V concerned about elderly neighbour

[NoFrills01]

We have a new neighbour, she is 91 and just got here from America, no family or friends, and she is renting the three story property which is over £1000+ a month.

We live in a rural area, there are buses, but still its a long walk to get around to anywhere, she obviously has no car.

She has no internet to set up a food delivery (what she wants to do) no phone, no bank account, and is struggling to work the gas cooker ect as she is from the states and things are a little different within the home.

I have a background in care, I find it a very odd situation. She seems frail, and she seems like she has early dementia to me.

I feel she is very vulnerable, I've offered to help all I can when I'm not working but she declines.

The house is the same as ours, and the stairs are steep. I'm worried we are the only ones who basically are checking in and would notice anything.

I'm not sure what to do. I think I need to gently ask a little more information, I'm worried about her health and welfare, and I'm not sure how she will keep up with bills or even pay them? It all seems so strange. She wasn't aware the bills are going up here, and she doesn't know how to work the heating and is currently just living off the microwave.

With cuts to the appropriate services this will only get worse

Police will do welfare checks on vulnerable people, there does not have to be a known injury or suspected death. But I would tend to go to social care in the first instance, not least because the police turning up as her initial contact with services would be likely to alarm her.

I would also ask her in a friendly manner whether she would like help to register with a local GP (I would not ask her whether or not she wants to register, I would imply to her that she has to).

Her response to this may tell you a lot, for example whether she is trying to (or being made to) fly under the radar for some reason, whether she is actually having cognitive problems which prevent her from understanding things, whether she has any ongoing medical needs or not. (I am not suggesting that you act on these if they arise as concerns, just that you pass on this info to appropriate services).

Thank goodness she has you as a neighbour. Well done for looking out for her.

Agree GP and adult social services - and knowing how slowly these things can move - intermittent visits and practical support as much as you feel you are able.

Could you ask her for an 'emergency contact number' in case you ever needed to reach family/friends. Do you know her full name? Unlikely she'd be on Facebook but you never know - at least you might get an idea of her family set up?

Does sound odd.

This is an excellent suggestion. Something like "When I come in on Friday to help with cooker, how about we also get you along to the GP surgery so that you can register?"

This sounds like granny dumping. Just to be safe you should contact adult services.

I understand the concern but she must be getting food from somewhere.

Family refuse to have elderly demented relatives back home because they get zero support. Families push and push for things, get promises, and then nothing. They eventually crack and when mum say has a fall, they refuse to take her back home after a hospital admission.
I care for a relative with schizophrenia. I totally understand anyone saying no more. You have no understanding at all and no one helps.

I work in elderly care and can confirm granny dumping exists.

In my experience, it's been when the person is admitted to hospital, and the family just disappear, no visits, no phone calls, no contact number for us to contact them. I can vaguely understand if it's a distant aunt with profound dementia, but in some cases, it's a much closer relative that is dumped.

All very sad.

I was a Granny dumper. It was the only way to get help for my DM when she began to wander the streets in her nightie handing money out, because her GP kept insisting she was fine. (Probably because the canny so and so used to revise for the mini mental state examination and completely pulled the wool over his eyes). Don't assume all Granny dumpers have Ill intent, they might just be at the end of their tether.

I agree that this scenario is worrying though. Hopefully Social Care can look in to it.

I often advise people to refuse to have a relative back home until an appropriate support package is in place. I do that because once someone is home social services aren’t seen for dust and you have more chance and some clout while your elderly relative is blocking a bed. There is also a big gap in services for people who have dementia and are highly active or who have become, for example distressed or aggressive. It is not realistic to expect an elderly spouse to manage.

Expect it to become worse - social care is close to collapse

what did you actually do? Dump at a&e and leave the site or something else?

@Minfilia My paediatric nurse friend told me that it’s quite common for parents to invent symptoms for their kids so they can leave them in a hospital ward and enjoy a weekend to themselves…

WOW! ☹️😢 That is heartbreaking. If my DD was in hospital I wouldn't be leaving the building. At all

Holiday period? Try permanently from the USA once the granny shows dementia symptoms! Been happening since 80s!

Bull shit.

This nurse friend has a vivid imagination or she enjoys winding you up.

And sometimes they drop gran in a care home promising a short stay then skedaddle so they can move into her house.
It's not all " ooh, but services"
Elder abuse exists.

I find it very hard to believe that you work front line adult social care and have not heard of this.

i do not work front line adult social care. Far from it in fact. And have been aware of this growing trend for years

@Cosmos123 You really think your kids would do this?

@Doingprettywellthanks

It really does happen that parents will invent or even cause symptoms in children in order to access free childcare by way of a hospital admission. It is not "common" though, the nurse is exaggerating there, they are quite extreme cases really, but I used to work in assessing parents for family court cases and I saw this multiple times. Often of course it is related to mental illness, or true desperation for social help, and so rather a different thing. But the former scenario does happen.

Mafioso nonna in hiding?

And this is one of the wrong pieces of advice. I used to be a LA manager in elder social care so oddly enough I know what I'm talking about. There is no clear evidence of abuse not is she self neglecting to SAFA standards. It's a social support issue, and you need consent to refer.

And in any case you are much, much more likely to get a good outcome than if it is sprung on her without warning

We can't tell from the OP whether she is significantly self-neglecting. If she did not have the help of the neighbour would she have access to food? How? Does she have health conditions she is not getting/complying with treatment for? etc etc

what did you actually do? Dump at a&e and leave the site or something else?

Pretty much. I'm a nurse and am ashamed to say that I used to judge people for Granny dumping and always said I'd never do it. And yet despite knowing the system, despite working with the continuing healthcare team, despite trying to put a plan in place to prevent a sudden crisis the system didn't work when it needed to.

It was complicated by the fact that I didn't live locally and had small children of my own, but there was an assumption that I could drop everything and drive 3 hours down the motorway to resolve every issue. I was getting daily phone calls from friends and neighbours who could see the problems and were desperately worried and yet her GP was a complete chocolate Tea pot.

I took her to A&E for a UTI and told them she was a safeguarding concern and couldn't be discharged alone. This finally led to a social care assessment and I got support to move her to a care home (she could self-fund). She was actually well cared for and settled well but the move was hugely more traumatic for her than it needed to be.

I'm another granny dumper.
mam0918 you don't have a clue. I coped for 7 years after my mother's death, not even time to reflect, think, grieve.

I had DC to look after, a job, my own home, my own worries, and yet there I was being kicked, harassed, shouted at, having to get out of bed in the night, tour the streets in the dark, visit the pubs, deal with the people he pissed off, clean up after his "imaginary parties" excuse his behaviour often inappropriate, listen to how other men's wives were running after him, taxi drivers stealing from him, neighbours taking stuff, and call pest control numerous times when he scratched his skin until it bled. He could "see the bugs under his skin crawling, and they crawled the walls" despite being quite blind, and there being no bugs. He introduced me to his mother, the same one that had died when he was 2 days old. He kicked my front door many times a day, threatened to hit me, he called all three emergency services one day, that was a real adventure, usually it was just one or two calls to the police or for an ambulance. I kicked the door in twice with emergency services because he had barricaded himself in, and had to speak to police when they found a revolver under his pillow, but only after he threatened to hit the copper with a spade. He was drunk, obnoxious, impossible and demented. At 96 he can still run, but his mind is mash. He rang to police making false allegations about everyone in the end, including me. Two years later I still jump out of my skin if anyone knocks o the front door, I probably have PTSD, I certainly now live with anxiety. And yet I deal with violent kids.....but they are piece of cake compared to a demented man.

YOU have NO fucking clue. Social care is on its knees. I worked for LA for years, the same LA that denied any support to my father. My story is not unusual. And the thing that pisses me off the most, I am almost 100% certain that had I been his son and not his daughter I would have succeeded in getting help for him. Your post is not just ignorant, but takes no account of the fact that its usually women having to provide care to elderly relatives and children, and even social workers, ourselves supposedly paragons of equality speak and think are sexist in the assumption that "women care"

OP make an ordinary referral to adult social care, although, in some areas they will not take you seriously unless the referral comes through another agency such as GP, hospital, Age concern or similar. They are not obliged to make any assessment. If you have specific and serious concerns regarding welfare when no assessment is offered, then raise it as safeguarding and don't hesitate to point out that the LA are failing in their duty to safeguard.