 26/09/2022 18:53

FOJN · 26/09/2022 17:47

Would you be so worried if it was the most left wing PM ever, or would that not concern you as it would be more in line with your political leanings?

I know it's bizarre that people seem to think anything left wing is benevolent at best and benign at worst. I think I'm correct in saying that extreme left politics claimed far more lives in the 20th Century than extreme right wing politics.

If your referring to Stalin, he wasn't left wing, he wasn't even a communist, he was a murderous dictator who killed anyone from either side who he deemed as a threat, including communists.

He used Marxism to gain power, after that anything goes.

He held power as General Secretary of the Communist Party of the Soviet Union (1922–1952) and Chairman of the Council of Ministers of the Soviet Union (1941–1953). Initially governing the country as part of a collective leadership, he consolidated power to become a dictator by the 1930s. Ideologically adhering to the Leninist interpretation of Marxism, he formalised these ideas as Marxism–Leninism, while his own policies are called Stalinism

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EmmaH2022 · 26/09/2022 18:56

Geneva12 · 26/09/2022 18:03

Yes. And after they have listened then the left need to take on board what people are saying and not call them racist, bigot, thick and stupid for having an opinion that is not the same as them.

Exactly.

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Alexandra2001 · 26/09/2022 18:58

@Kissingfrogs25 Yeah course they will, just like you were treated like the Messiah after Brexit... all bollox.

EU is more popular than ever, Le Pen had to say she'd stay in to stand a chance and still had her arse handed to her, same with Meloni, only 24% of voters supported her, in a very low turn, pissed off Draghi being booted out.

Sometimes i do wonder if ever been to mainland Europe.

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Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 18:59

Italians have basically been muzzled until now. This explains why:

"Italy loves technocrats. The latest proof is the decision to install Mario Draghi, former governor of the Bank of Italy and former president of the European Central Bank, as prime minister. This followed the resignation of Giuseppe Conte, who lost the support of one of the parties that formed his parliamentary majority.

The Italian president, Sergio Mattarella, when asking Draghi to form a government of national unity, said it would be too much of a risk to hold elections at this point in the pandemic. The idea is that this administration should focus on the immediate pressures of COVID"

theconversation.com/mario-draghi-is-italys-addiction-to-technocratic-leaders-a-cause-for-concern-155336

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colddayinhell · 26/09/2022 19:00

What has she said that is so terrifying OP?

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Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 19:01

The Italians have not had a chance to vote for years alex please stop talking bollox yourself! They have had to put up with an EU engineered technocratic government!

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Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 19:06

"Technocracy is inherently opposite to a pluralistic view of politics. At its core is the assumption that there is one solution to any problem and experts are the people who know the best way to arrive at that solution. There is no room, in this vision, for conflict or accommodation between opposing interests and values – that is to say the essence of politics and the essence of parties, which are supposed to represent the different segments of society.

As political scientist Lorenzo De Sio argues, technocratic leadership removes responsibility from both parties and voters. Parties give up their role of making hard choices in the allocation of resources. This way, decisions appear to be taken out of the political realm – even though, in reality, the allocation of resources always entails a political decision about who gets what – even when that decision is made by experts on the basis of their supposedly superior knowledge"

You could argue a technocracy cancels out real democracy altogether.
There is no accountability

Not unlike the EU political structure.

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Melassa · 26/09/2022 19:10

Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 18:52

Draghi was a technocratic leader placed there by the EU to keep the right wing wolves at bay. It could never last, as he was not actually elected. He was a human sticking plaster.

I am not in the least bit surprised by this result, Italians have been desperate to leave for years. I never forget going to Florence after brexit, and trying to get used to the idea and all the waiters and taxi drivers congratulating me! As if I personally had dragged us out of the EU on my own. The same happened in the Netherlands, France and Sweden over the years in different forms. My polish friends have since joined the sentiment.

They said the UK always leads the way, and brexit was no different!

It was truly the most surreal of conversations, and coming back here it was white hot heat of anger from the 48% that voted to remain, and yet in Europe so many were delighted.

Italy will leave now. They have been lining up the lira for years now, and I remember there was always a plan, so I guess we might see it now.

Lol. Since then most Italians have seen what a shitshow the U.K. has become and are horrified by the idea. I live and work with Italians every day and apart from one errant taxi driver in 2016 (can you see a theme?) no one has thought Brexit was a good idea. It was all “what were they thinking?!” Obviously reinforced by the parade of loons in U.K. politics which just confirmed that madness had beset the normally pragmatic Brits.

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Melassa · 26/09/2022 19:12

Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 19:01

The Italians have not had a chance to vote for years alex please stop talking bollox yourself! They have had to put up with an EU engineered technocratic government!

You are talking bollocks.

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Desmorelda · 26/09/2022 19:13

@Kissingfrogs25 so brexit is going well then ? 😂
More inclined to believe @Melassa 's version of events than a load of tory apologists who are desperate to see the EU disintegrate.

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Melassa · 26/09/2022 19:13

The Brexit shills seem to be out in force today. 🤔

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Alexandra2001 · 26/09/2022 19:15

Kissingfrogs25 · 26/09/2022 19:01

The Italians have not had a chance to vote for years alex please stop talking bollox yourself! They have had to put up with an EU engineered technocratic government!

You'll have to tell me how many Governments Italy has had in the last 75 years... any ideas?
Their last proper GE was in 2018, 4 years ago.

Bollox in deed lol !

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miltonj · 26/09/2022 19:21

I think it's a lot more to do with her stance on abortion and therapy in order to access it, rather than immigration.

But yes raisins are defo the best bit of museli and I only have Cheerios in at the moment AngryAngry

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Sgtmajormummy · 26/09/2022 19:32

Italy is going to leave the EU?????😂
The ItalExit party didn’t even get enough votes to be represented in Parliament.
The state the UK is in currently is a clear cautionary tale.

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Sgtmajormummy · 26/09/2022 19:41

I’m in one of the most staunchly right wing areas of Italy and the most hotly debated political topics are immigration, aid to the South and institutional corruption.
They keep a strong connection between right wing politics, the Catholic church (so against gay rights) and the armed forces.

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Desmorelda · 26/09/2022 19:47

The Brexit shills seem to be out in force today. 🤔
Funnily enough I've just come across one of them on another thread banging on about being an investment banker (or her DH)....says it all.

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TimeFlysWhenYoureHavingRum · 26/09/2022 19:50

The terrifying thing is how many cheerleaders she has in the UK who want the same here. Churchill is spinning in his grave.

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TooBigForMyBoots · 26/09/2022 19:55

I'm too busy reeling from our own Right Wing government to care.

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slowquickstep · 26/09/2022 20:02

jetadore · 26/09/2022 18:05

First they came for the granola…

😂

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FOJN · 26/09/2022 20:03

If your referring to Stalin, he wasn't left wing, he wasn't even a communist, he was a murderous dictator who killed anyone from either side who he deemed as a threat, including communists.

He was leader of the Communist Party, you might not like his interpretation of communism but presumably we can agree he wasn't right wing.

Joseph Stalin - Communist - estimated death toll 20 million
Mao Zedong - Communist - estimated death toll 45 million
Pol Pot - Communist - estimated death toll 2 million

I think it's reasonable to describe them all as despots but their political leanings are extreme left. When we consider Hitler too it only proves what many on this thread have already said; political extremism of any description is dangerous. My point is that extremism is not exclusive to the right of the political spectrum.

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TwoLeftSocksWithHoles · 26/09/2022 20:12

Oh no! I was convinced that Curiously Cinnamon would win it this time round.

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